[rebel-builders] Elite elevator tip mod

[N.Smith]

Definitely worth doing - it looks better, and everyone I know who's done it
says it improves the pitch stability and makes the handling much nicer.

I'll try and dig out some pictures and send them direct to you.

Nig
745E


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Cole
Sent: 08 March 2011 22:26
To: Rebel Builders
Subject: [rebel-builders] Elite elevator tip mod

I am getting ready to modify the elevator tips of Elite 709E. What
width should I use for the aerodynamic balancing horns?

It would be a lot easier to keep the tips square instead of rounding
them as some have suggested. What are the pros and cons of rounding
versus leaving square? How does one round the tips? What radius?
Can the old ribs be used or do new ones have to be made? Do new
skins have to be made if the tips are rounded?

Thanks in advance.

Lynn Cole
Murphy Elite #709
LynnCole@foxvalley.net







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[Bob Palmer]

I don't believe that rounding the tips is needed. I have forgotten how
much we reduced the width but I can find out today.

Bob.
773E

On 3/9/2011 12:57 AM, N.Smith wrote:

Definitely worth doing - it looks better, and everyone I know who's done it
says it improves the pitch stability and makes the handling much nicer.

I'll try and dig out some pictures and send them direct to you.

Nig
745E


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Cole
Sent: 08 March 2011 22:26
To: Rebel Builders
Subject: [rebel-builders] Elite elevator tip mod

I am getting ready to modify the elevator tips of Elite 709E. What
width should I use for the aerodynamic balancing horns?

It would be a lot easier to keep the tips square instead of rounding
them as some have suggested. What are the pros and cons of rounding
versus leaving square? How does one round the tips? What radius?
Can the old ribs be used or do new ones have to be made? Do new
skins have to be made if the tips are rounded?

Thanks in advance.

Lynn Cole
Murphy Elite #709
LynnCole@foxvalley.net







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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

I cut Bob White's Elite spades in half.. worked very nicely.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Palmer" <rtpalmer@shaw.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Elite elevator tip mod

I don't believe that rounding the tips is needed. I have forgotten how
much we reduced the width but I can find out today.

Bob.
773E

On 3/9/2011 12:57 AM, N.Smith wrote:

Definitely worth doing - it looks better, and everyone I know who's done
it
says it improves the pitch stability and makes the handling much nicer.

I'll try and dig out some pictures and send them direct to you.

Nig
745E


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Lynn
Cole
Sent: 08 March 2011 22:26
To: Rebel Builders
Subject: [rebel-builders] Elite elevator tip mod

I am getting ready to modify the elevator tips of Elite 709E. What
width should I use for the aerodynamic balancing horns?

It would be a lot easier to keep the tips square instead of rounding
them as some have suggested. What are the pros and cons of rounding
versus leaving square? How does one round the tips? What radius?
Can the old ribs be used or do new ones have to be made? Do new
skins have to be made if the tips are rounded?

Thanks in advance.

Lynn Cole
Murphy Elite #709
LynnCole@foxvalley.net







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[Bob Palmer]

Just checked and our elevator spades are 4-1/4" wide for a total
elevator width of 102-3/4".

Bob.
773E





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[Lynn Cole]

Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. Your answers were
very thorough and helpful.

Lynn Cole
Murphy Elite #709
LynnCole@foxvalley.net



On Mar 8, 2011, at 4:25 PM, Lynn Cole wrote:

I am getting ready to modify the elevator tips of Elite 709E. What
width should I use for the aerodynamic balancing horns?

It would be a lot easier to keep the tips square instead of rounding
them as some have suggested. What are the pros and cons of rounding
versus leaving square? How does one round the tips? What radius?
Can the old ribs be used or do new ones have to be made? Do new
skins have to be made if the tips are rounded?

Thanks in advance.

Lynn Cole
Murphy Elite #709
LynnCole@foxvalley.net







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[NormIsler]

Lynn

I am also at the point of finishing up my elevator, and have pretty much
decided to follow a slightly different path. I have talked with a lot of
fellow aircraft builders, and also Bob P prior to this (almost) final decision.

I plan to keep the elevator its original full width. Most of the builders
I have met, read about or talked with have reduced the width of the
balancing horns by approximately 50%, reducing the width of the horizontal Stab by
almost 12" total. I plan to also reduce the spades by approximately 50%,
but by cutting down the interior edges of the horns. This will initially
leave a gap between the outer edge of the horizontal stab and the balance
horns. By adding one additional rib on each side of the horizontal Stab behind
the main spar I will extend the stab out to meet the reduced width horn with
a solid, fixed surface.

I also intend to create 4 new ribs and skins for the horns to allow the
rounded front edge that reports seem to indicate behaves better in the air.

I would be interested to hear what others on the list think of my plans.

Thanks!

Norm Isler
Elite 702E
Brockport NY

I am getting ready to modify the elevator tips of Elite 709E. What
width should I use for the aerodynamic balancing horns?

It would be a lot easier to keep the tips square instead of rounding
them as some have suggested. What are the pros and cons of rounding
versus leaving square? How does one round the tips? What radius?
Can the old ribs be used or do new ones have to be made? Do new
skins have to be made if the tips are rounded?

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[Bob Palmer]

As Wayne has mentioned, cut the spade width in half. That is, shorten
the overall horizontal stab width.

I was going to measure mine but haven't gone out to do that because the
weather has been so bad. I think we are 3" wide and have not rounded the
tips. We can do a three point landing but have not tested in the worst
case i.e. one pilot minimum fuel (full forward C of G, heavy engine ).
We have 28 degrees of up elevator travel and VGs . The only reason we
didn't us 30 deg is because we had installed the stop before we heard
the suggestion to increase up travel and so far we don't need to.

I reason that reducing the overall horizontal stab width will strengthen
it and reduce it's sensitivity at higher speeds. It will also reduce the
potential to over stress other parts of the airplane, which is a good thing.

Bob.
773E






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[craig]

Greetings All,

Can someone give me a synopsis of this Elite Horiz stab discussion? I guess
I missed it or deleted it. I have a friend who's building an Elite and I'd
like to pass it on to him. Thanks.
Craig Rebel #207 Painting cowl today :)




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Palmer" <rtpalmer@shaw.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2011 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Elite elevator tip mod

As Wayne has mentioned, cut the spade width in half. That is, shorten
the overall horizontal stab width.

I was going to measure mine but haven't gone out to do that because the
weather has been so bad. I think we are 3" wide and have not rounded the
tips. We can do a three point landing but have not tested in the worst
case i.e. one pilot minimum fuel (full forward C of G, heavy engine ).
We have 28 degrees of up elevator travel and VGs . The only reason we
didn't us 30 deg is because we had installed the stop before we heard
the suggestion to increase up travel and so far we don't need to.

I reason that reducing the overall horizontal stab width will strengthen
it and reduce it's sensitivity at higher speeds. It will also reduce the
potential to over stress other parts of the airplane, which is a good
thing.

Bob.
773E






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