912S Rebel

[Legeorgen]

Bob,

I've been coming the archives and was wondering if you ever got that 912S
Rebel on floats flying, and how it performed. Was it a 1450 gross Rebel? The
weights you quoted seem light.

How much can I expect my 320 Rebel empty weight to be if I keep it light as
possible?

Bruce G. 357R
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[Bob Patterson]

Bruce,

It's still one of my long-term ideals - maybe someday I'll
get there !! The Rebel you saw mentioned was likely the original
factory prototype, ser. # 001 - we've owned it for a long time !
It weighs 716 lb., with the 912, but we have seen several full 1,650
gross Rebels with 912's that were lighter !! (Under 600 lb was the
lightest !)

Typical 320 Rebels run about 916 to 950 lb. - avoid the
spring gear if you want to save about 28 lb. ! My O-320 Rebel
has die spring gear and a full panel, and weighs 966 lb. - a bit
heavy, but it has a Sensenich metal prop and extention that weighs
about 44 lb !!

My O-235 Rebel on bungee gear weighed 835 lb.

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:21 PM 9/8/00 EDT, you wrote:

Bob,

I've been coming the archives and was wondering if you ever got that 912S
Rebel on floats flying, and how it performed. Was it a 1450 gross Rebel? The
weights you quoted seem light.

How much can I expect my 320 Rebel empty weight to be if I keep it light as
possible?

Bruce G. 357R
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[Aurele Lavigne]

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples' heads
shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats with a
912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601 lbs on
the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years, and
nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235 or
bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is cheaper to
maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing and
what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and our
performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit, poor
visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat little
aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bruce,

It's still one of my long-term ideals - maybe someday I'll
get there !! The Rebel you saw mentioned was likely the original
factory prototype, ser. # 001 - we've owned it for a long time !
It weighs 716 lb., with the 912, but we have seen several full 1,650
gross Rebels with 912's that were lighter !! (Under 600 lb was the
lightest !)

Typical 320 Rebels run about 916 to 950 lb. - avoid the
spring gear if you want to save about 28 lb. ! My O-320 Rebel
has die spring gear and a full panel, and weighs 966 lb. - a bit
heavy, but it has a Sensenich metal prop and extention that weighs
about 44 lb !!

My O-235 Rebel on bungee gear weighed 835 lb.

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:21 PM 9/8/00 EDT, you wrote:

Bob,

I've been coming the archives and was wondering if you ever got that 912S
Rebel on floats flying, and how it performed. Was it a 1450 gross Rebel?

The

weights you quoted seem light.

How much can I expect my 320 Rebel empty weight to be if I keep it light

as

possible?

Bruce G. 357R

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[Aurele Lavigne]

Paul, you're right, it is a UL version, but as far as I know it has the same
specs as a 912 reg't, so gross is unchanged at 1450 lbs. I don't think the
modifications to leading edge and wing struts are made until a heavier power
plant is added. So, the only limit is the legal limit and since I am not
req'd to keep logs, I really don't know how heavy I have taken up. I can
tell you that 1250lbs for sure and when I did my float rating I found out
after two days of training that you had to prime the hand pump for it to
work. I then pumped out somewhere between 50 and 75 lbs out of the floats
out of both rear compartments as they had been damaged and I was unaware,
taking on water. I felt the plane was sluggish on takeoff and really sloppy
on approach, no doubt with the c of g and gross way out of wack, but it
still flew!!

As I mentioned in another note to Bruce and Bob earlier, I get reasonable
performance at an economical price. If I had the money I would probably go
to the 912S and maybe someday I will.

As a final note, your choice of prop will greatly influence the overall
performance. I fisrt started with the two blade 72" GSC, then a 3 blade Warp
Drive which is what I'm currently using and have toyed with pitch and now
have it set where I'm getting the best climb and cruise possible. I've
purchased the 3 blade Ivoprop electric adjustable and have the wiring in and
ready to install , but no time to fine tune it befoire moose hunting as
flying too much. I'm pretty sure I'm going to get improved takeoff and
cruise with this adjustable model which is what it was designed for.

Hope this helps, Aurele

P.S. Let me know if I can be of more help.


----- Original Message -----
From: "C&P Kucera" <cpkucera@idirect.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 9:19 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Hi Aurele.

Yours must be the UL version. How does it perform with two aboard, say

1250

lb gross and what is the max load you have been able to take up?

Paul Kucera
453R



----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples'

heads

shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats

with

a

912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601

lbs

on

the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years,

and

nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235

or

bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is cheaper

to

maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing

and

what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and our
performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit,

poor

visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat

little

aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bruce,

It's still one of my long-term ideals - maybe someday I'll
get there !! The Rebel you saw mentioned was likely the original
factory prototype, ser. # 001 - we've owned it for a long time !
It weighs 716 lb., with the 912, but we have seen several full 1,650
gross Rebels with 912's that were lighter !! (Under 600 lb was the
lightest !)

Typical 320 Rebels run about 916 to 950 lb. - avoid the
spring gear if you want to save about 28 lb. ! My O-320 Rebel
has die spring gear and a full panel, and weighs 966 lb. - a bit
heavy, but it has a Sensenich metal prop and extention that weighs
about 44 lb !!

My O-235 Rebel on bungee gear weighed 835 lb.

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:21 PM 9/8/00 EDT, you wrote:

912S

Rebel?

The

light

as

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[Aurele Lavigne]

Wayne, very dissapointed you did not hitch a ride to town, walk, swim,
borrow a
cell phone or something. On the plus side, if I'd been fortunate enough to
get you to the airport, you would never have gotten away for hours since I
would have insisted you do a detailed inspection of my Rebel.

You're right about the fishing on the Fushimi Lake, and would you beleive
it's so accessible. So much so, that I rarely go fishing there. If I told my
wife how good the fishing was there and how cheap it would be to get it,
she'd have a for sale sign on the bird in no time.

I do believe landing on the lake is O.K., at least I do and I will inquire
about parking and camping on the beach for a fly-in fishing trip. One
condition of course, is that I pay for your trip and you spend a couple of
extra days working on my Rebel. I'm pretty sure I could rent the local
hangar from the commercial operator at the airport. Anyways, just a thought
and I'll get back to you with more details.

I'm really mad I didn't get a chance to spoil your holiday !!!

Cheers, Aurele

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 7:22 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Hello Aurele!

I was going to get a ride in your Rebel in late July! I had it all figured
out as we traveled along HWY #11 in our Motor Home on our way back from
Manitoba, on a trip promised to be aircraft free (although my wife did

force

me to visit the Bush Plane Museum in Sault St. Marie). We would pull into
Fushimi Lake Provincial Park (great fishing by the way, but of course you
already know that!) just West of Hearst and I would "sneak" down to the
Front office, look up your phone number at the payphone and give you a

call

to "just happen" to show up at the park with your plane! I would say to my
family, "hey that Rebel with the playing cards on it is Aurele's, I must

go

down to see him"! Much to my dismay, there is no pay phone in the park (or
phone line for that matter) and we didn't have a chase car for the motor
home this time (so I couldn't run into town). Had to endure 4 days of just
fishing from Sunup to sundown on a lake that will give you your limit of
Walleye and Pike in about 30 minutes! Sure let a lot of nice fish go and

ate

our share of Walleye within the 15 to 16 inch preferred conservation size
limit!

Aurele, do they allow Float Planes to land on Fushimi Lake (seeing that it
is a Provincial park). Was thinking about trying to get some guys together
next summer for a flying/fishing holiday and that sure would be a nice

place

to go if we could beach our planes on the sand beach to the South of the
swimming area and pitch our tents there or in the group area by the fish
cleaning hut! We would all bring Bug suits though, as the black flies were

a

little wicked on shore!

Let me/us know, what you now about Fushimi Lake Provincial Park. I'm sure
there are other Rebel owners/builders that would love an excuse get out

and

enjoy a REAL use for the aircraft (or anything that they could borrow or
ride right seat in)!

Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca



----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples'

heads

shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats

with

a

912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601

lbs

on

the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years,

and

nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235

or

bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is cheaper

to

maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing

and

what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and our
performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit,

poor

visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat

little

aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bruce,

It's still one of my long-term ideals - maybe someday I'll
get there !! The Rebel you saw mentioned was likely the original
factory prototype, ser. # 001 - we've owned it for a long time !
It weighs 716 lb., with the 912, but we have seen several full 1,650
gross Rebels with 912's that were lighter !! (Under 600 lb was the
lightest !)

Typical 320 Rebels run about 916 to 950 lb. - avoid the
spring gear if you want to save about 28 lb. ! My O-320 Rebel
has die spring gear and a full panel, and weighs 966 lb. - a bit
heavy, but it has a Sensenich metal prop and extention that weighs
about 44 lb !!

My O-235 Rebel on bungee gear weighed 835 lb.

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:21 PM 9/8/00 EDT, you wrote:

912S

Rebel?

The

light

as

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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your following message has been delivered to the 164 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 19:23:04 on 12 Sep 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Hello Aurele!

I was going to get a ride in your Rebel in late July! I had it all figured
out as we traveled along HWY #11 in our Motor Home on our way back from
Manitoba, on a trip promised to be aircraft free (although my wife did force
me to visit the Bush Plane Museum in Sault St. Marie). We would pull into
Fushimi Lake Provincial Park (great fishing by the way, but of course you
already know that!) just West of Hearst and I would "sneak" down to the
Front office, look up your phone number at the payphone and give you a call
to "just happen" to show up at the park with your plane! I would say to my
family, "hey that Rebel with the playing cards on it is Aurele's, I must go
down to see him"! Much to my dismay, there is no pay phone in the park (or
phone line for that matter) and we didn't have a chase car for the motor
home this time (so I couldn't run into town). Had to endure 4 days of just
fishing from Sunup to sundown on a lake that will give you your limit of
Walleye and Pike in about 30 minutes! Sure let a lot of nice fish go and ate
our share of Walleye within the 15 to 16 inch preferred conservation size
limit!

Aurele, do they allow Float Planes to land on Fushimi Lake (seeing that it
is a Provincial park). Was thinking about trying to get some guys together
next summer for a flying/fishing holiday and that sure would be a nice place
to go if we could beach our planes on the sand beach to the South of the
swimming area and pitch our tents there or in the group area by the fish
cleaning hut! We would all bring Bug suits though, as the black flies were a
little wicked on shore!

Let me/us know, what you now about Fushimi Lake Provincial Park. I'm sure
there are other Rebel owners/builders that would love an excuse get out and
enjoy a REAL use for the aircraft (or anything that they could borrow or
ride right seat in)!

Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca



----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples' heads
shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats with

a

912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601 lbs

on

the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years, and
nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235 or
bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is cheaper to
maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing and
what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and our
performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit, poor
visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat little
aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bruce,

It's still one of my long-term ideals - maybe someday I'll
get there !! The Rebel you saw mentioned was likely the original
factory prototype, ser. # 001 - we've owned it for a long time !
It weighs 716 lb., with the 912, but we have seen several full 1,650
gross Rebels with 912's that were lighter !! (Under 600 lb was the
lightest !)

Typical 320 Rebels run about 916 to 950 lb. - avoid the
spring gear if you want to save about 28 lb. ! My O-320 Rebel
has die spring gear and a full panel, and weighs 966 lb. - a bit
heavy, but it has a Sensenich metal prop and extention that weighs
about 44 lb !!

My O-235 Rebel on bungee gear weighed 835 lb.

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:21 PM 9/8/00 EDT, you wrote:

Bob,

I've been coming the archives and was wondering if you ever got that

912S

Rebel on floats flying, and how it performed. Was it a 1450 gross

Rebel?

The

weights you quoted seem light.

How much can I expect my 320 Rebel empty weight to be if I keep it

light

as

possible?

Bruce G. 357R

*--------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Archives located at:
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[Bob Patterson]

Thanks, Aurele !

I know that your Rebel is a GREAT performer - it was impressive
right from the first flight. We flew it through the Rockies when it
only had 6 hours on it - with NO problems !! I remember that it took
off in about twice its own length, and climbed 1,000 fpm, with 2 of
us aboard .... all on 3 gallons an hour of Shell Gold car gas !!

Having tried an O-235-C2-C on Amphibs, I'd say you would be
much better off with the 912S !! It's over 100 lb. lighter, burns
less fuel, and no oil !

Glad to hear you're enjoying your Rebel !!

.....bobp

---------------------------------orig.----------------------------------
At 07:09 PM 9/11/00 -0400, you wrote:

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples' heads
shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats with a
912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601 lbs on
the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years, and
nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235 or
bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is cheaper to
maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing and
what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and our
performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit, poor
visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat little
aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bruce,

It's still one of my long-term ideals - maybe someday I'll
get there !! The Rebel you saw mentioned was likely the original
factory prototype, ser. # 001 - we've owned it for a long time !
It weighs 716 lb., with the 912, but we have seen several full 1,650
gross Rebels with 912's that were lighter !! (Under 600 lb was the
lightest !)

Typical 320 Rebels run about 916 to 950 lb. - avoid the
spring gear if you want to save about 28 lb. ! My O-320 Rebel
has die spring gear and a full panel, and weighs 966 lb. - a bit
heavy, but it has a Sensenich metal prop and extention that weighs
about 44 lb !!

My O-235 Rebel on bungee gear weighed 835 lb.

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:21 PM 9/8/00 EDT, you wrote:

Bob,

I've been coming the archives and was wondering if you ever got that 912S
Rebel on floats flying, and how it performed. Was it a 1450 gross Rebel?

The

weights you quoted seem light.

How much can I expect my 320 Rebel empty weight to be if I keep it light

as

possible?

Bruce G. 357R

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[C&P Kucera]

Hi Aurele.

Yours must be the UL version. How does it perform with two aboard, say 1250
lb gross and what is the max load you have been able to take up?

Paul Kucera
453R



----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples' heads
shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats with

a

912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601 lbs

on

the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years, and
nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235 or
bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is cheaper to
maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing and
what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and our
performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit, poor
visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat little
aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bruce,

It's still one of my long-term ideals - maybe someday I'll
get there !! The Rebel you saw mentioned was likely the original
factory prototype, ser. # 001 - we've owned it for a long time !
It weighs 716 lb., with the 912, but we have seen several full 1,650
gross Rebels with 912's that were lighter !! (Under 600 lb was the
lightest !)

Typical 320 Rebels run about 916 to 950 lb. - avoid the
spring gear if you want to save about 28 lb. ! My O-320 Rebel
has die spring gear and a full panel, and weighs 966 lb. - a bit
heavy, but it has a Sensenich metal prop and extention that weighs
about 44 lb !!

My O-235 Rebel on bungee gear weighed 835 lb.

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:21 PM 9/8/00 EDT, you wrote:

Bob,

I've been coming the archives and was wondering if you ever got that

912S

Rebel on floats flying, and how it performed. Was it a 1450 gross

Rebel?

The

weights you quoted seem light.

How much can I expect my 320 Rebel empty weight to be if I keep it

light

as

possible?

Bruce G. 357R

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[Aurele Lavigne]

Wayne, I'll get back to you as soon as possible on this. Leaving for moose
hunt on Friday or Saturday depending on weather, only 30 minutes away, butr
still weather has to cooperate. While we would be charged for camping at the
park no doubt there are some nice conveniences, such as road access,
flushing toilets, showers etc. Of course my front yard is out of the
question, besides the hydro lines prevent any chance of a safe landing
anyways.

Talk to ypou soon.

Aurele

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2000 6:39 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Aurele, I had a cell phone but it had no signal in the park! Daughter had

an

8 pound pike follow her hook right to the boat and when she pulled the

hook

out of the water, the pike continued the projectile path and ended up
jumping right onto the side rail of the boat, then spun around and fell
back in the lake! Scared the shi* out of her and I laughed for hours!!!!

Would appreciate you looking in to it (parking on the beach at Fushimi

that

is) or is there a better place in your area where the fishing is as good,
level spots for some tents and we wouldn't be charged for camping?? (other
than your front yard or your wife would definitely make you sell the

plane!)

Let me know. Who knows, the trip may never happen, but there seems to be a
lot of Rebels getting on floats and your neck of the woods seems like a

good

place to enjoy them!! I might need to bum a right seat spot myself, as I
believe the amphib I am currently refurbing and refining is speculatively
sold! I guess I better make up my mind if I want a float plane before it's
too late and the guy shows up with the $95 grand!!!! I could always build

a

set of floats for mine I guess, but I would sooner have one Rebel in

<EACH>

configuration and don't know where I would find 500 hours to build a set

for

myself!

Blue skies,
Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Wayne, very dissapointed you did not hitch a ride to town, walk, swim,
borrow a
cell phone or something. On the plus side, if I'd been fortunate enough

to

get you to the airport, you would never have gotten away for hours since

I

would have insisted you do a detailed inspection of my Rebel.

You're right about the fishing on the Fushimi Lake, and would you

beleive

it's so accessible. So much so, that I rarely go fishing there. If I

told

my

wife how good the fishing was there and how cheap it would be to get it,
she'd have a for sale sign on the bird in no time.

I do believe landing on the lake is O.K., at least I do and I will

inquire

about parking and camping on the beach for a fly-in fishing trip. One
condition of course, is that I pay for your trip and you spend a couple

of

extra days working on my Rebel. I'm pretty sure I could rent the local
hangar from the commercial operator at the airport. Anyways, just a

thought

and I'll get back to you with more details.

I'm really mad I didn't get a chance to spoil your holiday !!!

Cheers, Aurele

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 7:22 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Hello Aurele!

I was going to get a ride in your Rebel in late July! I had it all

figured

out as we traveled along HWY #11 in our Motor Home on our way back

from

Manitoba, on a trip promised to be aircraft free (although my wife did

force

me to visit the Bush Plane Museum in Sault St. Marie). We would pull

into

Fushimi Lake Provincial Park (great fishing by the way, but of course

you

already know that!) just West of Hearst and I would "sneak" down to

the

Front office, look up your phone number at the payphone and give you a

call

to "just happen" to show up at the park with your plane! I would say

to

my

family, "hey that Rebel with the playing cards on it is Aurele's, I

must

go

down to see him"! Much to my dismay, there is no pay phone in the park

(or

phone line for that matter) and we didn't have a chase car for the

motor

home this time (so I couldn't run into town). Had to endure 4 days of

just

fishing from Sunup to sundown on a lake that will give you your limit

of

Walleye and Pike in about 30 minutes! Sure let a lot of nice fish go

and

ate

our share of Walleye within the 15 to 16 inch preferred conservation

size

limit!

Aurele, do they allow Float Planes to land on Fushimi Lake (seeing

that

it

is a Provincial park). Was thinking about trying to get some guys

together

next summer for a flying/fishing holiday and that sure would be a nice

place

to go if we could beach our planes on the sand beach to the South of

the

swimming area and pitch our tents there or in the group area by the

fish

cleaning hut! We would all bring Bug suits though, as the black flies

were

a

little wicked on shore!

Let me/us know, what you now about Fushimi Lake Provincial Park. I'm

sure

there are other Rebel owners/builders that would love an excuse get

out

and

enjoy a REAL use for the aircraft (or anything that they could borrow

or

ride right seat in)!

Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca



----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

heads

floats

with

a

601

lbs

on

you

years,

and

0-235

or

cheaper

to

doing

and

our

cockpit,

poor

space.

little

I'll

1,650

the

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------

that

912S Rebel?

it

light

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[Legeorgen]

Aurele,

Ditto! I have to agree completely with you comparisons of the Rebel and
Kitfox 912s. I've got 136 hours on my Kitfox and love the way it flies and
performs, but the cabin is a bit cramped and the cargo is only 50 lb. (if you
can fit that much in it). I have to admit the larger Kitfox 6 has a 150 lb.
cargo load but empty weight is 150 lb. more and performance with a 912
suffers accordingly. So build them light!

I'm looking forward to flying my Rebel for a real comparison, but I can
already tell you, I know I'll appreciate the room and cargo space of the
Rebel, even at an increase in the operating costs.

Bruce G 357R
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[Legeorgen]

Aurele and bob,

Keep talking about how economical your 912 is, how light, and what great
performance you get, I'm sure I'll have to pull the 912S off my Kitfox and
stick it on the Rebel (when I get it all built) and save myself a ton of
money.

Bruce G. 357R
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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

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Your following message has been delivered to the 164 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 14:14:53 on 13 Sep 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------


JUST A WORD OF CAUTION!!!

The Rebel UL version is the same airframe throughout (.020 skins) as the
1650 Rebel except you cut the lower two carrythrough tubes in half to save
weight. BUT ALSO THOUGH, the main wing spar is only .050" instead of .063
and the rear spar is full of large lightening holes (to let the mice in!) as
opposed to the solid one on the full blow Rebel. The wing "lift" struts are
also Squashed 3" diameter light wall tube as opposed to the extruded
streamline strut on the 1650 Rebel. Don't get too carried away with
overloading it, as the advance ultralight version by Transport Canada
requirements is only allowed 1058lbs on wheels and 1212lbs on floats. I
don't know what MAM's real numbers for 6g's are!, but probably only 1250 to
1300LBS. The one I built and sold came out at 648lbs empty on wheels (had
aluminum tail feathers instead of fabric) so only a "legal" useful load of
410lbs.

Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 1:10 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Paul, you're right, it is a UL version, but as far as I know it has the

same

specs as a 912 reg't, so gross is unchanged at 1450 lbs. I don't think the
modifications to leading edge and wing struts are made until a heavier

power


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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

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Your following message has been delivered to the 164 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 18:40:26 on 13 Sep 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Aurele, I had a cell phone but it had no signal in the park! Daughter had an
8 pound pike follow her hook right to the boat and when she pulled the hook
out of the water, the pike continued the projectile path and ended up
jumping right onto the side rail of the boat, then spun around and fell
back in the lake! Scared the shi* out of her and I laughed for hours!!!!

Would appreciate you looking in to it (parking on the beach at Fushimi that
is) or is there a better place in your area where the fishing is as good,
level spots for some tents and we wouldn't be charged for camping?? (other
than your front yard or your wife would definitely make you sell the plane!)
Let me know. Who knows, the trip may never happen, but there seems to be a
lot of Rebels getting on floats and your neck of the woods seems like a good
place to enjoy them!! I might need to bum a right seat spot myself, as I
believe the amphib I am currently refurbing and refining is speculatively
sold! I guess I better make up my mind if I want a float plane before it's
too late and the guy shows up with the $95 grand!!!! I could always build a
set of floats for mine I guess, but I would sooner have one Rebel in <EACH>
configuration and don't know where I would find 500 hours to build a set for
myself!

Blue skies,
Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Wayne, very dissapointed you did not hitch a ride to town, walk, swim,
borrow a
cell phone or something. On the plus side, if I'd been fortunate enough to
get you to the airport, you would never have gotten away for hours since I
would have insisted you do a detailed inspection of my Rebel.

You're right about the fishing on the Fushimi Lake, and would you beleive
it's so accessible. So much so, that I rarely go fishing there. If I told

my

wife how good the fishing was there and how cheap it would be to get it,
she'd have a for sale sign on the bird in no time.

I do believe landing on the lake is O.K., at least I do and I will inquire
about parking and camping on the beach for a fly-in fishing trip. One
condition of course, is that I pay for your trip and you spend a couple of
extra days working on my Rebel. I'm pretty sure I could rent the local
hangar from the commercial operator at the airport. Anyways, just a

thought

and I'll get back to you with more details.

I'm really mad I didn't get a chance to spoil your holiday !!!

Cheers, Aurele

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 7:22 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Hello Aurele!

I was going to get a ride in your Rebel in late July! I had it all

figured

out as we traveled along HWY #11 in our Motor Home on our way back from
Manitoba, on a trip promised to be aircraft free (although my wife did

force

me to visit the Bush Plane Museum in Sault St. Marie). We would pull

into

Fushimi Lake Provincial Park (great fishing by the way, but of course

you

already know that!) just West of Hearst and I would "sneak" down to the
Front office, look up your phone number at the payphone and give you a

call

to "just happen" to show up at the park with your plane! I would say to

my

family, "hey that Rebel with the playing cards on it is Aurele's, I must

go

down to see him"! Much to my dismay, there is no pay phone in the park

(or

phone line for that matter) and we didn't have a chase car for the motor
home this time (so I couldn't run into town). Had to endure 4 days of

just

fishing from Sunup to sundown on a lake that will give you your limit of
Walleye and Pike in about 30 minutes! Sure let a lot of nice fish go and

ate

our share of Walleye within the 15 to 16 inch preferred conservation

size

limit!

Aurele, do they allow Float Planes to land on Fushimi Lake (seeing that

it

is a Provincial park). Was thinking about trying to get some guys

together

next summer for a flying/fishing holiday and that sure would be a nice

place

to go if we could beach our planes on the sand beach to the South of the
swimming area and pitch our tents there or in the group area by the fish
cleaning hut! We would all bring Bug suits though, as the black flies

were

a

little wicked on shore!

Let me/us know, what you now about Fushimi Lake Provincial Park. I'm

sure

there are other Rebel owners/builders that would love an excuse get out

and

enjoy a REAL use for the aircraft (or anything that they could borrow or
ride right seat in)!

Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca



----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples'

heads

shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats

with

a

912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601

lbs

on

the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years,

and

nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235

or

bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is

cheaper

to

maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing

and

what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and

our

performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit,

poor

visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo

space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat

little

aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------

that

912S

Rebel?

The

light

as

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[Bob Patterson]

Sounds like a good plan, to me !! :-)

....bobp

-----------------------------orig.-------------------------------------
At 01:52 AM 9/13/00 EDT, you wrote:

Aurele and bob,

Keep talking about how economical your 912 is, how light, and what great
performance you get, I'm sure I'll have to pull the 912S off my Kitfox and
stick it on the Rebel (when I get it all built) and save myself a ton of
money.

Bruce G. 357R
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[C&P Kucera]

Thanks Aurele. The performance you describe sounds good to me, and yes, with
the adjustable prop it will be significantly better. Last summer I met a
builder with a 912 Kitfox on gorgeous glass amphibs with an inflight
adjustable prop. Taking off on water with two aboard was a piece of cake.

Now, flying a moose in a Rebel,.......that would turn heads........

Have fun!

Paul

----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 1:10 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Paul, you're right, it is a UL version, but as far as I know it has the

same

specs as a 912 reg't, so gross is unchanged at 1450 lbs. I don't think the
modifications to leading edge and wing struts are made until a heavier

power

plant is added. So, the only limit is the legal limit and since I am not
req'd to keep logs, I really don't know how heavy I have taken up. I can
tell you that 1250lbs for sure and when I did my float rating I found out
after two days of training that you had to prime the hand pump for it to
work. I then pumped out somewhere between 50 and 75 lbs out of the floats
out of both rear compartments as they had been damaged and I was unaware,
taking on water. I felt the plane was sluggish on takeoff and really

sloppy

on approach, no doubt with the c of g and gross way out of wack, but it
still flew!!

As I mentioned in another note to Bruce and Bob earlier, I get reasonable
performance at an economical price. If I had the money I would probably go
to the 912S and maybe someday I will.

As a final note, your choice of prop will greatly influence the overall
performance. I fisrt started with the two blade 72" GSC, then a 3 blade

Warp

Drive which is what I'm currently using and have toyed with pitch and now
have it set where I'm getting the best climb and cruise possible. I've
purchased the 3 blade Ivoprop electric adjustable and have the wiring in

and

ready to install , but no time to fine tune it befoire moose hunting as
flying too much. I'm pretty sure I'm going to get improved takeoff and
cruise with this adjustable model which is what it was designed for.

Hope this helps, Aurele

P.S. Let me know if I can be of more help.


----- Original Message -----
From: "C&P Kucera" <cpkucera@idirect.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2000 9:19 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Hi Aurele.

Yours must be the UL version. How does it perform with two aboard, say

1250

lb gross and what is the max load you have been able to take up?

Paul Kucera
453R



----- Original Message -----
From: "Aurele Lavigne" <alavigne@ntl.sympatico.ca>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

Bob, Bruce, had to jump in with my two cents as I often get peoples'

heads

shaking in disbelief when they hear that I'm flying a Rebel on floats

with

a

912 !!! Mine is serial # 063 and it came in at an empty weight of 601

lbs

on

the scales at Chilliwack, BC. Bob you're familiar with this one as you
originally flew it back from the factory to Northern Ontario for the
original owner.

Just to add to this, I now have over 160 hours in the last two years,

and

nearly 50% on floats. I sure would like a 912S or even better an 0-235

or

bigger yet but I can do pretty much everything I like and it is

cheaper

to

maintain and fly. It boils down to what type of flying you'll be doing

and

what you can afford and this is all I can afford.

I have a friend nearby with a Kitfox 1V and 912 on Lotus floats and

our

performances are very similar except he has less room in the cockpit,

poor

visibility when taxiing on wheels or skis, and very little cargo

space.

Just my two cents, I know I'm getting bius also, but it is a grewat

little

aircraft.

Aurele Lavigne
Rebel 063




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: "Murphy Rebel Builders List" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: 912S Rebel

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------

that

912S

Rebel?

The

light

as

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