Prop bolts

[Bill Delcambre]

Murray,

Several years ago, I used some grade 8 bolts to mount a prop on my 912
equipped Kitfox. Details are real fuzzy, due to the time elapsed, but I can
say that the plane is still flying with those bolts, at least 5 years later.

One man's experience.

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray and Carol Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:35 PM
Subject: prop bolts

Hello All

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for prop attachment? An AME said this would

be

OK for a homebuilt.Should I report the AME or use these lesser $$$$$$

bolts

being there not aircraft hardware.

Thanks
Murray

note: I finally got my engine.If my wife's whims would't keep dettering

me,

I will be flying this summer.Any suggestions to keep the other half at bay
for a while????

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[Brian Lawson]

Hey Murray,

My wife finds Paris quite appealing at this time of year. 6 months
there should do it.

Take care.

Brian Lawson,
Windsor, Ontario.
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
On Mon, 05 May 2003 12:35:50 -0700, you wrote:

Hello All

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for prop attachment? An AME said this

would be

OK for a homebuilt.Should I report the AME or use these lesser $$$$$$

bolts

being there not aircraft hardware.

Thanks
Murray

note: I finally got my engine.If my wife's whims would't keep dettering

me,

I will be flying this summer.Any suggestions to keep the other half at

bay

for a while????



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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

The only concern I have with Grade 8 bolts is that they don't deform before
breaking. Yes they are stronger, but being so makes them brittle in my
opinion. They just snap off. AN prop bolts are basically grade 5 bolts and
they will yield (bend) somewhat before they break to let you know something
is amiss.

Buy the wife a nice convertible "vette" to toot town in and get the boys
looking her way! Make sure it's a standard with loud side pipes so they can
really hear her coming!! (worked for me!!)

Wayne O'Shea
oifa@irishfield.on.ca
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Delcambre" <bdelcambre@cox-internet.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 3:00 PM
Subject: Re: prop bolts

Murray,

Several years ago, I used some grade 8 bolts to mount a prop on my 912
equipped Kitfox. Details are real fuzzy, due to the time elapsed, but I

can

say that the plane is still flying with those bolts, at least 5 years

later.

One man's experience.

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray and Carol Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:35 PM
Subject: prop bolts

Hello All

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for prop attachment? An AME said this

would

be

OK for a homebuilt.Should I report the AME or use these lesser $$$$$$

bolts

being there not aircraft hardware.

Thanks
Murray

note: I finally got my engine.If my wife's whims would't keep dettering

me,

I will be flying this summer.Any suggestions to keep the other half at

bay

for a while????

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[Walter Klatt]

Murray, about 6 months I was looking for prop bolts and
came across these people. They were very well priced
compared to the Sensenich factory and others. In the
end, I found a cheap used set, but here's the link if
you want to contact them.
http://www.geocities.com/sabermfg/

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com
[mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 12:14 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: prop bolts


The only concern I have with Grade 8 bolts
is that they don't deform before
breaking. Yes they are stronger, but being
so makes them brittle in my
opinion. They just snap off. AN prop bolts
are basically grade 5 bolts and
they will yield (bend) somewhat before they
break to let you know something
is amiss.

Buy the wife a nice convertible "vette" to
toot town in and get the boys
looking her way! Make sure it's a standard
with loud side pipes so they can
really hear her coming!! (worked for me!!)

Wayne O'Shea
oifa@irishfield.on.ca
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Delcambre" <bdelcambre@cox-internet.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 3:00 PM
Subject: Re: prop bolts

Murray,

Several years ago, I used some grade 8

bolts to mount a prop on my 912

equipped Kitfox. Details are real fuzzy,

due to the time elapsed, but I
can

say that the plane is still flying with

those bolts, at least 5 years
later.

One man's experience.

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray and Carol Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:35 PM
Subject: prop bolts

Hello All

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for prop

attachment? An AME said this
would

be

OK for a homebuilt.Should I report the

AME or use these lesser $$$$$$

bolts

being there not aircraft hardware.

Thanks
Murray

note: I finally got my engine.If my

wife's whims would't keep dettering

me,

I will be flying this summer.Any

suggestions to keep the other half at
bay

for a while????

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[Murray and Carol Cherkas]

Thanks Walter I'll let you know how I make out.

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Walter Klatt
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 4:55 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: prop bolts


Murray, about 6 months I was looking for prop bolts and
came across these people. They were very well priced
compared to the Sensenich factory and others. In the
end, I found a cheap used set, but here's the link if
you want to contact them.
http://www.geocities.com/sabermfg/

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com
[mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 12:14 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: prop bolts


The only concern I have with Grade 8 bolts
is that they don't deform before
breaking. Yes they are stronger, but being
so makes them brittle in my
opinion. They just snap off. AN prop bolts
are basically grade 5 bolts and
they will yield (bend) somewhat before they
break to let you know something
is amiss.

Buy the wife a nice convertible "vette" to
toot town in and get the boys
looking her way! Make sure it's a standard
with loud side pipes so they can
really hear her coming!! (worked for me!!)

Wayne O'Shea
oifa@irishfield.on.ca
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Delcambre" <bdelcambre@cox-internet.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 3:00 PM
Subject: Re: prop bolts

Murray,

Several years ago, I used some grade 8

bolts to mount a prop on my 912

equipped Kitfox. Details are real fuzzy,

due to the time elapsed, but I
can

say that the plane is still flying with

those bolts, at least 5 years
later.

One man's experience.

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray and Carol Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:35 PM
Subject: prop bolts

Hello All

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for prop

attachment? An AME said this
would

be

OK for a homebuilt.Should I report the

AME or use these lesser $$$$$$

bolts

being there not aircraft hardware.

Thanks
Murray

note: I finally got my engine.If my

wife's whims would't keep dettering

me,

I will be flying this summer.Any

suggestions to keep the other half at
bay

for a while????

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[carol and murray cherkas]

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for the prop with success. I just
added a 1" spacer and need new bolts. Please give me your thoughts.

Thanks
Murray



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[Gary Gustafson]

I would be interested in your reasons for adding a 1" spacer. I assume
that you mounted the prop without any spacer in the first place. I am
at that decision point and am about to order bolts. I was going to
go without a spacer. Anyone out there have some information as to why
Murphy and Sensenich recommend a 2" spacer? My prop (Sensenich) fits
on my cowling with about the same clearance as on an RV6.
Gary Gustafson #242

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of carol
and murray cherkas
Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 10:49 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: prop bolts

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for the prop with success. I just
added a 1" spacer and need new bolts. Please give me your thoughts.

Thanks
Murray



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[Ken]

This has come up before in the archives and I think W. thought gr.5
bolts might be a better choice. In fine thread they may not be much
cheaper than AN though and it may be more difficult to get the grip
length correct. I think I'd ask on the RAH newsgroup if I was thinking
about doing this. Seems to me I've heard that prop bolts are just AN
bolts with extra drill holes?? Might have read something like that in
the ASS catalog.
Ken

carol and murray cherkas wrote:

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for the prop with success. I just
added a 1" spacer and need new bolts. Please give me your thoughts.

Thanks
Murray

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[carol and murray cherkas]

Gary:

I cut my firewall back 3" and made a 4 door cowl. This could be a long story
about what I ordered and what was available at the time. I have a Thorp
nosebowl.With this setup without a spacer the backing plate for the spinner
is behind the face of the nosebowl. You therefore have to cut a big enough
hole in the nosebowl for this to fit in plus alowing for clearance.This does
not look the greatest being able to see a dark ring around the spinner which
is the clearence space. To overcome this I had a 1" spacer made at a prop
shop. This now allows for the spinner to be in front of the nosebowl where
it should be.I then filled in the hole in the nosebowl with fibreglass to
behind the spinner. This now looks great. As it should be.

I called a few local suppliers for prop bolts. None in stock but if they
were they would be between $250 and $400.Robbery
I called Spruce today and they had 6 bolts the right length. AN6H-53 $8:95 a
bolt so I ordered them. The shipping will cost more than the bolts. UPS
express.For under a $100 bucks I now have prop bolts. A good day.

Murray

Thanks Ken also for the reply.





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[Walter Klatt]

You're lucky to get those bolts, Murray. I remember having the
same problem when I mounted my Sensenich with the spacer. I
called all the local prop shops, but no luck with my size. I
finally ended up getting some locally from the Chilliwack
boneyard. But I do recall going through the discussion here on
this list a couple of years back, and it was suggested finding
good quality grade 5 bolts instead of grade eights. If you use AN
bolts, you need to be real careful at getting the right lengths,
because they have less thread than the normal prop bolts. But I
agree, prop bolts from the prop manufacturers are worse than
highway robbery.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com
[mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
carol and murray cherkas
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 7:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: prop bolts


Gary:

I cut my firewall back 3" and made a 4 door cowl. This
could be a long story
about what I ordered and what was available at the
time. I have a Thorp
nosebowl.With this setup without a spacer the backing
plate for the spinner
is behind the face of the nosebowl. You therefore have
to cut a big enough
hole in the nosebowl for this to fit in plus alowing
for clearance.This does
not look the greatest being able to see a dark ring
around the spinner which
is the clearence space. To overcome this I had a 1"
spacer made at a prop
shop. This now allows for the spinner to be in front
of the nosebowl where
it should be.I then filled in the hole in the nosebowl
with fibreglass to
behind the spinner. This now looks great. As it should be.

I called a few local suppliers for prop bolts. None in
stock but if they
were they would be between $250 and $400.Robbery
I called Spruce today and they had 6 bolts the right
length. AN6H-53 $8:95 a
bolt so I ordered them. The shipping will cost more
than the bolts. UPS
express.For under a $100 bucks I now have prop bolts.
A good day.

Murray

Thanks Ken also for the reply.





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[steve whitenect]

I've always used plain AN bolts and drilled one hole thru the head. Can't
see the need for the three. Be very sure u have the right thread length and
the shank does not botton against the flange bushing. You will flatten the
threads on the bolt the next time u remove it.

Steve W.

From: Walter Klatt <Walter.Klatt@shaw.ca>
Reply-To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: prop bolts
Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 21:28:13 -0700

You're lucky to get those bolts, Murray. I remember having the
same problem when I mounted my Sensenich with the spacer. I
called all the local prop shops, but no luck with my size. I
finally ended up getting some locally from the Chilliwack
boneyard. But I do recall going through the discussion here on
this list a couple of years back, and it was suggested finding
good quality grade 5 bolts instead of grade eights. If you use AN
bolts, you need to be real careful at getting the right lengths,
because they have less thread than the normal prop bolts. But I
agree, prop bolts from the prop manufacturers are worse than
highway robbery.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com
[mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
carol and murray cherkas
Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 7:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: prop bolts


Gary:

I cut my firewall back 3" and made a 4 door cowl. This
could be a long story
about what I ordered and what was available at the
time. I have a Thorp
nosebowl.With this setup without a spacer the backing
plate for the spinner
is behind the face of the nosebowl. You therefore have
to cut a big enough
hole in the nosebowl for this to fit in plus alowing
for clearance.This does
not look the greatest being able to see a dark ring
around the spinner which
is the clearence space. To overcome this I had a 1"
spacer made at a prop
shop. This now allows for the spinner to be in front
of the nosebowl where
it should be.I then filled in the hole in the nosebowl
with fibreglass to
behind the spinner. This now looks great. As it should be.

I called a few local suppliers for prop bolts. None in
stock but if they
were they would be between $250 and $400.Robbery
I called Spruce today and they had 6 bolts the right
length. AN6H-53 $8:95 a
bolt so I ordered them. The shipping will cost more
than the bolts. UPS
express.For under a $100 bucks I now have prop bolts.
A good day.

Murray

Thanks Ken also for the reply.





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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Grade 8 bolts are too hard IMHO. Instead of bending, they will shear and
that's not a good thing. Normal AN bolts of 125,000 psi (grade 5 basically)
are the norm. Just be very careful on thread depth using washers for
adjustment. Very fine line between enough engagement and bottoming the
threads. Refurbed a Rebel a few years back that went to Maui, found the tell
tail black rub marks on the prop hub. Bolts where torqued to spec but just
happened to be bottomed about the same time they hit the hub face. Prop was
working on the flange and thank god never let go when I shuttled it home.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "carol and murray cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 10:48 PM
Subject: prop bolts

Has anyone used grade 8 bolts for the prop with success. I just
added a 1" spacer and need new bolts. Please give me your thoughts.

Thanks
Murray



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[carol and murray cherkas]

I
FYI

have found out that the AN bolts are now the standard prop bolt. With
about 9/16" thread I called the prop shop here and asked if it would
harm the bolt to thread it some more. They said no as long as you really
cleaned the the threads. I also paid particular attention to the last
thread and filled it a little to get rid of the burr.

Murray



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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

TTBOMK threads are rolled on AN bolts so yes be sure to make sure you really
clean them up. I wouldn't have taken their advice myself, but sounds like
you used a high quality die and took your time to be sure the threads are
clean.

I know, I know...go back in to hiding you bugger!

Cheers,
Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "carol and murray cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 8:10 PM
Subject: prop bolts

I
FYI

have found out that the AN bolts are now the standard prop bolt. With
about 9/16" thread I called the prop shop here and asked if it would
harm the bolt to thread it some more. They said no as long as you really
cleaned the the threads. I also paid particular attention to the last
thread and filled it a little to get rid of the burr.

Murray



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[carol and murray cherkas]

Wayne:
I threaded them about 1/4" so that they wouldn't bottom on the threads in
order to get as much thread grip as possible.

Murray





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