Air Start and the M-14

[Ryan Mowat]

Hey Guys,

The air start system can be a huge pain until you get all the bugs out
of it. The Kimball system that I received had the wrong solenoid on it
and it was just too slow - it turned out the correct solenoid was placed
on the bypass and once I swapped them I have no starting issues. The
slow farting sound is just a dirty solenoid - happens to me about every
100 hours and I just clean the solenoid and away we go.

The other critical item for starting the M14 is preheat - in cold
weather a good 1 hour pre heat with an electrical 1500 watt heater does
wonders. I do not have this at the cabin - but starting is still good
now that the air start solenoid is sorted out.

If anyone has specific questions my cell is 604 897 4101. I was mad at
the thing for the firs 50 hours of flying, now no issues. A good start
can happen at 235 psi with it all working right. At 700 psi I can taxi
on the water :)

Ryan Mowat

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Andrews
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 6:30 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Air Start and Floats

Hey Ryan, have you ever had to prop start while on the water?

Bob e612

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:50 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and Floats


Guess you could stand on a 2" x 12" plank BEHIND the engine!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:46 PM
Subject: Air Start and Floats

Hum, hadn't thought of that. That would be interesting indeed!

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:43 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: M-14 Kimball air start system question


Would be really "FUN" if you were on floats now wouldn't it !?




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[Scott Aldrich]

Interesting.. I had no idea there was any difference in the solenoids? I
purchased the solenoids from Kimball's but not the plumbed package so have
no idea which is which?
Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ryan
Mowat
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 8:08 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Air Start and the M-14

Hey Guys,

The air start system can be a huge pain until you get all the bugs out
of it. The Kimball system that I received had the wrong solenoid on it
and it was just too slow - it turned out the correct solenoid was placed
on the bypass and once I swapped them I have no starting issues. The
slow farting sound is just a dirty solenoid - happens to me about every
100 hours and I just clean the solenoid and away we go.

The other critical item for starting the M14 is preheat - in cold
weather a good 1 hour pre heat with an electrical 1500 watt heater does
wonders. I do not have this at the cabin - but starting is still good
now that the air start solenoid is sorted out.

If anyone has specific questions my cell is 604 897 4101. I was mad at
the thing for the firs 50 hours of flying, now no issues. A good start
can happen at 235 psi with it all working right. At 700 psi I can taxi
on the water :)

Ryan Mowat

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Andrews
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 6:30 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Air Start and Floats

Hey Ryan, have you ever had to prop start while on the water?

Bob e612

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:50 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and Floats


Guess you could stand on a 2" x 12" plank BEHIND the engine!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:46 PM
Subject: Air Start and Floats

Hum, hadn't thought of that. That would be interesting indeed!

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:43 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: M-14 Kimball air start system question


Would be really "FUN" if you were on floats now wouldn't it !?




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[Dick Shotwell]

When Ryan first mentioned the solenoid problem (that they could be reversed)
I called Kimball. They said that the two solenoids were the same. So I
have not tried the reversal procedure. Then when I made the direct
connection to the tank and the cranking was still slow, I decided the
problem was not the solenoid. It will be interesting to see how this thread
develops.
Dick Shotwell
Moose 096
N235DS
Twin Falls, ID


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Aldrich" <sa@mwutah.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 23:41 PM
Subject: RE: Air Start and the M-14

Interesting.. I had no idea there was any difference in the solenoids? I
purchased the solenoids from Kimball's but not the plumbed package so have
no idea which is which?
Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ryan
Mowat
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 8:08 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Air Start and the M-14

Hey Guys,

The air start system can be a huge pain until you get all the bugs out
of it. The Kimball system that I received had the wrong solenoid on it
and it was just too slow - it turned out the correct solenoid was placed
on the bypass and once I swapped them I have no starting issues. The
slow farting sound is just a dirty solenoid - happens to me about every
100 hours and I just clean the solenoid and away we go.

The other critical item for starting the M14 is preheat - in cold
weather a good 1 hour pre heat with an electrical 1500 watt heater does
wonders. I do not have this at the cabin - but starting is still good
now that the air start solenoid is sorted out.

If anyone has specific questions my cell is 604 897 4101. I was mad at
the thing for the firs 50 hours of flying, now no issues. A good start
can happen at 235 psi with it all working right. At 700 psi I can taxi
on the water :)

Ryan Mowat

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Andrews
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 6:30 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Air Start and Floats

Hey Ryan, have you ever had to prop start while on the water?

Bob e612

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:50 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and Floats


Guess you could stand on a 2" x 12" plank BEHIND the engine!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:46 PM
Subject: Air Start and Floats

Hum, hadn't thought of that. That would be interesting indeed!

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:43 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: M-14 Kimball air start system question


Would be really "FUN" if you were on floats now wouldn't it !?




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[Scott Aldrich]

If they are the same and swapping fixed Ryan's I would be inclined to try
that first. Wondering if the solenoids are gunking up, maybe we need the
air filters and snot valves after all??

Ted, do I understand that yours used to spin up faster and the slow deal is
new? I know Brent had problems initially but it was (if I remember
correctly) a part machined wrong in the start distributor allowing air to
leak into cylinders out of sequence or all at once (I believe some sort of
after market tachometer pick up on the Romanian engines that they installed
in there, I know the same part on Ron's leaked oil and they tossed it).

Scott
Moose 174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Dick
Shotwell
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 6:12 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and the M-14

When Ryan first mentioned the solenoid problem (that they could be
reversed)
I called Kimball. They said that the two solenoids were the same. So I
have not tried the reversal procedure. Then when I made the direct
connection to the tank and the cranking was still slow, I decided the
problem was not the solenoid. It will be interesting to see how this
thread
develops.
Dick Shotwell
Moose 096
N235DS
Twin Falls, ID


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Aldrich" <sa@mwutah.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 23:41 PM
Subject: RE: Air Start and the M-14

Interesting.. I had no idea there was any difference in the solenoids?

I

purchased the solenoids from Kimball's but not the plumbed package so

have

no idea which is which?
Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of

Ryan

Mowat
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 8:08 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Air Start and the M-14

Hey Guys,

The air start system can be a huge pain until you get all the bugs out
of it. The Kimball system that I received had the wrong solenoid on it
and it was just too slow - it turned out the correct solenoid was placed
on the bypass and once I swapped them I have no starting issues. The
slow farting sound is just a dirty solenoid - happens to me about every
100 hours and I just clean the solenoid and away we go.

The other critical item for starting the M14 is preheat - in cold
weather a good 1 hour pre heat with an electrical 1500 watt heater does
wonders. I do not have this at the cabin - but starting is still good
now that the air start solenoid is sorted out.

If anyone has specific questions my cell is 604 897 4101. I was mad at
the thing for the firs 50 hours of flying, now no issues. A good start
can happen at 235 psi with it all working right. At 700 psi I can taxi
on the water :)

Ryan Mowat

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Andrews
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 6:30 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Air Start and Floats

Hey Ryan, have you ever had to prop start while on the water?

Bob e612

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:50 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and Floats


Guess you could stand on a 2" x 12" plank BEHIND the engine!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:46 PM
Subject: Air Start and Floats

Hum, hadn't thought of that. That would be interesting indeed!

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:43 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: M-14 Kimball air start system question


Would be really "FUN" if you were on floats now wouldn't it !?




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[Ted Waltman]

I'll play with the two solenoids some afternoon this week and post my
results. First I'll clean them, try them as they are, then try
switching them for grins.

Ted

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Dick Shotwell
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 6:12 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and the M-14


When Ryan first mentioned the solenoid problem (that they could be
reversed) I called Kimball. They said that the two solenoids were the
same. So I have not tried the reversal procedure. Then when I made the
direct connection to the tank and the cranking was still slow, I decided
the problem was not the solenoid. It will be interesting to see how
this thread develops. Dick Shotwell Moose 096 N235DS Twin Falls, ID


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Aldrich" <sa@mwutah.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 23:41 PM
Subject: RE: Air Start and the M-14

Interesting.. I had no idea there was any difference in the solenoids?

I purchased the solenoids from Kimball's but not the plumbed package
so have no idea which is which? Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Ryan Mowat
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 8:08 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Air Start and the M-14

Hey Guys,

The air start system can be a huge pain until you get all the bugs out

of it. The Kimball system that I received had the wrong solenoid on
it and it was just too slow - it turned out the correct solenoid was
placed on the bypass and once I swapped them I have no starting
issues. The slow farting sound is just a dirty solenoid - happens to
me about every 100 hours and I just clean the solenoid and away we go.

The other critical item for starting the M14 is preheat - in cold
weather a good 1 hour pre heat with an electrical 1500 watt heater
does wonders. I do not have this at the cabin - but starting is still

good now that the air start solenoid is sorted out.

If anyone has specific questions my cell is 604 897 4101. I was mad
at the thing for the firs 50 hours of flying, now no issues. A good
start can happen at 235 psi with it all working right. At 700 psi I
can taxi on the water :)

Ryan Mowat

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Andrews
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 6:30 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Air Start and Floats

Hey Ryan, have you ever had to prop start while on the water?

Bob e612

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:50 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and Floats


Guess you could stand on a 2" x 12" plank BEHIND the engine!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 7:46 PM
Subject: Air Start and Floats

Hum, hadn't thought of that. That would be interesting indeed!

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf
Of Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:43 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: M-14 Kimball air start system question


Would be really "FUN" if you were on floats now wouldn't it !?




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[Ted Waltman]

Yes, mine spun faster long ago. I hadn't had problem per se until about
5 or 10 hrs ago. Now it is abysmal.

Ted

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Scott Aldrich
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 6:31 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Air Start and the M-14


If they are the same and swapping fixed Ryan's I would be inclined to
try that first. Wondering if the solenoids are gunking up, maybe we
need the air filters and snot valves after all??

Ted, do I understand that yours used to spin up faster and the slow deal
is new? I know Brent had problems initially but it was (if I remember
correctly) a part machined wrong in the start distributor allowing air
to leak into cylinders out of sequence or all at once (I believe some
sort of after market tachometer pick up on the Romanian engines that
they installed in there, I know the same part on Ron's leaked oil and
they tossed it).

Scott
Moose 174




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[Skytrucks]

Dick;
I have Kimballs system and there is two different part numbers on the
solenoids, I hope I hooked it up right.
Larry Luckinbill
SR 117 Moose




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[Ted Waltman]

What are the part #'s?

Thank you,

Ted

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Skytrucks@aol.com
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 8:33 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Air Start and the M-14


Dick;
I have Kimballs system and there is two different part numbers
on the
solenoids, I hope I hooked it up right.
Larry Luckinbill
SR 117 Moose




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[Skytrucks]

Ted;
I can't remember where the part numbers are stamped but If I remember
right one has a 166 in the no. and the other has a 266 in it and the same
prefix.
Larry Luckinbill




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