Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR

[rickhm]

This weekend I was stringing cable for the rudder. I noticed that where th
e tail wheel spring (the long pipe) attaches something was not right. Upon
closer inspection I noticed that horizontal piece (Left side of Fus to Rig
ht side) had bowed/warped under the minimal weight of the empty fus. This
was largly my mistake which I quickly corrected. But it got me looking clo
sely and thinking. Under shock load, like that of the tail bouncing, the f
orce is transfred into this horzontal member consisting of a buildup of sev
eral pieces. My tail is attached to the second hole from the BOTTOM of the
bracket. I must admit there has been lots of email on where this goes to
get the top of the tail "level" and mine is still not level (no engine yet)
. I was not comfortable that the shock load wouldn't eventually crack the
flanges where the horizontal piece attaches to the side skin. I installed
4" of angle to transfer the load from the horizontal piece to the skin. Th
e 4" angle runs parallel lengthwise toward the front of the fus.

Has anyone else looked at this and been concerned? Within general reasonab
le tolerance, all the SR's should be about the same with respect to the tai
l spring (pipe) and the levelness of the top of the tail wheel. Where is e
veryone else seeing their tail attach, i.e. which hole?

Rick Muller
SR70


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[Scott & Leere' Aldrich]

Rick, all the ones I have seen have been the second hole up.

I can't imagine the piece warping under just the load of the empty
fuselage?? However, we did add doublers with an L that picks up the flanges
on both sides, both front and back. MAMs was cracking on the flanges. Did
they tell anybody?? No.

What does your 4 inch angle tie into? The flanges on the fuselage sides?

I have seen one that has made the entire assembly out of welded 4130. He
needed a wider bracket for the tail stinger as he is upping that also. May
be the way to go. I am getting good at taking stuff apart that I have
already completed so may do that later...

Scott
Moose #174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rickhm@mindspring.com
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 3:53 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR


This weekend I was stringing cable for the rudder. I noticed that where th
e tail wheel spring (the long pipe) attaches something was not right. Upon
closer inspection I noticed that horizontal piece (Left side of Fus to Rig
ht side) had bowed/warped under the minimal weight of the empty fus. This
was largly my mistake which I quickly corrected. But it got me looking clo
sely and thinking. Under shock load, like that of the tail bouncing, the f
orce is transfred into this horzontal member consisting of a buildup of sev
eral pieces. My tail is attached to the second hole from the BOTTOM of the
bracket. I must admit there has been lots of email on where this goes to
get the top of the tail "level" and mine is still not level (no engine yet)
. I was not comfortable that the shock load wouldn't eventually crack the
flanges where the horizontal piece attaches to the side skin. I installed
4" of angle to transfer the load from the horizontal piece to the skin. Th
e 4" angle runs parallel lengthwise toward the front of the fus.

Has anyone else looked at this and been concerned? Within general reasonab
le tolerance, all the SR's should be about the same with respect to the tai
l spring (pipe) and the levelness of the top of the tail wheel. Where is e
veryone else seeing their tail attach, i.e. which hole?

Rick Muller
SR70


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[Scott & Leere' Aldrich]

Correction - The one piece tail stinger/stab bracket was welded aluminum not
4130.

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Scott & Leere' Aldrich
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 2:00 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR


Rick, all the ones I have seen have been the second hole up.

I can't imagine the piece warping under just the load of the empty
fuselage?? However, we did add doublers with an L that picks up the flanges
on both sides, both front and back. MAMs was cracking on the flanges. Did
they tell anybody?? No.

What does your 4 inch angle tie into? The flanges on the fuselage sides?

I have seen one that has made the entire assembly out of welded 4130. He
needed a wider bracket for the tail stinger as he is upping that also. May
be the way to go. I am getting good at taking stuff apart that I have
already completed so may do that later...

Scott
Moose #174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rickhm@mindspring.com
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 3:53 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR


This weekend I was stringing cable for the rudder. I noticed that where th
e tail wheel spring (the long pipe) attaches something was not right. Upon
closer inspection I noticed that horizontal piece (Left side of Fus to Rig
ht side) had bowed/warped under the minimal weight of the empty fus. This
was largly my mistake which I quickly corrected. But it got me looking clo
sely and thinking. Under shock load, like that of the tail bouncing, the f
orce is transfred into this horzontal member consisting of a buildup of sev
eral pieces. My tail is attached to the second hole from the BOTTOM of the
bracket. I must admit there has been lots of email on where this goes to
get the top of the tail "level" and mine is still not level (no engine yet)
. I was not comfortable that the shock load wouldn't eventually crack the
flanges where the horizontal piece attaches to the side skin. I installed
4" of angle to transfer the load from the horizontal piece to the skin. Th
e 4" angle runs parallel lengthwise toward the front of the fus.

Has anyone else looked at this and been concerned? Within general reasonab
le tolerance, all the SR's should be about the same with respect to the tai
l spring (pipe) and the levelness of the top of the tail wheel. Where is e
veryone else seeing their tail attach, i.e. which hole?

Rick Muller
SR70


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[rickhm]

Scott,

Thanks for the reply. It is a little hard to describe what I did in words. A picture is really worth a thousand words. I would be happy to provide if interested. Although taking a picture of this might be a real challenge!

Imagine you are looking at the tail from the right side. There are 2 rivet lines that hold the two flanges for the sub-assembly the tail spring attaches two. Of course there are 2 other rivet lines on the left side as well. As you look at these rivet lines there is a rivet line running for and aft that holds the wrap around the bottom of the tail. If you have X-ray vision you would see an angle running "away from you" along the bottom of the sub-assembly forward of the side the tail spring attaches to. This is the "standard" design.

In my addition I added a 4-6" piece of 2" angle (flange on the angle is 2" long) that runs forward of the sub-assembly. It attaches to the sub-assembly by 2 bolts. These bolts would appear to run up and down as viewed from the right (or left side) and connect one flange of my addition to the flange of the angle that runs along the bottom (away from you) described above. The angle attaches to the skin. So with your xray vision you would see one flange attached to the skin and running forward and the other flange facing away from you. The skin now has an additional 2 rows of rivets in it above the rivet line where the corner wrap attaches.


Clear as mud? I know what you mean about taking stuff apart and "enhancing the design." Some of the time I do this as well. I am sure you have had the experience of seeing something that your more comfortable enhancing. One area where I did this is along the side of the fus up front. Recall the door posts skins and the skin that goes forward from the door post to the firewall. I put an additional .040 2024-T3 layer over these to strenghten the entire front end. Since I'm using a V8 engine I felt the extra 10 lbs was worth the peace of mind. I don't understand why they didn't make this one piece in the first place?

Thanks for the feedback.

Rick Muller
SR70

-------Original Message-------
From: Scott & Leere' Aldrich <flynski@mwutah.com>
Sent: 05/01/03 05:29 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR

Correction - The one piece tail stinger/stab bracket was welded aluminum

not
4130.

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Scott & Leere' Aldrich
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 2:00 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR


Rick, all the ones I have seen have been the second hole up.

I can't imagine the piece warping under just the load of the empty
fuselage?? However, we did add doublers with an L that picks up the
flanges
on both sides, both front and back. MAMs was cracking on the flanges. Did
they tell anybody?? No.

What does your 4 inch angle tie into? The flanges on the fuselage sides?

I have seen one that has made the entire assembly out of welded 4130. He
needed a wider bracket for the tail stinger as he is upping that also.
May
be the way to go. I am getting good at taking stuff apart that I have
already completed so may do that later...

Scott
Moose #174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rickhm@mindspring.com
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 3:53 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR


This weekend I was stringing cable for the rudder. I noticed that where
th
e tail wheel spring (the long pipe) attaches something was not right.
Upon
closer inspection I noticed that horizontal piece (Left side of Fus to
Rig
ht side) had bowed/warped under the minimal weight of the empty fus. This
was largly my mistake which I quickly corrected. But it got me looking
clo
sely and thinking. Under shock load, like that of the tail bouncing, the
f
orce is transfred into this horzontal member consisting of a buildup of
sev
eral pieces. My tail is attached to the second hole from the BOTTOM of
the
bracket. I must admit there has been lots of email on where this goes to
get the top of the tail "level" and mine is still not level (no engine
yet)
. I was not comfortable that the shock load wouldn't eventually crack the
flanges where the horizontal piece attaches to the side skin. I installed
4" of angle to transfer the load from the horizontal piece to the skin.
Th
e 4" angle runs parallel lengthwise toward the front of the fus.

Has anyone else looked at this and been concerned? Within general
reasonab
le tolerance, all the SR's should be about the same with respect to the
tai
l spring (pipe) and the levelness of the top of the tail wheel. Where is
e
veryone else seeing their tail attach, i.e. which hole?

Rick
Muller
SR70


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[rickhm]

Scott,

Thanks for the reply. It is a little hard to describe what I did in words. A picture is really worth a thousand words. I would be happy to provide if interested. Although taking a picture of this might be a real challenge!

Imagine you are looking at the tail from the right side. There are 2 rivet lines that hold the two flanges for the sub-assembly the tail spring attaches two. Of course there are 2 other rivet lines on the left side as well. As you look at these rivet lines there is a rivet line running for and aft that holds the wrap around the bottom of the tail. If you have X-ray vision you would see an angle running "away from you" along the bottom of the sub-assembly forward of the side the tail spring attaches to. This is the "standard" design.

In my addition I added a 4-6" piece of 2" angle (flange on the angle is 2" long) that runs forward of the sub-assembly. It attaches to the sub-assembly by 2 bolts. These bolts would appear to run up and down as viewed from the right (or left side) and connect one flange of my addition to the flange of the angle that runs along the bottom (away from you) described above. The angle attaches to the skin. So with your xray vision you would see one flange attached to the skin and running forward and the other flange facing away from you. The skin now has an additional 2 rows of rivets in it above the rivet line where the corner wrap attaches.


Clear as mud? I know what you mean about taking stuff apart and "enhancing the design." Some of the time I do this as well. I am sure you have had the experience of seeing something that your more comfortable enhancing. One area where I did this is along the side of the fus up front. Recall the door posts skins and the skin that goes forward from the door post to the firewall. I put an additional .040 2024-T3 layer over these to strenghten the entire front end. Since I'm using a V8 engine I felt the extra 10 lbs was worth the peace of mind. I don't understand why they didn't make this one piece in the first place?

Thanks for the feedback.

Rick Muller
SR70

-------Original Message-------
From: Scott & Leere' Aldrich <flynski@mwutah.com>
Sent: 05/01/03 05:29 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR

Correction - The one piece tail stinger/stab bracket was welded aluminum

not
4130.

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Scott & Leere' Aldrich
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 2:00 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR


Rick, all the ones I have seen have been the second hole up.

I can't imagine the piece warping under just the load of the empty
fuselage?? However, we did add doublers with an L that picks up the
flanges
on both sides, both front and back. MAMs was cracking on the flanges. Did
they tell anybody?? No.

What does your 4 inch angle tie into? The flanges on the fuselage sides?

I have seen one that has made the entire assembly out of welded 4130. He
needed a wider bracket for the tail stinger as he is upping that also.
May
be the way to go. I am getting good at taking stuff apart that I have
already completed so may do that later...

Scott
Moose #174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rickhm@mindspring.com
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 3:53 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Tail Wheel Attach Point on SR


This weekend I was stringing cable for the rudder. I noticed that where
th
e tail wheel spring (the long pipe) attaches something was not right.
Upon
closer inspection I noticed that horizontal piece (Left side of Fus to
Rig
ht side) had bowed/warped under the minimal weight of the empty fus. This
was largly my mistake which I quickly corrected. But it got me looking
clo
sely and thinking. Under shock load, like that of the tail bouncing, the
f
orce is transfred into this horzontal member consisting of a buildup of
sev
eral pieces. My tail is attached to the second hole from the BOTTOM of
the
bracket. I must admit there has been lots of email on where this goes to
get the top of the tail "level" and mine is still not level (no engine
yet)
. I was not comfortable that the shock load wouldn't eventually crack the
flanges where the horizontal piece attaches to the side skin. I installed
4" of angle to transfer the load from the horizontal piece to the skin.
Th
e 4" angle runs parallel lengthwise toward the front of the fus.

Has anyone else looked at this and been concerned? Within general
reasonab
le tolerance, all the SR's should be about the same with respect to the
tai
l spring (pipe) and the levelness of the top of the tail wheel. Where is
e
veryone else seeing their tail attach, i.e. which hole?

Rick
Muller
SR70


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[Scott & Leere' Aldrich]

Yes I can "see" exactly what you did, thanks. I am all closed up back there
so will see how it goes with just the extra front and back.

Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rickhm@mindspring.co
Scott,

Thanks for the reply. It is a little hard to describe what I did in words.
A picture is really worth a thousand words. I would be happy to provide if
interested. Although taking a picture of this might be a real challenge!

Imagine you are looking at the tail from the right side. There are 2 rivet
lines that hold the two flanges for the sub-assembly the tail spring
attaches two. Of course there are 2 other rivet lines on the left side as
well. As you look at these rivet lines there is a rivet line running for
and aft that holds the wrap around the bottom of the tail. If you have
X-ray vision you would see an angle running "away from you" along the bottom
of the sub-assembly forward of the side the tail spring attaches to. This
is the "standard" design.

In my addition I added a 4-6" piece of 2" angle (flange on the angle is 2"
long) that runs forward of the sub-assembly. It attaches to the
sub-assembly by 2 bolts. These bolts would appear to run up and down as
viewed from the right (or left side) and connect one flange of my addition
to the flange of the angle that runs along the bottom (away from you)
described above. The angle attaches to the skin. So with your xray vision
you would see one flange attached to the skin and running forward and the
other flange facing away from you. The skin now has an additional 2 rows of
rivets in it above the rivet line where the corner wrap attaches.


Clear as mud? I know what you mean about taking stuff apart and "enhancing
the design." Some of the time I do this as well. I am sure you have had
the experience of seeing something that your more comfortable enhancing.
One area where I did this is along the side of the fus up front. Recall the
door posts skins and the skin that goes forward from the door post to the
firewall. I put an additional .040 2024-T3 layer over these to strenghten
the entire front end. Since I'm using a V8 engine I felt the extra 10 lbs
was worth the peace of mind. I don't understand why they didn't make this
one piece in the first place?

Thanks for the feedback.

Rick Muller
SR70





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