volunteers for you to buy ....
I won't mention it for now - I really do believe that $110,000
is a reasonable price for a good Rebel on amphibs, given the latest
prices I've seen for beat-up old 180's !!
Gee, we just celebrated our 17th anniversary at Sun 'n Fun
- what's the problem ?? !! ;-) :-) :-)
OSH would sure be the place to sell it !! With a LOT of luck,
I'll finally have XWI painted and on amphibs by then ....
(well .... maybe more like a miracle !! :-) )
....bobp
-----------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 11:26 PM 5/22/02 -0400, you wrote:
You're very right about pricing! Howard has been offered $100,000US, 3 years
in a row, at OSH for his and thinks the same thing everytime. Going to cost
him that to have another one built for him and he would have to go without a
plane for a couple years before I could build it for him, so he isn't going
to come out ahead.
As for the last paragraph, since you brought it up, you were right up until
3 weeks ago. Not a rebuild, but I did buy FOKM back from John on the 27th of
April. Growing family and new business ventures brought him to the
decission. Don't anyone go spreading it around, that it's available, as I
don't have time to work on it for a couple months at least. Since the amphib
floats are currently off it I will be "splitting" them and adding in the
21inches to make them 1800's and then reinstalling. If done in time maybe I
should take it to OSH for resale this time!!! Nope, guess I can't, our 20th
anniversary 4th of August so can't do that, but I will definitely be looking
for the "full" price this time around and won't be worrying about keeping it
below $100,000 Cdn for resale this time. Just nicely broken in with 82.7
hours since airframe refurb and fresh O-320 engine.
Cheers,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 10:53 PM
Subject: Re: logging float time
lastHi Wayne !
I know rates have skyrocketted, but the good thing about
Bill Cameron, and Rhodes & Williams, is that Bill searches ALL
available insurers for the best deal for each individual ....
.... and rates can vary considerably, depending on experience,
ratings, and the length of time you've been insured with the same
company. Maybe I do a bit better, because I fly all of the different
Murphy models somewhat regularly, or maybe because I have met with some
of the folks personally, in the re-insurance company offices, and also
because I'm still trying hard to stay "the 2nd highest-time Rebel
pilot in the world" !! ;-) :-) :-)
You are absolutely correct in your advice !! Apparently
what WAS "standard wording" on policies pretty much went out the
window after Sept. 11th, and now <every> company seems to have some
little 'weasel clause' that that lets them lower rates by taking
something away from the buyer !! Several people have mentioned
things like 'no liability coverage outside Canada', and, as you
mention, 'different write-off levels', and there's no question
that coverage is getting harder to obtain, and conditions tougher !
I absolutely agree that there are VERY FEW of us who can
stand the devastation of the wreck of our Rebels, AND the financial
loss as well !! I strongly recommend full in-flight coverage for
AT LEAST the first year !! I did that, and then just KEPT ON
doing it, because, each spring, I asked myself "Can I afford to
throw away $100,000, AND still come up with ANOTHER $100,000 to
replace what I've lost ??!!!!"
Don't kid yourselves, guys - those aircraft you've built
are worth A HECK OF A LOT MORE than you might think they are, if
you had to replace them tomorrow !!! Heck, the kits themselves
have gone up OVER $$$ Ten Thousand $$ already, in just 10 years !!
Under-insuring can cost you your airplane !!! Wayne and I both
know of people who tried to save a buck this way, and ended up
losing either way ...
Just for fun, try to buy a Rebel with an O-320, on amphibs !
I have heard of one gentleman who went down the line at Oshkosh,
offering each builder $85,000 to $95,000 US for his Rebel - they
ALL turned him down flat !! And I know of a man in Florida who
rejected $110,000 US for HIS Rebel - he said "I'd just have to
build another one, so why sell !!"
That's not to say there aren't bargains out there, but if
you had to replace your prize right now, it might not be easy !!
Just ask Wayne - he hasn't been able to find any 'homeless' Rebels
to rebuild for months !! ;-)
....bobp
----------------------------------orig.------------------------------
At 09:13 PM 5/22/02 -0400, you wrote:Bob, the insurance #'s that I quoted (at 5.25% of value) on FOKM for last
June, to this June, were through Bill at Rhodes and Williams, and
underwritten by Global Aerospace. I also know that Global pays out if you
have an "incident", as that was the underwriter for the Rebel I rebuiltforspring. No problems getting paid for the work I did and the total billin-flight.me, salvage costs, the engine/prop inspections, adjuster fees, etc was
pretty steep (around $40G's). I was a little concerned when I got cheque
#003 from them though!!!
The days of 3 to 4% on Amphibs are long gone, I believe, for fullcoverage.Even when I was bothering to do so, on my Rebel on Wheels, I was paying
about 4.5% +PLPD + Passenger coverage.
Currently about 1.75% of value just for tie down hull coverage (NOT in
motion) on a float/amphib aircraft, plus liability and passengeryouBut your right!! A very small price to pay, even if it is $6000/year, ifby#$&* up big time (or even sink it as they usually wreck her pretty goodinsurethe time they get it out of the drink)! And make sure you don't underisit, because by the time you get onto a set of Amphibs, with a nice paint
job, panel and fresh O-320, the minimum you likely have into your "toy"by$85,000.00 to $90,000.00CDN in parts. If you have an accident and require
parts and the labour to fix it (they will ask for an unbiased estimate),athe time you add up the parts and the labour bill they will declare it a
total loss if you undervalue it and possibly even if you go full value +put abit for your labour. SO be careful and give it some thought before youitvalue on your airplane for insurance purposes.
And you're right, ask for the fine print BEFORE signing with a company.
Global pays full face value less salvage costs less your deductible (at
least the policy I have in front of me states that!). That is they will
cover up to the full declared hull value, less the salvage costs and the
deductible. If your repair estimate goes over that amount they will callAVEMCOa total loss, cut you a cheque and take your airplane. Some like theofpolicy I had on my C182 state that when the "repair" costs reach only 70%declaredthe face value of your policy they will write you a cheque for theinvalue less the deductible and take your airplane. This one will leave yououtthe hole BIG TIME! Some others I have seen state 80%. Check these things!)carefully or you may be paying a lot of money for less coverage than you
really think you have.
Regards,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 8:19 PM
Subject: Re: logging float time
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