Split flap to flaperon conversion

Wayne G. O'Shea · Post by **Wayne G. O'Shea** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:38 pm

HAVE REPOSTED WITH CORRECT SUBJECT LINE!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: Engine & other considerations!

Drew, I was always told that was the case also! Just swap the inner
flaperons side to side, to switch from flaperons to split flaps, but after
working on a split flap Rebel last summer I know that is not the case. The
flap horn is thicker and has less pivot distance, than a flaperon horn. To
switch to flaperons he will need to drill off the old plates on the

inboard

flaps and put on a new flaperon plate and swap the units side to side.

OR you could put the new flaperon horn on the other end of the flap,

without

switching sides and leave the flap horn on the inboard end. This would

allow

trying out both worlds and going with the one you like the best!

Regards,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Drew and Jan" <drewjan@execulink.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Engine & other considerations!

On your flaps/flaperons you should be able to swap them from one side to
the other so the existing horn falls in the middle and not make any
changes
at all. .
Drew Dalgleish
========================
The
plane was also set up for split flaps/ail. That dosent sound like the
best
choice, So i went ahead and rigged the plane that way but would like to
change back to flaperons before i fly it. I guess all i need is to
fabricate or order a plate for the end of the flap, Cut fabric and

rivit

it on? Also wondering about the horn that connects to the cable to

droop

the ailirons when using the split flaps, It has been changed from 1

1/2"

to 1" . is that setup ok for flaperons as well? Bruce

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Flyin B Ranch · Post by **Flyin B Ranch** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:38 pm

Wayne is correct, My plan was to do just that as to make it a "Quick change kinda deal" But was also wondering about the flap horn that connects the cable to the flap handle via the rod that goes to the wing root, It seems that they where shortened from 1 1/2" to 1". Is that standard for the flaperons also or just split flaps.

Bruce

Drew, I was always told that was the case also! Just swap the inner
flaperons side to side, to switch from flaperons to split flaps, but after
working on a split flap Rebel last summer I know that is not the case. The
flap horn is thicker and has less pivot distance, than a flaperon horn. To
switch to flaperons he will need to drill off the old plates on the
inboard
flaps and put on a new flaperon plate and swap the units side to side.

OR you could put the new flaperon horn on the other end of the flap,
without
switching sides and leave the flap horn on the inboard end. This would
allow
trying out both worlds and going with the one you like the best!

Regards,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Drew and Jan" <drewjan@execulink.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Engine & other considerations!

On your flaps/flaperons you should be able to swap them from one side to
the other so the existing horn falls in the middle and not make any
changes
at all. .
Drew Dalgleish

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Wayne G. O'Shea · Post by **Wayne G. O'Shea** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:38 pm

Bruce, to run the flaperons the mixer (that is also used to droop the
ailerons on a split flap version) needs about 1 13/16" of total travel (at
the keeper plates) to give a good range of movement (21* down/ 6*+ up). The
standard flaperon set up does not use that giant steel handle set up that
you have for the split flaps, but just a handle in the cabin roof as you
should be able to see in your instruction manual. In the manual, from the
pattern for the flaperon handle, measure the distance from the mounting bolt
hole to the cable attach hole. Then see if you can get this same distance by
extending your 1" horn and still have clearance without hitting the lower
flange of the FUS-27 with the mechanism. If not you may have to switch to
the flaperon handle set up or possibly mount the cable at a different
location to the existing handle assembly, so it will be easy to do the
"quick change" thing.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Flyin B Ranch" <flyinb@kfalls.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 10:05 AM
Subject: Re: Split flap to flaperon conversion

Wayne is correct, My plan was to do just that as to make it a "Quick change
kinda deal" But was also wondering about the flap horn that connects the
cable to the flap handle via the rod that goes to the wing root, It seems
that they where shortened from 1 1/2" to 1". Is that standard for the
flaperons also or just split flaps.

Bruce

Drew, I was always told that was the case also! Just swap the inner
flaperons side to side, to switch from flaperons to split flaps, but

after

working on a split flap Rebel last summer I know that is not the case.

The

flap horn is thicker and has less pivot distance, than a flaperon horn.

To

switch to flaperons he will need to drill off the old plates on the
inboard
flaps and put on a new flaperon plate and swap the units side to side.

OR you could put the new flaperon horn on the other end of the flap,
without
switching sides and leave the flap horn on the inboard end. This would
allow
trying out both worlds and going with the one you like the best!

Regards,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Drew and Jan" <drewjan@execulink.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Engine & other considerations!

On your flaps/flaperons you should be able to swap them from one side

to

the other so the existing horn falls in the middle and not make any
changes
at all. .
Drew Dalgleish

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Bob Patterson · Post by **Bob Patterson** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:38 pm

Hi Bruce !

Sounds like you might have a bit more work than you expected.
Do you have the long, tubular flap handle, that has a rod on the
end in the wing root going back to the flaps ???
This is the Elite handle ...

The standard setup has a flat plate handle (that should be
made with a 45 degree dogleg in it - see drawings on web site). That
handle connects to a cable that runs across the roof and down to
connect to a flat bar that mounts the aileron bellcrank. The cable
pulls the bar up and down to give the flapperon effect. THAT is the
setup you want for flapperons.

....bobp

-----------------------------------orig.------------------------------
At 07:05 AM 1/10/02 -0800, you wrote:

Wayne is correct, My plan was to do just that as to make it a "Quick change

kinda deal" But was also wondering about the flap horn that connects the
cable to the flap handle via the rod that goes to the wing root, It seems
that they where shortened from 1 1/2" to 1". Is that standard for the
flaperons also or just split flaps.

Bruce

Drew, I was always told that was the case also! Just swap the inner
flaperons side to side, to switch from flaperons to split flaps, but after
working on a split flap Rebel last summer I know that is not the case. The
flap horn is thicker and has less pivot distance, than a flaperon horn. To
switch to flaperons he will need to drill off the old plates on the
inboard
flaps and put on a new flaperon plate and swap the units side to side.

OR you could put the new flaperon horn on the other end of the flap,
without
switching sides and leave the flap horn on the inboard end. This would
allow
trying out both worlds and going with the one you like the best!

Regards,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Drew and Jan" <drewjan@execulink.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Engine & other considerations!

changes

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Flyin B Ranch · Post by **Flyin B Ranch** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:38 pm

Hi Wayne & Bob,
Thanks for the numbers Wayne, I will check all my throws and see what i can come up with. Yea Bob I already have the steel flap handle, mixer arm, Bellcrank ect. all finished hooked up and working. The split flaps also use the cable to the mixer arm but with less throw i would guess. So I will see what i can rig up to get the throws needed using what i have. Is there any reason I couldent use the steel flap handle for ether set up as long as i can get the control throws needed? Seems like a real stout flap handle and works real smooth. I bought this project well on it way and it came with about every upgrade or downgrade that Mam has to offer ;-) Also has the rounded dash that is all fitted nicely so guess iam stuck with it as well. I hope to fly it this summer so dont want to change a lot of stuff. I have all controls hooked up and getting ready to cut holes for instraments.

Bruce

Bruce, to run the flaperons the mixer (that is also used to droop the
ailerons on a split flap version) needs about 1 13/16" of total travel (at
the keeper plates) to give a good range of movement (21* down/ 6*+ up). The
standard flaperon set up does not use that giant steel handle set up that
you have for the split flaps, but just a handle in the cabin roof as you
should be able to see in your instruction manual. In the manual, from the
pattern for the flaperon handle, measure the distance from the mounting bolt
hole to the cable attach hole. Then see if you can get this same distance by
extending your 1" horn and still have clearance without hitting the lower
flange of the FUS-27 with the mechanism. If not you may have to switch to
the flaperon handle set up or possibly mount the cable at a different
location to the existing handle assembly, so it will be easy to do the
"quick change" thing.

Wayne

Hi Bruce !

Sounds like you might have a bit more work than you expected.
Do you have the long, tubular flap handle, that has a rod on the
end in the wing root going back to the flaps ???
This is the Elite handle ...

The standard setup has a flat plate handle (that should be
made with a 45 degree dogleg in it - see drawings on web site). That
handle connects to a cable that runs across the roof and down to
connect to a flat bar that mounts the aileron bellcrank. The cable
pulls the bar up and down to give the flapperon effect. THAT is the
setup you want for flapperons.

....bobp

----- Original Message -----
From: "Flyin B Ranch" <flyinb@kfalls.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 10:05 AM
Subject: Re: Split flap to flaperon conversion

Wayne is correct, My plan was to do just that as to make it a "Quick change
kinda deal" But was also wondering about the flap horn that connects the
cable to the flap handle via the rod that goes to the wing root, It seems
that they where shortened from 1 1/2" to 1". Is that standard for the
flaperons also or just split flaps.

Bruce

Drew, I was always told that was the case also! Just swap the inner
flaperons side to side, to switch from flaperons to split flaps, but
after
working on a split flap Rebel last summer I know that is not the case.
The
flap horn is thicker and has less pivot distance, than a flaperon horn.
To
switch to flaperons he will need to drill off the old plates on the
inboard
flaps and put on a new flaperon plate and swap the units side to side.

OR you could put the new flaperon horn on the other end of the flap,
without
switching sides and leave the flap horn on the inboard end. This would
allow
trying out both worlds and going with the one you like the best!

Regards,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Drew and Jan" <drewjan@execulink.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Engine & other considerations!

to
changes

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Bob Patterson · Post by **Bob Patterson** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:38 pm

Hi Bruce !

No reason you can't use that big ugly handle, as long as
you're careful it doesn't pinch your hand ! ;-)

On the throws - make sure you've got the handle notches and
travel to allow for TWO notches of negative, and 3 of positive.
Each notch should give about 6 degrees of flap movement. We've found
that any Rebel with more than 120 hp will pull 2 notches of negative,
which gives you an extra 3 mph of cruise, and a smoother ride in
turbulence, too !

Keep rivetting !! It really IS worth it !!

....bobp

----------------------------orig.-------------------------------------
At 04:51 PM 1/10/02 -0800, you wrote:

Hi Wayne & Bob,
Thanks for the numbers Wayne, I will check all my throws and see what i

can come up with. Yea Bob I already have the steel flap handle, mixer arm,
Bellcrank ect. all finished hooked up and working. The split flaps also use
the cable to the mixer arm but with less throw i would guess. So I will see
what i can rig up to get the throws needed using what i have. Is there any
reason I couldent use the steel flap handle for ether set up as long as i
can get the control throws needed? Seems like a real stout flap handle and
works real smooth. I bought this project well on it way and it came with
about every upgrade or downgrade that Mam has to offer ;-) Also has the
rounded dash that is all fitted nicely so guess iam stuck with it as well. I
hope to fly it this summer so dont want to change a lot of stuff. I have all
controls hooked up and getting ready to cut holes for instraments.

Bruce

Bruce, to run the flaperons the mixer (that is also used to droop the
ailerons on a split flap version) needs about 1 13/16" of total travel (at
the keeper plates) to give a good range of movement (21* down/ 6*+ up). The
standard flaperon set up does not use that giant steel handle set up that
you have for the split flaps, but just a handle in the cabin roof as you
should be able to see in your instruction manual. In the manual, from the
pattern for the flaperon handle, measure the distance from the mounting bolt
hole to the cable attach hole. Then see if you can get this same distance by
extending your 1" horn and still have clearance without hitting the lower
flange of the FUS-27 with the mechanism. If not you may have to switch to
the flaperon handle set up or possibly mount the cable at a different
location to the existing handle assembly, so it will be easy to do the
"quick change" thing.

Wayne
Hi Bruce !

Sounds like you might have a bit more work than you expected.
Do you have the long, tubular flap handle, that has a rod on the
end in the wing root going back to the flaps ???
This is the Elite handle ...

The standard setup has a flat plate handle (that should be
made with a 45 degree dogleg in it - see drawings on web site). That
handle connects to a cable that runs across the roof and down to
connect to a flat bar that mounts the aileron bellcrank. The cable
pulls the bar up and down to give the flapperon effect. THAT is the
setup you want for flapperons.

....bobp

----- Original Message -----
From: "Flyin B Ranch" <flyinb@kfalls.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 10:05 AM
Subject: Re: Split flap to flaperon conversion

Wayne is correct, My plan was to do just that as to make it a "Quick change
kinda deal" But was also wondering about the flap horn that connects the
cable to the flap handle via the rod that goes to the wing root, It seems
that they where shortened from 1 1/2" to 1". Is that standard for the
flaperons also or just split flaps.

Bruce

after
The
To
inboard without allow
to

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Flyin B Ranch · Post by **Flyin B Ranch** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:38 pm

Bob,
Yea I think i need to cut a few inches off that thing. ;-)
Bout got all riviting done, Want to do firewall mod and finish plumbing fuel lines (I plan to put fuel lines on top of floor boards and a fuel selector between the seats) then all i need is an engine and some radios...YeeHaa..... Well there is still plenty to do.

Bruce

Hi Bruce !

No reason you can't use that big ugly handle, as long as
you're careful it doesn't pinch your hand ! ;-)

On the throws - make sure you've got the handle notches and
travel to allow for TWO notches of negative, and 3 of positive.
Each notch should give about 6 degrees of flap movement. We've found
that any Rebel with more than 120 hp will pull 2 notches of negative,
which gives you an extra 3 mph of cruise, and a smoother ride in
turbulence, too !

Keep rivetting !! It really IS worth it !!

....bobp

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