[rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy

[Walter Klatt]

Congrats Ron, that's fantastic. After seeing your airplane on Sunday
following my Arlington visit, there was no doubt that the inspector had to
be impressed. And like I said, I still want to know the expression on his
face when he saw your panel. It would definitely would put many airliners to
shame.

Looking forward to your next milestone with it flying. You will probably be
flying high long after your first landing, but when you settle down and can
type, be sure to let us know how it went.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ron
Shannon
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 3:18 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy

254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left coast.

Ron




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[Garry Wright]

Congrats Ron. Big time. Looking forward to the big announcement of first
flight. Many are also awaiting the engine perf stuff.

Garry

On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 4:17 PM, Ron Shannon <rshannon@cruzcom.com> wrote:

254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to
report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left coast.

Ron




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[Keith Leitch]

OUTSTANDING!!!! Congrats Ron....Now we will all sit back and await the flight reports of your newly built flying apperatus.
Keith R661

--- On Tue, 7/13/10, Ron Shannon <rshannon@cruzcom.com> wrote:


From: Ron Shannon <rshannon@cruzcom.com>
Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Date: Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 5:17 PM


254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left coast.

Ron




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[Curtis Langholz]

Congratulations on getting your Certificate! Looking forward to hearing how good it flies....

Curtis

175R

From: rshannon@cruzcom.com
Date: Tue, 13 Jul 2010 15:17:57 -0700
Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com

254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left coast.

Ron




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_________________________________________________________________
The New Busy is not the too busy. Combine all your e-mail accounts with Hotmail.
http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/the ... P:042010_4



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[Tim Hickey]

Congrats Ron.
It is a wonderful thing.

Once piece of advice: Put plenty of fuel in it for the first flight. (ask me
how I know this.)

(No, it was not a problem, but could have been.)

Tim Hickey.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Shannon" <rshannon@cruzcom.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 5:17 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy

254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to
report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left
coast.

Ron




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[Eric Fogelin]

Excellent! So, no issues LSA? That is huge. You can always move up, but
can't move back down with LSA. Looks like real good flying weather this
week. Hmmm.

Good to see you at Arlington, if only briefly.

Eric

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ron
Shannon
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 3:18 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy

254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left coast.

Ron




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[Ron Shannon]

Thanks to everyone for the comments and encouragement. Oddly, now that I
_can_ fly it, I've thought of at least a half dozen other things I really
should do first. :) It won't be long, but there's certainly no hurry. In
other words, it definitely won't happen before sunrise tomorrow. :-)

Eric, there were no problems RE weight, and I _never_ expected any issue at
all regarding weight in the process of certification. I wouldn't have bought
the Rebel, or any other type, if I'd thought there possibly could be. At the
risk of beating a dead horse and (and as you probably do already know) this
is not an LSA,* _as that term is used for purposes of airworthiness
certification_*. However, the question may raise confusion, and presents at
least another opportunity, if not necessity to try to nail this down again.
So for any who may be unclear about this, please bear with me below. (I do
eventually get around to why the distinctions are important when filling out
the forms.)

In regard to certification, there are only two kinds of "LSA": 1) SLSA
(factory turn-key) and 2) ELSA (an SLSA subsequently offered as a kit.)
There is no other form of LSA certification. For amateur built experimental
(ABE) certification, which is something entirely different, there is nothing
-- ever -- in the airworthiness cert, or operating limitations, or anywhere
else, that mentions or refers to "LSA" or "light sport" in any way,
regardless of any weights. It's "just" another ABE like any other, which can
be _*operated_* by a sport pilot because it happens to fit the FAR 1.1
definition of a LSA ( <= 1320 MTOW, fixed pitch, 2 seat, etc.) from a
performance, operation, or capability standpoint. The terms "LSA" or "light
sport" are not relevant to the process of any ABE certification -- at all.
My Rebel is an ABE, and only an ABE, which for purposes of the certification
process, is considered and processed no differently than an RV-10, Long-EZ,
Lancair, Moose, etc. A sport pilot can fly it because it meets the
performance (etc.) parameters of the FAR 1.1 definition of a light sport
aircraft -- not because it is or isn't _certified_ as an LSA, which it
ain't, and can't be.

IMPORTANT: That distinction (that it is not and never could be an LSA as
that term is used in certification) is important and can really confuse
builders when filling out the Form 8130-6 application for the airworthiness
cert, because on that form - confusing things even further -- you will see
check box references to things like "operating LSA" etc. that a builder
might think apply -- but DO NOT apply. The builder wishing to fly as a sport
pilot should complete that form just like -- and only like -- the EAA
guidebook's example for any other ABE.

In short, I never expected (nor were there) any problems with empty weight
vs. listed GW in the ABE certification process. During the inspection --
including specific review of the required initial W&B statement -- it was
never even a point of discussion, nor should it have been. With a US ABE,
the only point where some "minimum usable load" might possibly ever come
into play is when, in the opinion of the DAR, there is so little usable load
the plane cannot be prudently or safely operated at all, for example, it
would be impossible for someone to fly anywhere and still have reserves.
254R isn't even close!

I hope everyone will forgive me for holding forth on this again. It can be
confusing, and my attempts to explain it always seem to fall short of the
clarity necessary to get through this thicket.

Ron
254R



On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 9:25 PM, Eric Fogelin <elist@whidbey.com> wrote:

Excellent! So, no issues LSA? That is huge. You can always move up, but
can't move back down with LSA. Looks like real good flying weather this
week. Hmmm.

Good to see you at Arlington, if only briefly.

Eric

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ron
Shannon
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 3:18 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy

254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to
report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left coast.

Ron




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[mikeh]

On 7/13/2010 11:54 PM, rshannon@cruzcom.com wrote to rebel-builders:

Well done Ron, the well deserved result of much planning and even more
effort. And thank you for your builders site, I have visited it often and
have found answers there. Good luck with the next step, and all that
follow. Cheers Mike

-> Thanks to everyone for the comments and encouragement. Oddly, now that I
-> _can_ fly it, I've thought of at least a half dozen other things I really
-> should do first. :) It won't be long, but there's certainly no hurry. In
-> other words, it definitely won't happen before sunrise tomorrow. :-)
->
-> Eric, there were no problems RE weight, and I _never_ expected any issue at
-> all regarding weight in the process of certification. I wouldn't have bought
-> the Rebel, or any other type, if I'd thought there possibly could be. At the
-> risk of beating a dead horse and (and as you probably do already know) this
-> is not an LSA,* _as that term is used for purposes of airworthiness
-> certification_*. However, the question may raise confusion, and presents at
-> least another opportunity, if not necessity to try to nail this down again.
-> So for any who may be unclear about this, please bear with me below. (I do
-> eventually get around to why the distinctions are important when filling out
-> the forms.)
->
-> In regard to certification, there are only two kinds of "LSA": 1) SLSA
-> (factory turn-key) and 2) ELSA (an SLSA subsequently offered as a kit.)
-> There is no other form of LSA certification. For amateur built experimental
-> (ABE) certification, which is something entirely different, there is nothing
-> -- ever -- in the airworthiness cert, or operating limitations, or anywhere
-> else, that mentions or refers to "LSA" or "light sport" in any way,
-> regardless of any weights. It's "just" another ABE like any other, which can
-> be _*operated_* by a sport pilot because it happens to fit the FAR 1.1
-> definition of a LSA ( <= 1320 MTOW, fixed pitch, 2 seat, etc.) from a
-> performance, operation, or capability standpoint. The terms "LSA" or "light
-> sport" are not relevant to the process of any ABE certification -- at all.
-> My Rebel is an ABE, and only an ABE, which for purposes of the certification
-> process, is considered and processed no differently than an RV-10, Long-EZ,
-> Lancair, Moose, etc. A sport pilot can fly it because it meets the
-> performance (etc.) parameters of the FAR 1.1 definition of a light sport
-> aircraft -- not because it is or isn't _certified_ as an LSA, which it
-> ain't, and can't be.
->
-> IMPORTANT: That distinction (that it is not and never could be an LSA as
-> that term is used in certification) is important and can really confuse
-> builders when filling out the Form 8130-6 application for the airworthiness
-> cert, because on that form - confusing things even further -- you will see
-> check box references to things like "operating LSA" etc. that a builder
-> might think apply -- but DO NOT apply. The builder wishing to fly as a sport
-> pilot should complete that form just like -- and only like -- the EAA
-> guidebook's example for any other ABE.
->
-> In short, I never expected (nor were there) any problems with empty weight
-> vs. listed GW in the ABE certification process. During the inspection --
-> including specific review of the required initial W&B statement -- it was
-> never even a point of discussion, nor should it have been. With a US ABE,
-> the only point where some "minimum usable load" might possibly ever come
-> into play is when, in the opinion of the DAR, there is so little usable load
-> the plane cannot be prudently or safely operated at all, for example, it
-> would be impossible for someone to fly anywhere and still have reserves.
-> 254R isn't even close!
->
-> I hope everyone will forgive me for holding forth on this again. It can be
-> confusing, and my attempts to explain it always seem to fall short of the
-> clarity necessary to get through this thicket.
->
-> Ron
-> 254R
->
->
->
-> On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 9:25 PM, Eric Fogelin <elist@whidbey.com> wrote:
->
-> > Excellent! So, no issues LSA? That is huge. You can always move up, but
-> > can't move back down with LSA. Looks like real good flying weather this
-> > week. Hmmm.
-> >
-> > Good to see you at Arlington, if only briefly.
-> >
-> > Eric
-> >
-> > -----Original Message-----
-> > From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ron
-> > Shannon
-> > Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 3:18 PM
-> > To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
-> > Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy
-> >
-> > 254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to
-> > report
-> > the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
-> > really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
-> > http://n254mr.com/node/1544
-> >
-> > From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next deafening
-> > WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left
coast.
-> >
-> > Ron
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
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-> > username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
-> > List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
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-> > username "rebel" password "builder"
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-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
->




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[Charlie Eubanks]

Congratulation Ron
You are right not to get in a hurry. Best to make sure everything is right
before that first flight.
Thanks for your explanation on LSA as apposed to ABE. I have had the same
frustration trying to explain the difference to a lot of people. I have a
Luscombe 8A which I fly on my driver's license under light sport rules
because that aircraft just happens to meet all the requirements of the light
sport pilots rules. It is a FAA certified aircraft not a LSA and can not
every be anything else. My Rebel will be a ABE aircraft that also meets the
requirements to fly under the light sport rules.
Good job and Good luck.
Charlie E. 802R
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Shannon" <rshannon@cruzcom.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2010 2:54 AM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy

Thanks to everyone for the comments and encouragement. Oddly, now that I
_can_ fly it, I've thought of at least a half dozen other things I really
should do first. :) It won't be long, but there's certainly no hurry. In
other words, it definitely won't happen before sunrise tomorrow. :-)

Eric, there were no problems RE weight, and I _never_ expected any issue
at
all regarding weight in the process of certification. I wouldn't have
bought
the Rebel, or any other type, if I'd thought there possibly could be. At
the
risk of beating a dead horse and (and as you probably do already know)
this
is not an LSA,* _as that term is used for purposes of airworthiness
certification_*. However, the question may raise confusion, and presents
at
least another opportunity, if not necessity to try to nail this down
again.
So for any who may be unclear about this, please bear with me below. (I do
eventually get around to why the distinctions are important when filling
out
the forms.)

In regard to certification, there are only two kinds of "LSA": 1) SLSA
(factory turn-key) and 2) ELSA (an SLSA subsequently offered as a kit.)
There is no other form of LSA certification. For amateur built
experimental
(ABE) certification, which is something entirely different, there is
nothing
-- ever -- in the airworthiness cert, or operating limitations, or
anywhere
else, that mentions or refers to "LSA" or "light sport" in any way,
regardless of any weights. It's "just" another ABE like any other, which
can
be _*operated_* by a sport pilot because it happens to fit the FAR 1.1
definition of a LSA ( <= 1320 MTOW, fixed pitch, 2 seat, etc.) from a
performance, operation, or capability standpoint. The terms "LSA" or
"light
sport" are not relevant to the process of any ABE certification -- at all.
My Rebel is an ABE, and only an ABE, which for purposes of the
certification
process, is considered and processed no differently than an RV-10,
Long-EZ,
Lancair, Moose, etc. A sport pilot can fly it because it meets the
performance (etc.) parameters of the FAR 1.1 definition of a light sport
aircraft -- not because it is or isn't _certified_ as an LSA, which it
ain't, and can't be.

IMPORTANT: That distinction (that it is not and never could be an LSA as
that term is used in certification) is important and can really confuse
builders when filling out the Form 8130-6 application for the
airworthiness
cert, because on that form - confusing things even further -- you will see
check box references to things like "operating LSA" etc. that a builder
might think apply -- but DO NOT apply. The builder wishing to fly as a
sport
pilot should complete that form just like -- and only like -- the EAA
guidebook's example for any other ABE.

In short, I never expected (nor were there) any problems with empty weight
vs. listed GW in the ABE certification process. During the inspection --
including specific review of the required initial W&B statement -- it was
never even a point of discussion, nor should it have been. With a US ABE,
the only point where some "minimum usable load" might possibly ever come
into play is when, in the opinion of the DAR, there is so little usable
load
the plane cannot be prudently or safely operated at all, for example, it
would be impossible for someone to fly anywhere and still have reserves.
254R isn't even close!

I hope everyone will forgive me for holding forth on this again. It can be
confusing, and my attempts to explain it always seem to fall short of the
clarity necessary to get through this thicket.

Ron
254R



On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 9:25 PM, Eric Fogelin <elist@whidbey.com> wrote:

Excellent! So, no issues LSA? That is huge. You can always move up, but
can't move back down with LSA. Looks like real good flying weather this
week. Hmmm.

Good to see you at Arlington, if only briefly.

Eric

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ron
Shannon
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 3:18 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] 254R officially airworthy

254R received an 8130-7 Airworthiness Certificate today. I'm happy to
report
the DAR found nothing to critique and was very complimentary, saying he
really enjoyed inspecting the plane. Further proof is at
http://n254mr.com/node/1544

From here forward there's no hurry. However, be advised the next
deafening
WAHOO! type noise you hear may be emanating from the upper (US) left
coast.

Ron




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