[rebel-builders] Spinner for McCauley Kliptip TM 7653

[Bob Patterson]

Hi Garry !

No problem - you can easily use a UHS fiberglass spinner.
The 10" would look good ... You can get them from Spruce,
or order direct from UHS :
http://www.uhsspinners.com/

The prices are very good, under $200, and they work
well. You do have to trim the blade cutouts a bit, with a
Dremel grinder - pretty simple.... No backplate needed !

I had one on FOKM, back when it had the O-235 ....
worked well. You can order coloured resin - mine was red,
so no paint needed, and the colour goes right through.

--
......bobp
bobp@prosumers.ca
http://www.prosumers.ca/Ramble08

http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com
http://apatterson2.ordermygift.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Friday 12 September 2008 13:51, Garry wrote:

I have a McCauley Kliptip TM7653 re-pitched to 50" on FOKM. The spinner
was a McCauley and IMHO a very poor design. It is now trash due to
cracking and I do not want to replace it with an expensive certified
piece of similar junk. There seem to be two paths open for me - one
quite expensive.

I can sell the McCauley and buy a new prop and matched spinner. I am
familiar with the various opinions on this for the rebel on floats. It
has been well hashed over on this site. This will run into a fair bit of
money.

I can find a homebuilt spinner and adapt it to the McCauley. The prop
performs fairly well but probably not quite as well as a new one. Static
rpm reaches the permissible limit (2360) for the prop and WOT gets to
about 2620 which isn't too bad on an O320 limited to 2700 rpm.

Does anyone have any experience putting a spinner on a McCauley that is
not a McCauley spinner. What success/problems/spinner? If no direct
experience with this prop what traps, hitches, glitches, recommendations
can I find?

Garry
FOKM

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[Drew Dalgleish]

Hi Garry I've used a UHS fiberglass spinner with both my warp drive and
prince props. The one on the warp drive cracked after quite a few hours and
UHS replaced it for free. It only uses one bulkhead so it should work with
any prop.

At 07:51 AM 9/12/2008 -0600, you wrote:

I have a McCauley Kliptip TM7653 re-pitched to 50" on FOKM. The spinner
was a McCauley and IMHO a very poor design. It is now trash due to
cracking and I do not want to replace it with an expensive certified
piece of similar junk. There seem to be two paths open for me - one
quite expensive.

I can sell the McCauley and buy a new prop and matched spinner. I am
familiar with the various opinions on this for the rebel on floats. It
has been well hashed over on this site. This will run into a fair bit of
money.

I can find a homebuilt spinner and adapt it to the McCauley. The prop
performs fairly well but probably not quite as well as a new one. Static
rpm reaches the permissible limit (2360) for the prop and WOT gets to
about 2620 which isn't too bad on an O320 limited to 2700 rpm.

Does anyone have any experience putting a spinner on a McCauley that is
not a McCauley spinner. What success/problems/spinner? If no direct
experience with this prop what traps, hitches, glitches, recommendations
can I find?

Garry
FOKM



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Drew



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[jcole]

Hi Garry, WOC has the same UHS spinner - so if you have any pictures from our trip - take a look.

Cheers
Jim

On Fri, 12 Sep 2008 10:49:17 -0400, Drew Dalgleish <drewjan@cabletv.on.ca> wrote:

Hi Garry I've used a UHS fiberglass spinner with both my warp drive and
prince props. The one on the warp drive cracked after quite a few hours
and
UHS replaced it for free. It only uses one bulkhead so it should work with
any prop.

At 07:51 AM 9/12/2008 -0600, you wrote:

I have a McCauley Kliptip TM7653 re-pitched to 50" on FOKM. The spinner
was a McCauley and IMHO a very poor design. It is now trash due to
cracking and I do not want to replace it with an expensive certified
piece of similar junk. There seem to be two paths open for me - one
quite expensive.

I can sell the McCauley and buy a new prop and matched spinner. I am
familiar with the various opinions on this for the rebel on floats. It
has been well hashed over on this site. This will run into a fair bit of
money.

I can find a homebuilt spinner and adapt it to the McCauley. The prop
performs fairly well but probably not quite as well as a new one. Static
rpm reaches the permissible limit (2360) for the prop and WOT gets to
about 2620 which isn't too bad on an O320 limited to 2700 rpm.

Does anyone have any experience putting a spinner on a McCauley that is
not a McCauley spinner. What success/problems/spinner? If no direct
experience with this prop what traps, hitches, glitches, recommendations
can I find?

Garry
FOKM



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Drew



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[Garry]

Thanks Bob, Drew and Jim.

I looked at WOC and XWI from last year's ramble. FOKM's old spinner is
13" and it looks good like that. I gather XWI has some other brand of
spinner. It looks like about 13" as well. Has anyone ever experienced
these things falling apart due to lack of support with only one support
plate?

Garry

Bob Patterson wrote:

Hi Garry !

No problem - you can easily use a UHS fiberglass spinner.
The 10" would look good ... You can get them from Spruce,
or order direct from UHS :
http://www.uhsspinners.com/

The prices are very good, under $200, and they work
well. You do have to trim the blade cutouts a bit, with a
Dremel grinder - pretty simple.... No backplate needed !

I had one on FOKM, back when it had the O-235 ....
worked well. You can order coloured resin - mine was red,
so no paint needed, and the colour goes right through.

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[Drew Dalgleish]

Uhs makes a 13" one as well. My spinner failed by cracking from the base to
the tip in flight and I never knew it until I was back on the ground. Mine
was pre-cut for the warp drive prop and there's a couple extra layers of
glass added before the cut-outs are made just around the hole. The worker
that finished my spinner made the cut-outs between the reinforcements
instead of through them. UHS replaced the spinner and apologised for the
mistake.

If you really want an aluminum one you could always try making your own it
looks easy when you watch this guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gwrk0SwD ... re=related


At 01:04 PM 9/12/2008 -0600, you wrote:

Thanks Bob, Drew and Jim.

I looked at WOC and XWI from last year's ramble. FOKM's old spinner is
13" and it looks good like that. I gather XWI has some other brand of
spinner. It looks like about 13" as well. Has anyone ever experienced
these things falling apart due to lack of support with only one support
plate?

Garry

Bob Patterson wrote:

Hi Garry !

No problem - you can easily use a UHS fiberglass spinner.
The 10" would look good ... You can get them from Spruce,
or order direct from UHS :
http://www.uhsspinners.com/

The prices are very good, under $200, and they work
well. You do have to trim the blade cutouts a bit, with a
Dremel grinder - pretty simple.... No backplate needed !

I had one on FOKM, back when it had the O-235 ....
worked well. You can order coloured resin - mine was red,
so no paint needed, and the colour goes right through.

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Drew



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[Garry]

Thanks Drew. That was really interesting but I would probably have a
shop full of unsuccessful ones long before I got one that worked. :-D
Thanks for the description of why your first one failed. It is an easy
inspection item prior to assembly for that possible flaw. When it
failed, was there a substantial risk of it flying apart? When you say it
cracked, was it a surface thing only when you discovered it?

Garry

Drew Dalgleish wrote:

Uhs makes a 13" one as well. My spinner failed by cracking from the base to
the tip in flight and I never knew it until I was back on the ground. Mine
was pre-cut for the warp drive prop and there's a couple extra layers of
glass added before the cut-outs are made just around the hole. The worker
that finished my spinner made the cut-outs between the reinforcements
instead of through them. UHS replaced the spinner and apologised for the
mistake.

If you really want an aluminum one you could always try making your own it
looks easy when you watch this guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gwrk0SwD ... re=related


At 01:04 PM 9/12/2008 -0600, you wrote:

Thanks Bob, Drew and Jim.

I looked at WOC and XWI from last year's ramble. FOKM's old spinner is
13" and it looks good like that. I gather XWI has some other brand of
spinner. It looks like about 13" as well. Has anyone ever experienced
these things falling apart due to lack of support with only one support
plate?

Garry

Bob Patterson wrote:

Hi Garry !

No problem - you can easily use a UHS fiberglass spinner.
The 10" would look good ... You can get them from Spruce,
or order direct from UHS :
http://www.uhsspinners.com/

The prices are very good, under $200, and they work
well. You do have to trim the blade cutouts a bit, with a
Dremel grinder - pretty simple.... No backplate needed !

I had one on FOKM, back when it had the O-235 ....
worked well. You can order coloured resin - mine was red,
so no paint needed, and the colour goes right through.

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Drew



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[Drew Dalgleish]

At 06:38 AM 9/13/2008 -0600, you wrote:

Thanks Drew. That was really interesting but I would probably have a
shop full of unsuccessful ones long before I got one that worked. :-D
Thanks for the description of why your first one failed. It is an easy
inspection item prior to assembly for that possible flaw. When it
failed, was there a substantial risk of it flying apart? When you say it
cracked, was it a surface thing only when you discovered it?

Garry

I assume that the spinner and bulkhead are assembled together then the
cut-outs are made to both at the same time. The only person who could
easily inspect the assembly is probably the same person who screwed the 2
pieces together. I doubt it would have would have flown apart just because
I flew it home without even knowing about the crack. When I found it the
crack was right through the fiberglass.
Drew



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[Garry]

I thought you had to unscrew it in order that you could mount the
bulkhead under the front retainer plate, then remount the spinner to the
bulkhead. Wouldn't that give the opportunity to do the inspection? Do I
have the wrong sense of how this goes together?

I guess the reason I keep poking at this it that the guys who built the
Titan P5151 couldn't make a fiberglass spinner hold together - it was a
larger diameter - I think 16" or more. It would just fly apart. They
could do it with carbon fiber though. Also a spinner that might depart
the aircraft or partially do so could be a pretty severe event. If you
had a complete longitudinal crack, then the only thing holding it
together against centripetal force would be the screws into the
bulkhead. I don't think it would stay on like that for long.

Garry

Drew Dalgleish wrote:

At 06:38 AM 9/13/2008 -0600, you wrote:

Thanks Drew. That was really interesting but I would probably have a
shop full of unsuccessful ones long before I got one that worked. :-D
Thanks for the description of why your first one failed. It is an easy
inspection item prior to assembly for that possible flaw. When it
failed, was there a substantial risk of it flying apart? When you say it
cracked, was it a surface thing only when you discovered it?

Garry

I assume that the spinner and bulkhead are assembled together then the
cut-outs are made to both at the same time. The only person who could
easily inspect the assembly is probably the same person who screwed the 2
pieces together. I doubt it would have would have flown apart just because
I flew it home without even knowing about the crack. When I found it the
crack was right through the fiberglass.
Drew



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[Drew Dalgleish]

You are correct that I had to take it apart to mount it and I did inspect
it. However I was blissfully unaware of the reason for the extra squares of
fabric in the layup. After it cracked it was held together by the screws in
the bulkhead and the fiberglass at the tip of the spinner. It could have
flown apart and it had the potential to be a severe event but I think that
at the speed a rebel travels at and the very light weight of the spinner
losing all or part of it in flight wouldn't be that severe. I'm not a math
whiz but I think the stresses on a 16" spinner would be about 10x the
stresses on a 13"one maybe even greater if they increased the lenghth to
keep in porportion with the increased diameter.

At 08:18 AM 9/14/2008 -0600, you wrote:

I thought you had to unscrew it in order that you could mount the
bulkhead under the front retainer plate, then remount the spinner to the
bulkhead. Wouldn't that give the opportunity to do the inspection? Do I
have the wrong sense of how this goes together?

I guess the reason I keep poking at this it that the guys who built the
Titan P5151 couldn't make a fiberglass spinner hold together - it was a
larger diameter - I think 16" or more. It would just fly apart. They
could do it with carbon fiber though. Also a spinner that might depart
the aircraft or partially do so could be a pretty severe event. If you
had a complete longitudinal crack, then the only thing holding it
together against centripetal force would be the screws into the
bulkhead. I don't think it would stay on like that for long.

Garry

Drew



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[Garry]

Thanks Drew. I'm waffling about the diameter right now. I have decided
to go with the UHS unit but my diameter could be anywhere from 9" to 13"
which was the old spinner diameter. I'm not clear yet on the advantage
of either over the other. There is a small price differential and the
larger one will probably provide a smoother transition for air into the
cowl openings. I wonder if anyone knows some detail on that?

Garry

Drew Dalgleish wrote:

You are correct that I had to take it apart to mount it and I did inspect
it. However I was blissfully unaware of the reason for the extra squares of
fabric in the layup. After it cracked it was held together by the screws in
the bulkhead and the fiberglass at the tip of the spinner. It could have
flown apart and it had the potential to be a severe event but I think that
at the speed a rebel travels at and the very light weight of the spinner
losing all or part of it in flight wouldn't be that severe. I'm not a math
whiz but I think the stresses on a 16" spinner would be about 10x the
stresses on a 13"one maybe even greater if they increased the lenghth to
keep in porportion with the increased diameter.

At 08:18 AM 9/14/2008 -0600, you wrote:

I thought you had to unscrew it in order that you could mount the
bulkhead under the front retainer plate, then remount the spinner to the
bulkhead. Wouldn't that give the opportunity to do the inspection? Do I
have the wrong sense of how this goes together?

I guess the reason I keep poking at this it that the guys who built the
Titan P5151 couldn't make a fiberglass spinner hold together - it was a
larger diameter - I think 16" or more. It would just fly apart. They
could do it with carbon fiber though. Also a spinner that might depart
the aircraft or partially do so could be a pretty severe event. If you
had a complete longitudinal crack, then the only thing holding it
together against centripetal force would be the screws into the
bulkhead. I don't think it would stay on like that for long.

Garry

Drew



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