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[rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies

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Bob Patterson

[rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies

Post by Bob Patterson » Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:16 pm

Sorry Walter - not current anymore ..... But I would be surprised if
any of them wouldn't work now. The 'real Rotax' filters have pressure
relief bypasses built in ..... maybe the others do too .... I liked the
FRAM, and used the CTC ones mostly, for 1,000 hours of trouble free
flying ... Did change oil mostly at 25 hours - pretty cheap insurance !
What is the latest oil recommendation ??

The spark plugs should be OK for a 912 -- not likely for the "S" ...
That number was originally suggested by Rotax, with the revised harness.
The battery - wellll, these days I guess most folks would be using
the Odyssey sealed batteries... not that the old one wouldn't work,
but you don't need a fancy box & drain for the Odysseys ..

Of course, Rotax say you should ONLY use 'genuine Rotax' parts -
and I guess you have to, for warranty .... Personally, I'd still be
inclined to break in (maybe 200 hours) with Castrol GTX oil - just so
it wears a bit & seats in --- nothing wears with the synthetic !!
Also, I would still be running 100 LL when travelling - it's waaay
too much hassle to get mogas - and quality is very variable on the road,
and it's politically un-nice to stop at an FBO and not buy his fuel,
especially since you use so little anyway .... But that's just me ...

--
......bobp
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Friday 17 August 2007 00:40, Walter Klatt wrote:
Any update to this? I know the oil has changed. Are spark plugs and oil
filters still the same?

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com [mailto:murphy-rebel@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Patterson
Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2001 11:35 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Rotax 912 supplies

Hi Everybody !

I've collected all the numbers for various bits for the 912-powered
Rebel that I've used over the years. Might be handy to have in one place,
considering it might be sold soon.....
(It's advertised in Sept. COPA for only $47,000, and I've already had
<2> (lowball) offers !)

I hope some of these might be useful for those of you already
building or flying Rebels with the Rotax 912 (or 912-S). <I> think
that this is a GREAT recipe for a FUN flying machine that is CHEAP to
run ! Cruise at 97 mph, stall at 30, carry hundreds of pounds of camping
gear, and burn only 3 gallons/hour of auto fuel !!! Hard to beat !
And, it performs very well on Murphy 1500 straight floats, too !
(See the front of the Murphy brochure ! ;-) )


All of these are for the Rotax 912.

Here are the numbers for oil filters I've used:
-----------------------------------------------

Canadian Tire 17-1748-8

Fram PH3614

NAPA 1348

Purolator FC603

K-Mart K0241


Oil is :
---------

Canadian Tire 2000 Synthetic 15-50

Mobil 1 Synthetic 20-50

Castrol GTX 20-50

Castrol GTX 40 (for hot summer conditions)


The spark plugs I now use are:
------------------------------

NGK DCPR7E - from an auto parts jobber, in boxes of 10 (~$2.50
ea.)


The battery is:
---------------

Canadian Tire CTC-27-1014-0 (12-N14-3A)
(Motorcycle/lawn tractor)


Exhaust stack extentions: (for stock Murphy mufflers)
--------------------------

Canadian Tire CTC 12-8590B/07770 (1 1/2" ID)


Ignition key switch:
--------------------

Echlin KS 6180 (from automotive jobber)


Prop is:
--------

GSC ground adjustable 2 blade - 72", model M670 (pitch is about
40") (GSC also has a NICE variable-pitch prop for about $1,500 !)
--------------

Brake fluid is:
---------------

Canadian Tire Automotive automatic transmission fluid (Dextron II)
----------------------------

Hope some of this is useful - please pass it on.


.....bobp


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Walter Klatt

[rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies

Post by Walter Klatt » Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:16 pm

Yeah, they have a list of acceptable oils in their service instruction
documents, and it has changed. The most important thing is that the 912
needs motorcycle oil quality because of the gearbox, and has to withstand
high heat and no foaming. The Mobil 1 synthetic is still on their list but
not with 100LL.

On the filters, I have found the Fram 3614 filter is longer than the
standard Rotax one and may interfere with the exhaust pipe in some
installations.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Bob
Patterson
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2007 6:39 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies


Sorry Walter - not current anymore ..... But I would be surprised if
any of them wouldn't work now. The 'real Rotax' filters have pressure
relief bypasses built in ..... maybe the others do too .... I liked
the
FRAM, and used the CTC ones mostly, for 1,000 hours of trouble free
flying ... Did change oil mostly at 25 hours - pretty cheap insurance !
What is the latest oil recommendation ??

The spark plugs should be OK for a 912 -- not likely for the "S" ...
That number was originally suggested by Rotax, with the revised harness.
The battery - wellll, these days I guess most folks would be using
the Odyssey sealed batteries... not that the old one wouldn't work,
but you don't need a fancy box & drain for the Odysseys ..

Of course, Rotax say you should ONLY use 'genuine Rotax' parts -
and I guess you have to, for warranty .... Personally, I'd still be
inclined to break in (maybe 200 hours) with Castrol GTX oil - just so
it wears a bit & seats in --- nothing wears with the synthetic !!
Also, I would still be running 100 LL when travelling - it's waaay
too much hassle to get mogas - and quality is very variable on the road,
and it's politically un-nice to stop at an FBO and not buy his fuel,
especially since you use so little anyway .... But that's just me ...

--
......bobp
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Friday 17 August 2007 00:40, Walter Klatt wrote:
Any update to this? I know the oil has changed. Are spark plugs and oil
filters still the same?

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com [mailto:murphy-rebel@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Patterson
Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2001 11:35 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Rotax 912 supplies

Hi Everybody !

I've collected all the numbers for various bits for the
912-powered
Rebel that I've used over the years. Might be handy to have in one place,
considering it might be sold soon.....
(It's advertised in Sept. COPA for only $47,000, and I've already had
<2> (lowball) offers !)

I hope some of these might be useful for those of you already
building or flying Rebels with the Rotax 912 (or 912-S). <I> think
that this is a GREAT recipe for a FUN flying machine that is CHEAP to
run ! Cruise at 97 mph, stall at 30, carry hundreds of pounds of camping
gear, and burn only 3 gallons/hour of auto fuel !!! Hard to beat !
And, it performs very well on Murphy 1500 straight floats, too !
(See the front of the Murphy brochure ! ;-) )


All of these are for the Rotax 912.

Here are the numbers for oil filters I've used:
-----------------------------------------------

Canadian Tire 17-1748-8

Fram PH3614

NAPA 1348

Purolator FC603

K-Mart K0241


Oil is :
---------

Canadian Tire 2000 Synthetic 15-50

Mobil 1 Synthetic 20-50

Castrol GTX 20-50

Castrol GTX 40 (for hot summer conditions)


The spark plugs I now use are:
------------------------------

NGK DCPR7E - from an auto parts jobber, in boxes of 10
(~$2.50
ea.)


The battery is:
---------------

Canadian Tire CTC-27-1014-0 (12-N14-3A)
(Motorcycle/lawn tractor)


Exhaust stack extentions: (for stock Murphy mufflers)
--------------------------

Canadian Tire CTC 12-8590B/07770 (1 1/2" ID)


Ignition key switch:
--------------------

Echlin KS 6180 (from automotive jobber)


Prop is:
--------

GSC ground adjustable 2 blade - 72", model M670 (pitch is about
40") (GSC also has a NICE variable-pitch prop for about $1,500 !)
--------------

Brake fluid is:
---------------

Canadian Tire Automotive automatic transmission fluid (Dextron II)
----------------------------

Hope some of this is useful - please pass it on.


.....bobp


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bransom

[rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies

Post by bransom » Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:16 pm

Bob,
Is that ~40" prop setting considered fine, medium, or cruise? This is the
80hp 912 too, right? I've always wanted a 150hp Rebel but you make this
pretty tempting. Ground roll shorter for take-off and landing, more useful
load (assuming Exp category), only ~15mph slower cruise than 0320 (if 912S
with var pitch).

0320 still the choice if operating higher and/or w/ floats, and/or if a
little bit of those two plus the vanity that I want to hear 4 big bore
cylinders at 2400 instead of 4 small ones at twice that and a gearbox.
Vanity usually is expensive, dangit.
-Ben
Hi Everybody !

I've collected all the numbers for various bits for the
912-powered
Rebel that I've used over the years. Might be handy to have in one place,
considering it might be sold soon.....
(It's advertised in Sept. COPA for only $47,000, and I've already had
<2> (lowball) offers !)

I hope some of these might be useful for those of you already
building or flying Rebels with the Rotax 912 (or 912-S). <I> think
that this is a GREAT recipe for a FUN flying machine that is CHEAP to
run ! Cruise at 97 mph, stall at 30, carry hundreds of pounds of camping
gear, and burn only 3 gallons/hour of auto fuel !!! Hard to beat !
And, it performs very well on Murphy 1500 straight floats, too !
(See the front of the Murphy brochure ! ;-) )


All of these are for the Rotax 912.

Here are the numbers for oil filters I've used:
-----------------------------------------------

Canadian Tire 17-1748-8

Fram PH3614

NAPA 1348

Purolator FC603

K-Mart K0241


Oil is :
---------

Canadian Tire 2000 Synthetic 15-50

Mobil 1 Synthetic 20-50

Castrol GTX 20-50

Castrol GTX 40 (for hot summer conditions)


The spark plugs I now use are:
------------------------------

NGK DCPR7E - from an auto parts jobber, in boxes of 10
(~$2.50
ea.)


The battery is:
---------------

Canadian Tire CTC-27-1014-0 (12-N14-3A)
(Motorcycle/lawn tractor)


Exhaust stack extentions: (for stock Murphy mufflers)
--------------------------

Canadian Tire CTC 12-8590B/07770 (1 1/2" ID)


Ignition key switch:
--------------------

Echlin KS 6180 (from automotive jobber)


Prop is:
--------

GSC ground adjustable 2 blade - 72", model M670 (pitch is about
40") (GSC also has a NICE variable-pitch prop for about $1,500 !)
--------------

Brake fluid is:
---------------

Canadian Tire Automotive automatic transmission fluid (Dextron II)
----------------------------

Hope some of this is useful - please pass it on.


.....bobp


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Bob Patterson

[rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies

Post by Bob Patterson » Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:16 pm

Hi Ben !

The approx. 40" was a SWAG - I just used an arbitrary angle, once
I found one that worked .... It was a bit on the fine side of medium,
climb being most important on cross countries ! (contrary to
popular opinion ! ;-) )

I would expect only about 8 mph slower on cruise, with
a 912-S and variable pitch. I once set the 80 hp prop a bit too
coarse, and got 110 mph cruise -- at the expense of climb ! :-(

And as for high - we had TWO 912 Rebels on the Ramble - through
the Rocks we had temperatures in the high 90's, and airports were all
in the 3,500 - 4,000 ft elevations ... It was just as tough with the
O-320 .... There was one 80 hp, and one 100 hp. 912-S.

Expense is right !! I used just under $2,500 worth of fuel - the
80 hp Rotax apparently burned about $880 worth ..... :-(

My NEXT Rebel will have a 912-S ! Tried to get a head start
on it last week -- oh, well ..... soooooon !

--
......bobp
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Friday 17 August 2007 19:24, bransom@dcsol.com wrote:
Bob,
Is that ~40" prop setting considered fine, medium, or cruise? This is the
80hp 912 too, right? I've always wanted a 150hp Rebel but you make this
pretty tempting. Ground roll shorter for take-off and landing, more useful
load (assuming Exp category), only ~15mph slower cruise than 0320 (if 912S
with var pitch).

0320 still the choice if operating higher and/or w/ floats, and/or if a
little bit of those two plus the vanity that I want to hear 4 big bore
cylinders at 2400 instead of 4 small ones at twice that and a gearbox.
Vanity usually is expensive, dangit.
-Ben
Hi Everybody !

I've collected all the numbers for various bits for the
912-powered
Rebel that I've used over the years. Might be handy to have in one
place, considering it might be sold soon.....
(It's advertised in Sept. COPA for only $47,000, and I've already had
<2> (lowball) offers !)

I hope some of these might be useful for those of you already
building or flying Rebels with the Rotax 912 (or 912-S). <I> think
that this is a GREAT recipe for a FUN flying machine that is CHEAP to
run ! Cruise at 97 mph, stall at 30, carry hundreds of pounds of
camping gear, and burn only 3 gallons/hour of auto fuel !!! Hard to
beat ! And, it performs very well on Murphy 1500 straight floats, too !
(See the front of the Murphy brochure ! ;-) )


All of these are for the Rotax 912.

Here are the numbers for oil filters I've used:
-----------------------------------------------

Canadian Tire 17-1748-8

Fram PH3614

NAPA 1348

Purolator FC603

K-Mart K0241


Oil is :
---------

Canadian Tire 2000 Synthetic 15-50

Mobil 1 Synthetic 20-50

Castrol GTX 20-50

Castrol GTX 40 (for hot summer conditions)


The spark plugs I now use are:
------------------------------

NGK DCPR7E - from an auto parts jobber, in boxes of 10
(~$2.50
ea.)


The battery is:
---------------

Canadian Tire CTC-27-1014-0 (12-N14-3A)
(Motorcycle/lawn tractor)


Exhaust stack extentions: (for stock Murphy mufflers)
--------------------------

Canadian Tire CTC 12-8590B/07770 (1 1/2" ID)


Ignition key switch:
--------------------

Echlin KS 6180 (from automotive jobber)


Prop is:
--------

GSC ground adjustable 2 blade - 72", model M670 (pitch is about
40") (GSC also has a NICE variable-pitch prop for about $1,500 !)
--------------

Brake fluid is:
---------------

Canadian Tire Automotive automatic transmission fluid (Dextron
II) ----------------------------

Hope some of this is useful - please pass it on.


.....bobp

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Ken

[rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies

Post by Ken » Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:16 pm

FWIW I'm careful with oil filters as even the name brands and oem
filters seem to change manufacturers regularly. Lately I'm seeing some
brands with plastic pressure relief valves, and plastic or "cardboard"
cages on the inside of the filter medium instead of metal. On long
climbs the oil temp (synthetic) in the soob sometimes runs at 120*C
which is 20 hotter than any car that I've owned. Don't know if it really
matters but plastic parts bother me and Luberfine, and Fram are
currently off my list for acceptable 3614 filters. I will use them on
automobiles but not on the airplane. I have been using Autosense filters
(same as Wix I think) but the last ones purchased are now made in
Poland. They look OK but I need to open one and check the relief valve
and construction. I'd gladly pay a lot more for quality if I could find
it. Interestingly the actual filter medium is not a major concern for me.

I toured a filter manufacturer many years ago. They must of had a
hundred silk screens with different names depending on who they were
manufacturing for at that particular moment. The filters were identical
regardless of whose name went on them.

Ken

Walter Klatt wrote:
Yeah, they have a list of acceptable oils in their service instruction
documents, and it has changed. The most important thing is that the 912
needs motorcycle oil quality because of the gearbox, and has to withstand
high heat and no foaming. The Mobil 1 synthetic is still on their list but
not with 100LL.

On the filters, I have found the Fram 3614 filter is longer than the
standard Rotax one and may interfere with the exhaust pipe in some
installations.

Walter




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Drew Dalgleish

[rebel-builders] RE: Rotax 912 supplies

Post by Drew Dalgleish » Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:16 pm

Thanks Ken. I've always judged a filter by the length of the media but now
I'll look at the other components as well. I use carquest filters which I
believe are made by wix also. Fram has been off my list for a long time I
think they've cut way back on quality in order to meet a wal-mart price point.


At 10:57 PM 8/17/2007 -0400, you wrote:
FWIW I'm careful with oil filters as even the name brands and oem
filters seem to change manufacturers regularly. Lately I'm seeing some
brands with plastic pressure relief valves, and plastic or "cardboard"
cages on the inside of the filter medium instead of metal. On long
climbs the oil temp (synthetic) in the soob sometimes runs at 120*C
which is 20 hotter than any car that I've owned. Don't know if it really
matters but plastic parts bother me and Luberfine, and Fram are
currently off my list for acceptable 3614 filters. I will use them on
automobiles but not on the airplane. I have been using Autosense filters
(same as Wix I think) but the last ones purchased are now made in
Poland. They look OK but I need to open one and check the relief valve
and construction. I'd gladly pay a lot more for quality if I could find
it. Interestingly the actual filter medium is not a major concern for me.

I toured a filter manufacturer many years ago. They must of had a
hundred silk screens with different names depending on who they were
manufacturing for at that particular moment. The filters were identical
regardless of whose name went on them.

Ken

Walter Klatt wrote:
Yeah, they have a list of acceptable oils in their service instruction
documents, and it has changed. The most important thing is that the 912
needs motorcycle oil quality because of the gearbox, and has to withstand
high heat and no foaming. The Mobil 1 synthetic is still on their list but
not with 100LL.

On the filters, I have found the Fram 3614 filter is longer than the
standard Rotax one and may interfere with the exhaust pipe in some
installations.

Walter




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Drew



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