Moose--landings--tail "noise"--solved

[Ted Waltman]

Figured out what the noise is that I've heard since day one on landings
from the rear of the plane (on rough fields that is). Hard to describe,
but, while I always wondered, I wrote it off to "just everything flexing
around."

Today I was flexing the tailwheel with my foot after flying and one of
my A&P buddies noticed the fuselage forward of Station G oil canning
(pic posted on site under 107 - S/M Fuselage [make sure you select the
.jpg version if there are two out there--one's huge--I uploaded the .psd
one first by mistake]).

I have 215 hours on my Moose with no sign of fuselage problems (e.g.
bends, popped rivets) but seeing the fuselage flex there has me
wondering if I should add maybe some witches hat or other stiffener back
there. My friend said to simply use something like the below damping
material from Aircraft Spruce. He also suggested some of the insulation
/ heat shield one can get from an auto parts store--I searched a couple
of on-line auto places and couldnt' find anything comparable to the link
below.

I'd appreciate getting input from the group on this one--do I need to
add some strengthener to the fuselage or use some product like that
below to just dampen the noise?

Thank you,

Ted Waltman
Moose N142SR

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... panels.php

SOUND & VIBRATION DAMPING PANELS

Designed for damping resonant vibrations of thin sheet metal, these
panels are pressure sensitive, specially compounded polyurethane damping
foam with an aluminum foil backing. The adhesive on the foam is
protected by a peel-off paper covering. It is an excellent insulator for
conducted heat and is an excellent heat reflector. Fireresistant and
self-extinguishing per FAA test procedure. Excellent moisture
resistance. Resistant to most solvents. Easily applied with only hand
pressure for a permanent bond even on rough, irregular surfaces. Used
extensively in commercial aircraft and highly recommended for metal home
builts. Apply to firewall, fuselage - anywhere a vibration problem
exists. Wt.4 oz./sq. ft., 1/4" thick. 6" x 48" (2 sq. ft.) P/N 09-30200
..................$21.60ea.





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[Scott Aldrich]

Ted, we added channel down the center of those side panels because they
seemed too tin canny. I noticed the bottom of the panel that is just aft of
the cargo door will still tin can when I pick the tail up.
FWIW
Scott
Moose 174


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ted
Waltman
Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 7:14 PM
To: 'Murphy List'
Subject: Moose--landings--tail "noise"--solved

Figured out what the noise is that I've heard since day one on landings
from the rear of the plane (on rough fields that is). Hard to describe,
but, while I always wondered, I wrote it off to "just everything flexing
around."

Today I was flexing the tailwheel with my foot after flying and one of
my A&P buddies noticed the fuselage forward of Station G oil canning
(pic posted on site under 107 - S/M Fuselage [make sure you select the
.jpg version if there are two out there--one's huge--I uploaded the .psd
one first by mistake]).

I have 215 hours on my Moose with no sign of fuselage problems (e.g.
bends, popped rivets) but seeing the fuselage flex there has me
wondering if I should add maybe some witches hat or other stiffener back
there. My friend said to simply use something like the below damping
material from Aircraft Spruce. He also suggested some of the insulation
/ heat shield one can get from an auto parts store--I searched a couple
of on-line auto places and couldnt' find anything comparable to the link
below.

I'd appreciate getting input from the group on this one--do I need to
add some strengthener to the fuselage or use some product like that
below to just dampen the noise?

Thank you,

Ted Waltman
Moose N142SR

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... panels.php

SOUND & VIBRATION DAMPING PANELS

Designed for damping resonant vibrations of thin sheet metal, these
panels are pressure sensitive, specially compounded polyurethane damping
foam with an aluminum foil backing. The adhesive on the foam is
protected by a peel-off paper covering. It is an excellent insulator for
conducted heat and is an excellent heat reflector. Fireresistant and
self-extinguishing per FAA test procedure. Excellent moisture
resistance. Resistant to most solvents. Easily applied with only hand
pressure for a permanent bond even on rough, irregular surfaces. Used
extensively in commercial aircraft and highly recommended for metal home
builts. Apply to firewall, fuselage - anywhere a vibration problem
exists. Wt.4 oz./sq. ft., 1/4" thick. 6" x 48" (2 sq. ft.) P/N 09-30200
..................$21.60ea.





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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Nice thing you've got going for you Ted is no paint!

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: "'Murphy List'" <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 9:14 PM
Subject: Moose--landings--tail "noise"--solved

Figured out what the noise is that I've heard since day one on landings
from the rear of the plane (on rough fields that is). Hard to describe,
but, while I always wondered, I wrote it off to "just everything flexing
around."

Today I was flexing the tailwheel with my foot after flying and one of
my A&P buddies noticed the fuselage forward of Station G oil canning
(pic posted on site under 107 - S/M Fuselage [make sure you select the
.jpg version if there are two out there--one's huge--I uploaded the .psd
one first by mistake]).

I have 215 hours on my Moose with no sign of fuselage problems (e.g.
bends, popped rivets) but seeing the fuselage flex there has me
wondering if I should add maybe some witches hat or other stiffener back
there. My friend said to simply use something like the below damping
material from Aircraft Spruce. He also suggested some of the insulation
/ heat shield one can get from an auto parts store--I searched a couple
of on-line auto places and couldnt' find anything comparable to the link
below.

I'd appreciate getting input from the group on this one--do I need to
add some strengthener to the fuselage or use some product like that
below to just dampen the noise?

Thank you,

Ted Waltman
Moose N142SR

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... panels.php

SOUND & VIBRATION DAMPING PANELS

Designed for damping resonant vibrations of thin sheet metal, these
panels are pressure sensitive, specially compounded polyurethane damping
foam with an aluminum foil backing. The adhesive on the foam is
protected by a peel-off paper covering. It is an excellent insulator for
conducted heat and is an excellent heat reflector. Fireresistant and
self-extinguishing per FAA test procedure. Excellent moisture
resistance. Resistant to most solvents. Easily applied with only hand
pressure for a permanent bond even on rough, irregular surfaces. Used
extensively in commercial aircraft and highly recommended for metal home
builts. Apply to firewall, fuselage - anywhere a vibration problem
exists. Wt.4 oz./sq. ft., 1/4" thick. 6" x 48" (2 sq. ft.) P/N 09-30200
..................$21.60ea.





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[Mike Rapoport]

Hello Ted, where can we find the pictures? Thanks

Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: "'Murphy List'" <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 6:14 PM
Subject: Moose--landings--tail "noise"--solved

Figured out what the noise is that I've heard since day one on landings
from the rear of the plane (on rough fields that is). Hard to describe,
but, while I always wondered, I wrote it off to "just everything flexing
around."

Today I was flexing the tailwheel with my foot after flying and one of
my A&P buddies noticed the fuselage forward of Station G oil canning
(pic posted on site under 107 - S/M Fuselage [make sure you select the
.jpg version if there are two out there--one's huge--I uploaded the .psd
one first by mistake]).

I have 215 hours on my Moose with no sign of fuselage problems (e.g.
bends, popped rivets) but seeing the fuselage flex there has me
wondering if I should add maybe some witches hat or other stiffener back
there. My friend said to simply use something like the below damping
material from Aircraft Spruce. He also suggested some of the insulation
/ heat shield one can get from an auto parts store--I searched a couple
of on-line auto places and couldnt' find anything comparable to the link
below.

I'd appreciate getting input from the group on this one--do I need to
add some strengthener to the fuselage or use some product like that
below to just dampen the noise?

Thank you,

Ted Waltman
Moose N142SR

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... panels.php

SOUND & VIBRATION DAMPING PANELS

Designed for damping resonant vibrations of thin sheet metal, these
panels are pressure sensitive, specially compounded polyurethane damping
foam with an aluminum foil backing. The adhesive on the foam is
protected by a peel-off paper covering. It is an excellent insulator for
conducted heat and is an excellent heat reflector. Fireresistant and
self-extinguishing per FAA test procedure. Excellent moisture
resistance. Resistant to most solvents. Easily applied with only hand
pressure for a permanent bond even on rough, irregular surfaces. Used
extensively in commercial aircraft and highly recommended for metal home
builts. Apply to firewall, fuselage - anywhere a vibration problem
exists. Wt.4 oz./sq. ft., 1/4" thick. 6" x 48" (2 sq. ft.) P/N 09-30200
..................$21.60ea.





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[Mike Davis]

What I have thought of doing when I get to the point of tail cone
construction is using wing stringers down the sides. They should fit in the
channel made for the bend on the edge of the side panels, and pick up the
same rivets that are used to connect the corner wraps and side panels
together. I would imagine that they will provide considerably more strength
in this area than the small flange on the edge of the side panels by itself.

Another builder here in Fairbanks made witches hats to run between each
bulkhead, top and bottom of the side panels... there sure are a lot of
rivets on the side of his fuselage!

Mike
195SR

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Waltman" <tedwaltman@i1ci.com>
To: "'Murphy List'" <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 5:14 PM
Subject: Moose--landings--tail "noise"--solved

Figured out what the noise is that I've heard since day one on landings
from the rear of the plane (on rough fields that is). Hard to describe,
but, while I always wondered, I wrote it off to "just everything flexing
around."

Today I was flexing the tailwheel with my foot after flying and one of
my A&P buddies noticed the fuselage forward of Station G oil canning
(pic posted on site under 107 - S/M Fuselage [make sure you select the
.jpg version if there are two out there--one's huge--I uploaded the .psd
one first by mistake]).

I have 215 hours on my Moose with no sign of fuselage problems (e.g.
bends, popped rivets) but seeing the fuselage flex there has me
wondering if I should add maybe some witches hat or other stiffener back
there. My friend said to simply use something like the below damping
material from Aircraft Spruce. He also suggested some of the insulation
/ heat shield one can get from an auto parts store--I searched a couple
of on-line auto places and couldnt' find anything comparable to the link
below.

I'd appreciate getting input from the group on this one--do I need to
add some strengthener to the fuselage or use some product like that
below to just dampen the noise?

Thank you,

Ted Waltman
Moose N142SR

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/a ... panels.php

SOUND & VIBRATION DAMPING PANELS

Designed for damping resonant vibrations of thin sheet metal, these
panels are pressure sensitive, specially compounded polyurethane damping
foam with an aluminum foil backing. The adhesive on the foam is
protected by a peel-off paper covering. It is an excellent insulator for
conducted heat and is an excellent heat reflector. Fireresistant and
self-extinguishing per FAA test procedure. Excellent moisture
resistance. Resistant to most solvents. Easily applied with only hand
pressure for a permanent bond even on rough, irregular surfaces. Used
extensively in commercial aircraft and highly recommended for metal home
builts. Apply to firewall, fuselage - anywhere a vibration problem
exists. Wt.4 oz./sq. ft., 1/4" thick. 6" x 48" (2 sq. ft.) P/N 09-30200
..................$21.60ea.





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[Mike Davis]

https://www.dcsol.com/file/area107/StationEFG.jpg

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Rapoport" <rapopor1@ix.netcom.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 5:54 PM
Subject: Re: Moose--landings--tail "noise"--solved

Hello Ted, where can we find the pictures? Thanks

Mike

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[Skytrucks]

Ted; A good friend of mine sprays foam insulation. I may have him spray some
in critical places like you just mentioned. It is VERY strong and light. I
have some samples here that you could look at if you get back here to Columbus
Montana some time.
Larry
Luckinbill
SR
117 Moose




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