wing alignment

[mbetti]

I read ahead on the attaching of wings to fuselage. What controls keeping
the 2 wings straight across the front? It appears that the 1 9/16

[Scott Aldrich]

Mike, I can't answer the first part (due to fast build wings) but I know of
at least three Moose with eccentric attach points on the rear fuselage wing
spar bracket. One used the stock aft bracket but two of us remade them so we
would have greater edge distance if we need the eccentric. These are all
fast builds.

Scott
Moose 174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
mbetti@up.net
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 8:22 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: wing alignment


I read ahead on the attaching of wings to fuselage. What controls keeping
the 2 wings straight across the front? It appears that the 1 9/16" mea
surement to the front attach point when building the wing applies somewha
t, but that doesn't seem enough to keep everything square. Wouldn't a
small amount of movement in the root make a lot of change out on the tip
? With the wing rear and front spars not being prepunched and don't see
this being controlled very well and with just the ribs connecting everyt
hing, they seem to flop around to align anything. So then is it the skins
that keep everything square? I hate to be looking from overhead and seei
ng one wing pointing forward and one back when this is all done. Do build
ers look at this and make adjustments on the attach brackets before reami
ng to final?
On another concern, my Cessna has eccentric attach points on one end so t
he wing can be tipped up and down if needed. My plane used to fly to the
right all the time when letting go of the yoke, so I ended up making an a
djustment there to correct, that is after trying an aileron rerig and dro
oping a flap. Has this ever been a problem with the Murphys flying out th
ere?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771 Elite




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[murray]

Scott, I also have quick buid wings and will shortly be mounting my wings
can't say at this point about wings being square? will have to wait and see. I
am interested in the eccentric attach points if I need them...can you supply
pictures and some details.

Thanks

Murray
Moose 237




-> Mike, I can't answer the first part (due to fast build wings) but I know of
-> at least three Moose with eccentric attach points on the rear fuselage wing
-> spar bracket. One used the stock aft bracket but two of us remade them so we
-> would have greater edge distance if we need the eccentric. These are all
-> fast builds.
->
-> Scott
-> Moose 174
->
-> > -----Original Message-----
-> > From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
-> > mbetti@up.net
-> > Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 8:22 AM
-> > To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
-> > Subject: wing alignment
-> >
-> >
-> > I read ahead on the attaching of wings to fuselage. What controls keeping
-> > the 2 wings straight across the front? It appears that the 1 9/16" mea
-> > surement to the front attach point when building the wing applies somewha
-> > t, but that doesn't seem enough to keep everything square. Wouldn't a
-> > small amount of movement in the root make a lot of change out on the tip
-> > ? With the wing rear and front spars not being prepunched and don't see
-> > this being controlled very well and with just the ribs connecting everyt
-> > hing, they seem to flop around to align anything. So then is it the skins
-> > that keep everything square? I hate to be looking from overhead and seei
-> > ng one wing pointing forward and one back when this is all done. Do build
-> > ers look at this and make adjustments on the attach brackets before reami
-> > ng to final?
-> > On another concern, my Cessna has eccentric attach points on one end so t
-> > he wing can be tipped up and down if needed. My plane used to fly to the
-> > right all the time when letting go of the yoke, so I ended up making an a
-> > djustment there to correct, that is after trying an aileron rerig and dro
-> > oping a flap. Has this ever been a problem with the Murphys flying out th
-> > ere?
-> > Thanks,
-> > Mike Betti
-> > 771 Elite
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> > List archives located at: https://www.dcsol.com/login?mode=HTML
-> > username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > Subscription services located at:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.htm
-> > List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> >
->
->





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[Scott Aldrich]

I just uploaded a PDF to the file archives showing the eccentric cams, wing
section S/M 106, SR3500 wingcam.

It has a three view drawing of the eccentric and I pasted in a picture
showing the cams in place on a Moose. It takes two per rear attach fitting.
You drill out the fuselage brackets to .625 and the cams press in from the
front and rear. You can rotate the eccentrics as needed with the .375 bolt
going through the cam then the rear wing spar and then through the other
cam. It looks like there is plenty of edge distance on the brackets but we
made our fuselage brackets larger in case we wanted to make a larger cam.
Of course we are hoping we don't need a cam at all so I have not drill out
the fuselage brackets until we know for sure.


Scott
Moose 174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
murray@dcsol.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 12:10 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: wing alignment

Scott, I also have quick buid wings and will shortly be mounting my wings
can't say at this point about wings being square? will have to wait and
see. I
am interested in the eccentric attach points if I need them...can you
supply
pictures and some details.

Thanks

Murray
Moose 237




-> Mike, I can't answer the first part (due to fast build wings) but I
know of
-> at least three Moose with eccentric attach points on the rear fuselage
wing
-> spar bracket. One used the stock aft bracket but two of us remade them
so we
-> would have greater edge distance if we need the eccentric. These are
all
-> fast builds.
->
-> Scott
-> Moose 174
->
-> > -----Original Message-----
-> > From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
-> > mbetti@up.net
-> > Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 8:22 AM
-> > To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
-> > Subject: wing alignment
-> >
-> >
-> > I read ahead on the attaching of wings to fuselage. What controls
keeping
-> > the 2 wings straight across the front? It appears that the 1 9/16"
mea
-> > surement to the front attach point when building the wing applies
somewha
-> > t, but that doesn't seem enough to keep everything square. Wouldn't a
-> > small amount of movement in the root make a lot of change out on the
tip
-> > ? With the wing rear and front spars not being prepunched and don't
see
-> > this being controlled very well and with just the ribs connecting
everyt
-> > hing, they seem to flop around to align anything. So then is it the
skins
-> > that keep everything square? I hate to be looking from overhead and
seei
-> > ng one wing pointing forward and one back when this is all done. Do
build
-> > ers look at this and make adjustments on the attach brackets before
reami
-> > ng to final?
-> > On another concern, my Cessna has eccentric attach points on one end
so t
-> > he wing can be tipped up and down if needed. My plane used to fly to
the
-> > right all the time when letting go of the yoke, so I ended up making
an a
-> > djustment there to correct, that is after trying an aileron rerig and
dro
-> > oping a flap. Has this ever been a problem with the Murphys flying
out th
-> > ere?
-> > Thanks,
-> > Mike Betti
-> > 771 Elite
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> > List archives located at: https://www.dcsol.com/login?mode=HTML
-> > username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > Subscription services located at:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.htm
-> > List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> >
->
->





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[steveh]

Is this a mod that MAM came up with or is it someone else's dream? ? ?

Will this be required when the wings are attached or can the wings be lined up
properly BEFORE you drill and ream the mounting? ? ?

Steve H
Moose 213

-> I just uploaded a PDF to the file archives showing the eccentric cams, wing
-> section S/M 106, SR3500 wingcam.
->
-> It has a three view drawing of the eccentric and I pasted in a picture
-> showing the cams in place on a Moose. It takes two per rear attach fitting.
-> You drill out the fuselage brackets to .625 and the cams press in from the
-> front and rear. You can rotate the eccentrics as needed with the .375 bolt
-> going through the cam then the rear wing spar and then through the other
-> cam. It looks like there is plenty of edge distance on the brackets but we
-> made our fuselage brackets larger in case we wanted to make a larger cam.
-> Of course we are hoping we don't need a cam at all so I have not drill out
-> the fuselage brackets until we know for sure.
->
->
-> Scott
-> Moose 174
->
-> > -----Original Message-----
-> > From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
-> > murray@dcsol.com
-> > Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 12:10 PM
-> > To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
-> > Subject: RE: wing alignment
-> >
-> > Scott, I also have quick buid wings and will shortly be mounting my wings
-> > can't say at this point about wings being square? will have to wait and
-> > see. I
-> > am interested in the eccentric attach points if I need them...can you
-> > supply
-> > pictures and some details.
-> >
-> > Thanks
-> >
-> > Murray
-> > Moose 237
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > -> Mike, I can't answer the first part (due to fast build wings) but I
-> > know of
-> > -> at least three Moose with eccentric attach points on the rear fuselage
-> > wing
-> > -> spar bracket. One used the stock aft bracket but two of us remade them
-> > so we
-> > -> would have greater edge distance if we need the eccentric. These are
-> > all
-> > -> fast builds.
-> > ->
-> > -> Scott
-> > -> Moose 174
-> > ->
-> > -> > -----Original Message-----
-> > -> > From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
-> > -> > mbetti@up.net
-> > -> > Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 8:22 AM
-> > -> > To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
-> > -> > Subject: wing alignment
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> > I read ahead on the attaching of wings to fuselage. What controls
-> > keeping
-> > -> > the 2 wings straight across the front? It appears that the 1 9/16"
-> > mea
-> > -> > surement to the front attach point when building the wing applies
-> > somewha
-> > -> > t, but that doesn't seem enough to keep everything square. Wouldn't a
-> > -> > small amount of movement in the root make a lot of change out on the
-> > tip
-> > -> > ? With the wing rear and front spars not being prepunched and don't
-> > see
-> > -> > this being controlled very well and with just the ribs connecting
-> > everyt
-> > -> > hing, they seem to flop around to align anything. So then is it the
-> > skins
-> > -> > that keep everything square? I hate to be looking from overhead and
-> > seei
-> > -> > ng one wing pointing forward and one back when this is all done. Do
-> > build
-> > -> > ers look at this and make adjustments on the attach brackets before
-> > reami
-> > -> > ng to final?
-> > -> > On another concern, my Cessna has eccentric attach points on one end
-> > so t
-> > -> > he wing can be tipped up and down if needed. My plane used to fly to
-> > the
-> > -> > right all the time when letting go of the yoke, so I ended up making
-> > an a
-> > -> > djustment there to correct, that is after trying an aileron rerig and
-> > dro
-> > -> > oping a flap. Has this ever been a problem with the Murphys flying
-> > out th
-> > -> > ere?
-> > -> > Thanks,
-> > -> > Mike Betti
-> > -> > 771 Elite
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> > -> > List archives located at: https://www.dcsol.com/login?mode=HTML
-> > -> > username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > -> > Subscription services located at:
-> > -> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.htm
-> > -> > List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> > -> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> > -> >
-> > ->
-> > ->
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> > List archives located at: https://www.dcsol.com/login?mode=HTML
-> > username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > Subscription services located at:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.htm
-> > List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> >
->
->





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[Scott Aldrich]

As with all of this stuff it is endorsed by no one... But the actual
drawings for the cam did come from MAM. A lot of the Cessna's have these.

I don't think you can really do much of any wing alignment or repositioning
when reaming the existing mount holes. IF your wings are twisted the cam
may help. For the most part I think most are just going with whatever they
get and using a trim tab. You could also rig your flaps to correct if you
have it all figured out before you mount them, although that could look
crappy if it was much.

Scott
Moose
174

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
steveh@dcsol.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2005 10:01 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: wing alignment

Is this a mod that MAM came up with or is it someone else's dream? ? ?

Will this be required when the wings are attached or can the wings be
lined up
properly BEFORE you drill and ream the mounting? ? ?

Steve H
Moose 213

-> I just uploaded a PDF to the file archives showing the eccentric cams,
wing
-> section S/M 106, SR3500 wingcam.
->
-> It has a three view drawing of the eccentric and I pasted in a picture
-> showing the cams in place on a Moose. It takes two per rear attach
fitting.
-> You drill out the fuselage brackets to .625 and the cams press in from
the
-> front and rear. You can rotate the eccentrics as needed with the .375
bolt
-> going through the cam then the rear wing spar and then through the
other
-> cam. It looks like there is plenty of edge distance on the brackets
but we
-> made our fuselage brackets larger in case we wanted to make a larger
cam.
-> Of course we are hoping we don't need a cam at all so I have not drill
out
-> the fuselage brackets until we know for sure.
->
->
-> Scott
-> Moose 174
->
-> > -----Original Message-----
-> > From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
-> > murray@dcsol.com
-> > Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 12:10 PM
-> > To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
-> > Subject: RE: wing alignment
-> >
-> > Scott, I also have quick buid wings and will shortly be mounting my
wings
-> > can't say at this point about wings being square? will have to wait
and
-> > see. I
-> > am interested in the eccentric attach points if I need them...can you
-> > supply
-> > pictures and some details.
-> >
-> > Thanks
-> >
-> > Murray
-> > Moose 237
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > -> Mike, I can't answer the first part (due to fast build wings) but
I
-> > know of
-> > -> at least three Moose with eccentric attach points on the rear
fuselage
-> > wing
-> > -> spar bracket. One used the stock aft bracket but two of us remade
them
-> > so we
-> > -> would have greater edge distance if we need the eccentric. These
are
-> > all
-> > -> fast builds.
-> > ->
-> > -> Scott
-> > -> Moose 174
-> > ->
-> > -> > -----Original Message-----
-> > -> > From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On
Behalf Of
-> > -> > mbetti@up.net
-> > -> > Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 8:22 AM
-> > -> > To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
-> > -> > Subject: wing alignment
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> > I read ahead on the attaching of wings to fuselage. What
controls
-> > keeping
-> > -> > the 2 wings straight across the front? It appears that the 1
9/16"
-> > mea
-> > -> > surement to the front attach point when building the wing
applies
-> > somewha
-> > -> > t, but that doesn't seem enough to keep everything square.
Wouldn't a
-> > -> > small amount of movement in the root make a lot of change out
on the
-> > tip
-> > -> > ? With the wing rear and front spars not being prepunched and
don't
-> > see
-> > -> > this being controlled very well and with just the ribs
connecting
-> > everyt
-> > -> > hing, they seem to flop around to align anything. So then is it
the
-> > skins
-> > -> > that keep everything square? I hate to be looking from overhead
and
-> > seei
-> > -> > ng one wing pointing forward and one back when this is all done.
Do
-> > build
-> > -> > ers look at this and make adjustments on the attach brackets
before
-> > reami
-> > -> > ng to final?
-> > -> > On another concern, my Cessna has eccentric attach points on one
end
-> > so t
-> > -> > he wing can be tipped up and down if needed. My plane used to
fly to
-> > the
-> > -> > right all the time when letting go of the yoke, so I ended up
making
-> > an a
-> > -> > djustment there to correct, that is after trying an aileron
rerig and
-> > dro
-> > -> > oping a flap. Has this ever been a problem with the Murphys
flying
-> > out th
-> > -> > ere?
-> > -> > Thanks,
-> > -> > Mike Betti
-> > -> > 771 Elite
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> >
-> > -> > ----------------------------------------------------------------
-
-> > -> > List archives located at: https://www.dcsol.com/login?mode=HTML
-> > -> > username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > -> > Subscription services located at:
-> > -> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.htm
-> > -> > List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> > -> > ----------------------------------------------------------------
-
-> > -> >
-> > ->
-> > ->
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> > List archives located at: https://www.dcsol.com/login?mode=HTML
-> > username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > Subscription services located at:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.htm
-> > List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
-> >
->
->





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[Ralph Baker]

Mike,
I took a sight down our wings front edge today and if there is any
misalignment I can't see it. We were very careful to build a straight
airplane beginning with the build table and doing the best job we are
cabable of. If you are careful at each step I think you will get the
same result.
Ralph Baker
Elite 611E



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[Mike Betti]

It looks straight here.......just hope it really is. Maybe the whole
procedure just works out that way.
Mike Betti
771 Elite
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph Baker" <rebaker@ftc-i.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2005 8:20 PM
Subject: wing alignment

Mike,
I took a sight down our wings front edge today and if there is any
misalignment I can't see it. We were very careful to build a straight
airplane beginning with the build table and doing the best job we are
cabable of. If you are careful at each step I think you will get the
same result.
Ralph Baker
Elite 611E



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