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wiring

Converted from Wildcat! database. (read only)
Ken

Wiring

Post by Ken » Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:09 am

From the aeroelectric list I gather there are occasional difficulties
with the magneto wires but I don't have magnetos. Bob Knuckoll's book
has a good discussion on noise propagation from wires but you knew I was
going to say that ;)

After a wee bit of investigating I put everything through the same hole.
For wires that are paired (signal plus ground) I also ran the ground
through the same hole and then grounded everything at the same place
behind the firewall. I don't think that is required but it seemed like a
good idea especially for moderately high current digital signals like
the connections to the ignition coils and injectors.

And of course all the very low level alternating signals (crankshaft and
camshaft sensors) are also shielded with the shield grounded at the
computer end only. Again probably not required but it seemed reasonable
and the car was wired similarly. I suspect my biggest risk is noise from
my alternator feed because my batteries are also behind the firewall.

I believe it is good practice to ground everything to the same point to
eliminate ground loops, noises, and interference. Ground loops occur
when two systems share the same ground. For instance I am grounding my
strobe power supplies to the wing spar at the wing tip. Now if I also
ground my headset or microphone jack to the airframe then I would expect
to hear a noise everytime my strobes fire as the voltage at the headset
ground point would rise a bit everytime the strobes fire. When current
flows there is always a voltage drop associated and that is also true
for current flowing through the airframe. So isolate the headset jacks
from the airframe and run that ground back to a common point on the
firewall and no ground loop noise. I have about 40 ground wires going to
push on tabs on the firewall.

Ken

Kim Kimball wrote:
I am hoping to finish the wiring that must pass through the firewall this weekend. I wonder if there are any no-nos in grouping certain types of wires. I've got power, electronic ignition, IVO prop control and sensor wires, and engine gauge sensor wires that need to pass through the firewall. Can all of these types of wires be grouped in the same feedthrough?

Mike





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Bob Andrews

Wiring

Post by Bob Andrews » Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:09 am

Mike,

For the headset jacks, use shielded wire with the shield not grounded (open)
at the jack (use heat shrink at the headset jack's shield open termination
to protect against angel hairs), and ground the shields ONLY at the radio or
intercom connector.

Bob 612E

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of Ken
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2005 6:44 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Wiring


From the aeroelectric list I gather there are occasional difficulties
with the magneto wires but I don't have magnetos. Bob Knuckoll's book
has a good discussion on noise propagation from wires but you knew I was
going to say that ;)

After a wee bit of investigating I put everything through the same hole.
For wires that are paired (signal plus ground) I also ran the ground
through the same hole and then grounded everything at the same place
behind the firewall. I don't think that is required but it seemed like a
good idea especially for moderately high current digital signals like
the connections to the ignition coils and injectors.

And of course all the very low level alternating signals (crankshaft and
camshaft sensors) are also shielded with the shield grounded at the
computer end only. Again probably not required but it seemed reasonable
and the car was wired similarly. I suspect my biggest risk is noise from
my alternator feed because my batteries are also behind the firewall.

I believe it is good practice to ground everything to the same point to
eliminate ground loops, noises, and interference. Ground loops occur
when two systems share the same ground. For instance I am grounding my
strobe power supplies to the wing spar at the wing tip. Now if I also
ground my headset or microphone jack to the airframe then I would expect
to hear a noise everytime my strobes fire as the voltage at the headset
ground point would rise a bit everytime the strobes fire. When current
flows there is always a voltage drop associated and that is also true
for current flowing through the airframe. So isolate the headset jacks
from the airframe and run that ground back to a common point on the
firewall and no ground loop noise. I have about 40 ground wires going to
push on tabs on the firewall.

Ken

Kim Kimball wrote:
I am hoping to finish the wiring that must pass through the firewall this
weekend. I wonder if there are any no-nos in grouping certain types of
wires. I've got power, electronic ignition, IVO prop control and sensor
wires, and engine gauge sensor wires that need to pass through the firewall.
Can all of these types of wires be grouped in the same feedthrough?
Mike





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Bob Andrews

Wiring

Post by Bob Andrews » Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:09 am

... also ... something I've screwed up in the past ... ensure the jack
itself is not grounded to the structure (inst pnl, etc.). Nothing at the
jacks (mic and phone) should be grounded (discounting PTT key). A good
shielding job is of little value when the signal returns find a ground at
the jack.

Bob 612E

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of Bob
Andrews
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2005 8:19 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: Wiring


Mike,

For the headset jacks, use shielded wire with the shield not grounded (open)
at the jack (use heat shrink at the headset jack's shield open termination
to protect against angel hairs), and ground the shields ONLY at the radio or
intercom connector.

Bob 612E

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of Ken
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2005 6:44 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Wiring


From the aeroelectric list I gather there are occasional difficulties
with the magneto wires but I don't have magnetos. Bob Knuckoll's book
has a good discussion on noise propagation from wires but you knew I was
going to say that ;)

After a wee bit of investigating I put everything through the same hole.
For wires that are paired (signal plus ground) I also ran the ground
through the same hole and then grounded everything at the same place
behind the firewall. I don't think that is required but it seemed like a
good idea especially for moderately high current digital signals like
the connections to the ignition coils and injectors.

And of course all the very low level alternating signals (crankshaft and
camshaft sensors) are also shielded with the shield grounded at the
computer end only. Again probably not required but it seemed reasonable
and the car was wired similarly. I suspect my biggest risk is noise from
my alternator feed because my batteries are also behind the firewall.

I believe it is good practice to ground everything to the same point to
eliminate ground loops, noises, and interference. Ground loops occur
when two systems share the same ground. For instance I am grounding my
strobe power supplies to the wing spar at the wing tip. Now if I also
ground my headset or microphone jack to the airframe then I would expect
to hear a noise everytime my strobes fire as the voltage at the headset
ground point would rise a bit everytime the strobes fire. When current
flows there is always a voltage drop associated and that is also true
for current flowing through the airframe. So isolate the headset jacks
from the airframe and run that ground back to a common point on the
firewall and no ground loop noise. I have about 40 ground wires going to
push on tabs on the firewall.

Ken

Kim Kimball wrote:
I am hoping to finish the wiring that must pass through the firewall this
weekend. I wonder if there are any no-nos in grouping certain types of
wires. I've got power, electronic ignition, IVO prop control and sensor
wires, and engine gauge sensor wires that need to pass through the firewall.
Can all of these types of wires be grouped in the same feedthrough?
Mike





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Ralph Baker

wiring

Post by Ralph Baker » Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:52 am

As an add on to Jeans comment, a Shop Vac works well to pull that masking tape ball through. Just be sure the available line is short enough so the shop Vac doesn't eat it.
Ralph Baker



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Ralph Baker

wiring

Post by Ralph Baker » Sun Feb 19, 2012 5:54 pm

I use the corrugated (us with medical experience might call it trachea pipe) as well. It is almost impossible to push wire through it. It is easy to get a "fish wire" through by taking a light string and balling up tape on the end to just under the internal diameter. Then put your Shop Vac on the other end and feed the line as the ball pulls it through. Once done the wire can be pulled through. I leave fish lines in all my conduits for possible future use.
Ralph Baker



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