Trailer spring as tail spring

[Joel Jacobs]

Hi guys,
It appears I found a US source for the Canadian Tire spring some have been
using for a tail spring on Rebels. I received it today and it looks
_Exactly_ like the one in the picture in the archives called 04082314.jpg.
I got it at www.lowcosttrailersupplies.com and the part number is WIE3.
The picture in the archives tells where to make the cuts but I have a few
questions - like which end gets the tailwheel, do you leave the bolt holding
the leaves together?, Ditto the clamp, and which end of the third leaf gets
1 1/2 inches cut off. If someone has a good picture of it installed, that
would probably clear things up.
Thanks much!

Joel Jacobs
Rebel 416R




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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Joel...it will depend how it sits on the airplane and if you have the exact
same spring the fully curled end being cut off is the fuselage end and the
joggled end you cut flush with the second spring is the tailwheel end. You
need to remove sufficient 3rd spring to clear the lower rudder hinge bolt.

There have been a few arguments (I mean discussions) as to whether the bolt
stays in or not... with some people fearing it being sheared or the
tailwheel attach bolt being sheared. Some leave the center bolt and then
slot the second springs tailwheel bolt hole to let it slide a bit in a hard
landing. Others only bolt the tailwheel to one spring and cut the 2nd one
back to do so. Others, like me, have left in the spring retainer bolt and
bolted the tailwheel yoke through two spring leaves with a single AN8 bolt.
I have made MANY hard tailwheel first landings and had no problems...the
choice is yours!

Gotta get to bed...been up since 4am!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joel Jacobs" <jj@sdf.lonestar.org>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 4:21 PM
Subject: Trailer spring as tail spring

Hi guys,
It appears I found a US source for the Canadian Tire spring some have been
using for a tail spring on Rebels. I received it today and it looks
_Exactly_ like the one in the picture in the archives called 04082314.jpg.
I got it at www.lowcosttrailersupplies.com and the part number is WIE3.
The picture in the archives tells where to make the cuts but I have a few
questions - like which end gets the tailwheel, do you leave the bolt

holding

the leaves together?, Ditto the clamp, and which end of the third leaf

gets

1 1/2 inches cut off. If someone has a good picture of it installed, that
would probably clear things up.
Thanks much!

Joel Jacobs
Rebel 416R




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[rognal]

Joel,

There is a descriptive photo on Wray Thompson's website at this url:

http://wrayt.tripod.com/leafSpringcuts.jpg

And if you run a mail search in the archives for the following mail from
Wayne O'Shea, read way down into it, you will see his description of how to
modify it.

From: OIFA@IRISHFIELD.ON.CA
Date: 7/11/2002 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: 3 leaf trailer spring for tailwheel - Rebel
Conference: interim-mrl

Well I see Wayne has already answered your question, but I will send this
anyway. Maybe it will help.

Roger Hoffman #687R
Eugene, OR USA!



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[Joel Jacobs]

Thanks Wayne!
It's beginning to make sense now. If I'm visualizing this correctly the
third spring, that is cut to clear the hinge bolt, is not in the saddle
clamp... It's just held on top of the other two springs by the bolt through
the leafs behind the saddle clamp.
I can see where this will help move my CG back!
Joel
Rebel 416R

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 10:48 PM
Subject: Re: Trailer spring as tail spring

Joel...it will depend how it sits on the airplane and if you have the

exact

same spring the fully curled end being cut off is the fuselage end and the
joggled end you cut flush with the second spring is the tailwheel end. You
need to remove sufficient 3rd spring to clear the lower rudder hinge bolt.

There have been a few arguments (I mean discussions) as to whether the

bolt

stays in or not... with some people fearing it being sheared or the
tailwheel attach bolt being sheared. Some leave the center bolt and then
slot the second springs tailwheel bolt hole to let it slide a bit in a

hard

landing. Others only bolt the tailwheel to one spring and cut the 2nd one
back to do so. Others, like me, have left in the spring retainer bolt and
bolted the tailwheel yoke through two spring leaves with a single AN8

bolt.

I have made MANY hard tailwheel first landings and had no problems...the
choice is yours!

Gotta get to bed...been up since 4am!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joel Jacobs" <jj@sdf.lonestar.org>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 4:21 PM
Subject: Trailer spring as tail spring

Hi guys,
It appears I found a US source for the Canadian Tire spring some have

been

using for a tail spring on Rebels. I received it today and it looks
_Exactly_ like the one in the picture in the archives called

04082314.jpg.

I got it at www.lowcosttrailersupplies.com and the part number is WIE3.
The picture in the archives tells where to make the cuts but I have a

few

questions - like which end gets the tailwheel, do you leave the bolt

holding

the leaves together?, Ditto the clamp, and which end of the third leaf

gets

1 1/2 inches cut off. If someone has a good picture of it installed,

that

would probably clear things up.
Thanks much!

Joel Jacobs
Rebel 416R




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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Think you are visualizing correctly!

I actually take the saddle clamp/wrap around strap off the side shown in the
picture and reinstall it on the otherside (on the tail wheel side of things)
of the retainer bolt to hold the leaves aligned .

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joel Jacobs" <jj@sdf.lonestar.org>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 1:06 PM
Subject: Re: Trailer spring as tail spring

Thanks Wayne!
It's beginning to make sense now. If I'm visualizing this correctly the
third spring, that is cut to clear the hinge bolt, is not in the saddle
clamp... It's just held on top of the other two springs by the bolt

through

the leafs behind the saddle clamp.
I can see where this will help move my CG back!
Joel
Rebel 416R

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 10:48 PM
Subject: Re: Trailer spring as tail spring

Joel...it will depend how it sits on the airplane and if you have the

exact

same spring the fully curled end being cut off is the fuselage end and

the

joggled end you cut flush with the second spring is the tailwheel end.

You

need to remove sufficient 3rd spring to clear the lower rudder hinge

bolt.

There have been a few arguments (I mean discussions) as to whether the

bolt

stays in or not... with some people fearing it being sheared or the
tailwheel attach bolt being sheared. Some leave the center bolt and then
slot the second springs tailwheel bolt hole to let it slide a bit in a

hard

landing. Others only bolt the tailwheel to one spring and cut the 2nd

one

back to do so. Others, like me, have left in the spring retainer bolt

and

bolted the tailwheel yoke through two spring leaves with a single AN8

bolt.

I have made MANY hard tailwheel first landings and had no problems...the
choice is yours!

Gotta get to bed...been up since 4am!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joel Jacobs" <jj@sdf.lonestar.org>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 4:21 PM
Subject: Trailer spring as tail spring

Hi guys,
It appears I found a US source for the Canadian Tire spring some have

been

using for a tail spring on Rebels. I received it today and it looks
_Exactly_ like the one in the picture in the archives called

04082314.jpg.

I got it at www.lowcosttrailersupplies.com and the part number is

WIE3.

The picture in the archives tells where to make the cuts but I have a

few

questions - like which end gets the tailwheel, do you leave the bolt

holding

the leaves together?, Ditto the clamp, and which end of the third leaf

gets

1 1/2 inches cut off. If someone has a good picture of it installed,

that

would probably clear things up.
Thanks much!

Joel Jacobs
Rebel 416R




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[Ken]

Gee you worded that diplomatically Wayne!

One bolt should make for a softer spring as well if that is desired.
Whichever way you go try not to install it such that a hard landing
pries the spring leaves apart with large forces at the tailpost clamp.
I'd hate to see that clamp fail because it was used in a way that it was
not designed for.

granny Ken

Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

Joel...it will depend how it sits on the airplane and if you have the exact
same spring the fully curled end being cut off is the fuselage end and the
joggled end you cut flush with the second spring is the tailwheel end. You
need to remove sufficient 3rd spring to clear the lower rudder hinge bolt.

There have been a few arguments (I mean discussions) as to whether the bolt
stays in or not... with some people fearing it being sheared or the
tailwheel attach bolt being sheared. Some leave the center bolt and then
slot the second springs tailwheel bolt hole to let it slide a bit in a hard
landing. Others only bolt the tailwheel to one spring and cut the 2nd one
back to do so. Others, like me, have left in the spring retainer bolt and
bolted the tailwheel yoke through two spring leaves with a single AN8 bolt.
I have made MANY hard tailwheel first landings and had no problems...the
choice is yours!

Gotta get to bed...been up since 4am!

Wayne

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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Hey, I thought I'd done pretty good typing that out...... considering how
long I'd been up for when I posted it!! )

Second leaf shouldn't be a problem with the tail post clamp as only the one
leaf is bolted to the fus bottom...two leaves go through the post clamp and
the retainer bolt for all 3 leaves is pretty close to the post clamp area.
Don't see the leaves seperating enough to cause a problem...at least haven't
seen any evidence of it yet (in 9+ years of flight)

uncle Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken" <klehman@albedo.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 4:52 PM
Subject: Re: Trailer spring as tail spring

Gee you worded that diplomatically Wayne!

One bolt should make for a softer spring as well if that is desired.
Whichever way you go try not to install it such that a hard landing
pries the spring leaves apart with large forces at the tailpost clamp.
I'd hate to see that clamp fail because it was used in a way that it was
not designed for.

granny Ken

Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

Joel...it will depend how it sits on the airplane and if you have the

exact

same spring the fully curled end being cut off is the fuselage end and

the

joggled end you cut flush with the second spring is the tailwheel end.

You

need to remove sufficient 3rd spring to clear the lower rudder hinge

bolt.

There have been a few arguments (I mean discussions) as to whether the

bolt

stays in or not... with some people fearing it being sheared or the
tailwheel attach bolt being sheared. Some leave the center bolt and then
slot the second springs tailwheel bolt hole to let it slide a bit in a

hard

landing. Others only bolt the tailwheel to one spring and cut the 2nd one
back to do so. Others, like me, have left in the spring retainer bolt and
bolted the tailwheel yoke through two spring leaves with a single AN8

bolt.

I have made MANY hard tailwheel first landings and had no problems...the
choice is yours!

Gotta get to bed...been up since 4am!

Wayne

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