SR2500 Carcked Windshield

[rebel]

Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,

I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which wraps
around the front of the wing at the wing root.

I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has had
this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering myself
grounded for now.

I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in comments
from those that have been down this road already.

I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace in
my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe though
I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped door
post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!

Chris Gill
SR#025, Anchorage, AK
907-227-9352


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[Al Paxhia]

Hi Chris,
After my v-brace broke I flew without if for a couple of weeks. On my plane
there is a lot of movement in the upper windshield area. Not much movement
on the runway but a lot of movement on the water during takeoff.
I would install the v-brace if you replace the windshield and go with the
thicker one.
Al
----- Original Message -----
From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 5:24 PM
Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield

Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,

I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which wraps
around the front of the wing at the wing root.

I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has had
this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering

myself

grounded for now.

I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in comments
from those that have been down this road already.

I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace

in

my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe though
I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped

door

post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!

Chris Gill
SR#025, Anchorage, AK
907-227-9352

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[capete]

Hi Chris,

Just wondering what thickness your windshield was?

Peter K
SR003

----- Original Message -----
From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield

Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,

I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which wraps
around the front of the wing at the wing root.

I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has had
this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering

myself

grounded for now.

I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in comments
from those that have been down this road already.

I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace

in

my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe though
I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped

door

post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!

Chris Gill
SR#025, Anchorage, AK
907-227-9352

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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Funny (well not really) but that is the same side the Rebel windshields
always cracks on as well. We had Howard's stop drilled for a few years. He
had a crack that was about an inch long at the start that grew to 2" and
then about 3" before I pulled it about the time the windshield was full of
checks that made flying into the sun no fun.

Mind you... you are saying a SIX inch crack that is totally?? covered by the
fairing. The crack usually propagates from the heaviest part of the bend
right by the wing attach carrythrough and usually heads downward on about a
45* angle following the peak of the formed area. No matter what you have I
don't see why you can't stop drill it (shine a light into the acrylic and
follow the hairline past what you see as a crack and drill another 1/2" or
so past that to be sure you catch it all) and then if necessary use tarp
tape or tin tape to hold the cracked section stable, until you get time to
replace it.

When you are replacing it, YES I would install some kind of "V" brace to
help you out. I've noticed the Rebels on floats go through windshields at a
much higher rate than their wheeled counterparts!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield

Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,

I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which wraps
around the front of the wing at the wing root.

I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has had
this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering

myself

grounded for now.

I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in comments
from those that have been down this road already.

I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace

in

my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe though
I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped

door

post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!

Chris Gill
SR#025, Anchorage, AK
907-227-9352

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[rebel]

Al,

Good to hear from you.

When you say go withn the thicker 'one' I'm guessing you are referring to the
window, not the V-brace?

Chris
907-227-9352


On 5/25/2004 5:02 PM, PAXHIA2@COMCAST.NET wrote to MURPHY-REBEL:

-> Received: by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v6.0.451.1)
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:02:39 -0800
-> Received: from sccrmhc11.comcast.net ([204.127.202.55])
EHLO=sccrmhc11.comcast.net
-> by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP v6.0.451.1) with SMTP
-> id 2412532062; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:02:37 -0800
-> Received: from NEWCOMPUTER (c-24-19-147-9.client.comcast.net[24.19.147.9])
-> by comcast.net (sccrmhc11) with SMTP
-> id <20040526010200011009fuvne>; Wed, 26 May 2004 01:02:00 +0000
-> Message-ID: <001301c442bd$11fa6050$09931318@NEWCOMPUTER>
-> From: "Al Paxhia" <paxhia2@comcast.net>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> References: <1085531061@dcsol.com>
-> Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
-> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 18:02:08 -0700
-> X-Orig-MIME-Version: 1.0
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-> X-Antivirus-Remover: Message was filtered through wsMailGuard (wsAV)
->
-> Hi Chris,
-> After my v-brace broke I flew without if for a couple of weeks. On my plane
-> there is a lot of movement in the upper windshield area. Not much movement
-> on the runway but a lot of movement on the water during takeoff.
-> I would install the v-brace if you replace the windshield and go with the
-> thicker one.
-> Al
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 5:24 PM
-> Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
->
->
-> > Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,
-> >
-> > I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
-> > Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which
wraps
-> > around the front of the wing at the wing root.
-> >
-> > I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has
had
-> > this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
-> > propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering
-> myself
-> > grounded for now.
-> >
-> > I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in
comments
-> > from those that have been down this road already.
-> >
-> > I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
-> > edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace
-> in
-> > my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe
though
-> > I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped
-> door
-> > post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!
-> >
-> > Chris Gill
-> > SR#025, Anchorage, AK
-> > 907-227-9352
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> *-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> > To unsubscribe from this list go to:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
-> > Archives located at https://www.dcsol.com/default.htm
-> > Archives public username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > To contact the list admin, e-mail mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> >
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-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
->
->




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[rebel]

Peter,

My window is 3/16" thick.

I remember a 1/8" window came with my kit # 025 but then during the build
Murphy replaced it with the 3/16" model at no cost to me due to structural
concerns.



Chris



On 5/25/2004 4:39 PM, CAPETE@GOLDEN.NET wrote to MURPHY-REBEL:

-> Received: by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v6.0.451.1)
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 16:40:00 -0800
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-> by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP v6.0.451.1) with SMTP
-> id 2411171953; Tue, 25 May 2004 16:39:57 -0800
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-> by smtp.golden.net with smtp (Exim 4.22)
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-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 20:39:12 -0400
-> Message-ID: <000701c442b9$dcb970a0$528dfea9@r2d2>
-> From: <capete@golden.net>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> References: <1085531061@dcsol.com>
-> Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
-> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 20:39:09 -0400
-> X-Orig-MIME-Version: 1.0
-> X-Orig-Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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-> X-Antivirus-Remover: Message was filtered through wsMailGuard (wsAV)
->
-> Hi Chris,
->
-> Just wondering what thickness your windshield was?
->
-> Peter K
-> SR003
->
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
-> Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
->
->
-> > Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,
-> >
-> > I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
-> > Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which
wraps
-> > around the front of the wing at the wing root.
-> >
-> > I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has
had
-> > this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
-> > propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering
-> myself
-> > grounded for now.
-> >
-> > I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in
comments
-> > from those that have been down this road already.
-> >
-> > I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
-> > edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace
-> in
-> > my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe
though
-> > I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped
-> door
-> > post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!
-> >
-> > Chris Gill
-> > SR#025, Anchorage, AK
-> > 907-227-9352
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> *-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> > To unsubscribe from this list go to:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
-> > Archives located at https://www.dcsol.com/default.htm
-> > Archives public username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > To contact the list admin, e-mail mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> >
-> *-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> >
-> >
-> >
->




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[rebel]

Wayne,

Actually upon closer inspection it is more like a 12" crack.

I'll post a photo or two later today.

In talking to Murphy it sounds like the V-brace is reccomended on floats.

The trick may be I have the SR2500 4 point O-540 mount but the V-brace is
designed for the newer 5 point O-540 mount for the Moose. I'll have to
figure out how to make this work.

How come these things never break in the cold dark days of winter??

Chris


On 5/25/2004 5:02 PM, OIFA@IRISHFIELD.ON.CA wrote to MURPHY-REBEL:

-> Received: by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v6.0.451.1)
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:39 -0800
-> Received: from frodo.csolve.net ([207.164.81.3]) EHLO=frodo.csolve.net
-> by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP v6.0.451.1) with SMTP
-> id 2412711546; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:37 -0800
-> Received: from cis-206.172.205.182.csolve.net ([206.172.205.182]
helo=celeron266a)
-> by frodo.csolve.net with esmtp (Exim 4.24)
-> id 1BSmqt-000Jaz-3D
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:05:04 -0400
-> Message-ID: <000d01c442bd$118382a0$e401910a@celeron266a>
-> From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> References: <1085531061@dcsol.com>
-> Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
-> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 21:02:04 -0400
-> Organization: O'Shea's Irish Field Aviation
-> X-Orig-MIME-Version: 1.0
-> X-Orig-Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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-> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200
-> X-Antivirus-Remover: Message was filtered through wsMailGuard (wsAV)
->
-> Funny (well not really) but that is the same side the Rebel windshields
-> always cracks on as well. We had Howard's stop drilled for a few years. He
-> had a crack that was about an inch long at the start that grew to 2" and
-> then about 3" before I pulled it about the time the windshield was full of
-> checks that made flying into the sun no fun.
->
-> Mind you... you are saying a SIX inch crack that is totally?? covered by
the
-> fairing. The crack usually propagates from the heaviest part of the bend
-> right by the wing attach carrythrough and usually heads downward on about a
-> 45* angle following the peak of the formed area. No matter what you have I
-> don't see why you can't stop drill it (shine a light into the acrylic and
-> follow the hairline past what you see as a crack and drill another 1/2" or
-> so past that to be sure you catch it all) and then if necessary use tarp
-> tape or tin tape to hold the cracked section stable, until you get time to
-> replace it.
->
-> When you are replacing it, YES I would install some kind of "V" brace to
-> help you out. I've noticed the Rebels on floats go through windshields at a
-> much higher rate than their wheeled counterparts!
->
-> Wayne
->
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
-> Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
->
->
-> > Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,
-> >
-> > I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
-> > Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which
wraps
-> > around the front of the wing at the wing root.
-> >
-> > I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has
had
-> > this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
-> > propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering
-> myself
-> > grounded for now.
-> >
-> > I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in
comments
-> > from those that have been down this road already.
-> >
-> > I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
-> > edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace
-> in
-> > my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe
though
-> > I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped
-> door
-> > post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!
-> >
-> > Chris Gill
-> > SR#025, Anchorage, AK
-> > 907-227-9352
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> *-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> > To unsubscribe from this list go to:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
-> > Archives located at https://www.dcsol.com/default.htm
-> > Archives public username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > To contact the list admin, e-mail mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> >
-> *-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
->




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[Mike Kimball]

I don't see how a four point versus five point engine mount will make any
difference. I have the V-brace installed on my Super Rebel with the
standard four mounting points. MAM sells a 1/4 inch windshield which is
what I used. Might as well get the thickest one. The normal V-brace
install would require you to remove the wings to get to the back side of the
bolts going through the square tube crossmember where the V-brace bolts to.
However, I might suggest drilling all the way through the crossmember and
using a longer bolt so that you can put your wrench on the nut inside the
cockpit. With your instrument panel in the way it's going to be difficult
installing the large aluminum angle that goes under the glareshield where it
meets the firewall. Get your close quarters drill ready. You'll probably
need it.

Mike Kimball
SR #044

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rebel@dcsol.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2004 1:18 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield


Wayne,

Actually upon closer inspection it is more like a 12" crack.

I'll post a photo or two later today.

In talking to Murphy it sounds like the V-brace is reccomended on floats.

The trick may be I have the SR2500 4 point O-540 mount but the V-brace is
designed for the newer 5 point O-540 mount for the Moose. I'll have to
figure out how to make this work.

How come these things never break in the cold dark days of winter??

Chris


On 5/25/2004 5:02 PM, OIFA@IRISHFIELD.ON.CA wrote to MURPHY-REBEL:

-> Received: by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v6.0.451.1)
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:39 -0800
-> Received: from frodo.csolve.net ([207.164.81.3]) EHLO=frodo.csolve.net
-> by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP v6.0.451.1) with SMTP
-> id 2412711546; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:37 -0800
-> Received: from cis-206.172.205.182.csolve.net ([206.172.205.182]
helo=celeron266a)
-> by frodo.csolve.net with esmtp (Exim 4.24)
-> id 1BSmqt-000Jaz-3D
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:05:04 -0400
-> Message-ID: <000d01c442bd$118382a0$e401910a@celeron266a>
-> From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> References: <1085531061@dcsol.com>
-> Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
-> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 21:02:04 -0400
-> Organization: O'Shea's Irish Field Aviation
-> X-Orig-MIME-Version: 1.0
-> X-Orig-Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
-> X-Orig-Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
-> X-Priority: 3
-> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
-> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200
-> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200
-> X-Antivirus-Remover: Message was filtered through wsMailGuard (wsAV)
->
-> Funny (well not really) but that is the same side the Rebel windshields
-> always cracks on as well. We had Howard's stop drilled for a few years.
He
-> had a crack that was about an inch long at the start that grew to 2" and
-> then about 3" before I pulled it about the time the windshield was full
of
-> checks that made flying into the sun no fun.
->
-> Mind you... you are saying a SIX inch crack that is totally?? covered by
the
-> fairing. The crack usually propagates from the heaviest part of the bend
-> right by the wing attach carrythrough and usually heads downward on about
a
-> 45* angle following the peak of the formed area. No matter what you have
I
-> don't see why you can't stop drill it (shine a light into the acrylic and
-> follow the hairline past what you see as a crack and drill another 1/2"
or
-> so past that to be sure you catch it all) and then if necessary use tarp
-> tape or tin tape to hold the cracked section stable, until you get time
to
-> replace it.
->
-> When you are replacing it, YES I would install some kind of "V" brace to
-> help you out. I've noticed the Rebels on floats go through windshields at
a
-> much higher rate than their wheeled counterparts!
->
-> Wayne
->
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
-> Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
->
->
-> > Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,
-> >
-> > I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my
(Super
-> > Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which
wraps
-> > around the front of the wing at the wing root.
-> >
-> > I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has
had
-> > this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to
stop
-> > propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering
-> myself
-> > grounded for now.
-> >
-> > I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in
comments
-> > from those that have been down this road already.
-> >
-> > I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any
sharp
-> > edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the
V-brace
-> in
-> > my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe
though
-> > I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped
-> door
-> > post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!
-> >
-> > Chris Gill
-> > SR#025, Anchorage, AK
-> > 907-227-9352
-> >
-> >
-> >
->
*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> > To unsubscribe from this list go to:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
-> > Archives located at https://www.dcsol.com/default.htm
-> > Archives public username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > To contact the list admin, e-mail mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> >
->
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-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
->




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[Al Paxhia]

Mike,
I asked MAM about drilling through the square tube and Brian said don't do
it.
There are some heavy loads in compression on the tube and the bolt all the
way through to the v-brace could deform the tube over time. I have removed
and replaced the v-brace with the windshield and wings on, it took hours for
two of us. One on the inside with a wrench on the bolt head and the other
working through the slot between the wing and wing attach fitting, with a
wrench made for the job. If I had to do it again, I would pull the wing
bolts, fuel line and slide the wing back an inch.
It may take longer but it's more doable for fat old hands and low levels of
patience.
Al
Moose, N526AP
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Kimball" <mkimball@gci.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Cc: "Chris Gill" <gill@gci.net>
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2004 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: SR2500 Carcked Windshield

I don't see how a four point versus five point engine mount will make any
difference. I have the V-brace installed on my Super Rebel with the
standard four mounting points. MAM sells a 1/4 inch windshield which is
what I used. Might as well get the thickest one. The normal V-brace
install would require you to remove the wings to get to the back side of

the

bolts going through the square tube crossmember where the V-brace bolts

to.

However, I might suggest drilling all the way through the crossmember and
using a longer bolt so that you can put your wrench on the nut inside the
cockpit. With your instrument panel in the way it's going to be difficult
installing the large aluminum angle that goes under the glareshield where

it

meets the firewall. Get your close quarters drill ready. You'll probably
need it.

Mike Kimball
SR #044

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rebel@dcsol.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2004 1:18 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield


Wayne,

Actually upon closer inspection it is more like a 12" crack.

I'll post a photo or two later today.

In talking to Murphy it sounds like the V-brace is reccomended on floats.

The trick may be I have the SR2500 4 point O-540 mount but the V-brace is
designed for the newer 5 point O-540 mount for the Moose. I'll have to
figure out how to make this work.

How come these things never break in the cold dark days of winter??

Chris


On 5/25/2004 5:02 PM, OIFA@IRISHFIELD.ON.CA wrote to MURPHY-REBEL:

-> Received: by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v6.0.451.1)
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:39 -0800
-> Received: from frodo.csolve.net ([207.164.81.3]) EHLO=frodo.csolve.net
-> by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP v6.0.451.1) with SMTP
-> id 2412711546; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:37 -0800
-> Received: from cis-206.172.205.182.csolve.net ([206.172.205.182]
helo=celeron266a)
-> by frodo.csolve.net with esmtp (Exim 4.24)
-> id 1BSmqt-000Jaz-3D
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:05:04 -0400
-> Message-ID: <000d01c442bd$118382a0$e401910a@celeron266a>
-> From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> References: <1085531061@dcsol.com>
-> Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
-> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 21:02:04 -0400
-> Organization: O'Shea's Irish Field Aviation
-> X-Orig-MIME-Version: 1.0
-> X-Orig-Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
-> X-Orig-Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
-> X-Priority: 3
-> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
-> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200
-> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200
-> X-Antivirus-Remover: Message was filtered through wsMailGuard (wsAV)
->
-> Funny (well not really) but that is the same side the Rebel windshields
-> always cracks on as well. We had Howard's stop drilled for a few years.
He
-> had a crack that was about an inch long at the start that grew to 2"

and

-> then about 3" before I pulled it about the time the windshield was full
of
-> checks that made flying into the sun no fun.
->
-> Mind you... you are saying a SIX inch crack that is totally?? covered

by

the
-> fairing. The crack usually propagates from the heaviest part of the

bend

-> right by the wing attach carrythrough and usually heads downward on

about

a
-> 45* angle following the peak of the formed area. No matter what you

have

I
-> don't see why you can't stop drill it (shine a light into the acrylic

and

-> follow the hairline past what you see as a crack and drill another 1/2"
or
-> so past that to be sure you catch it all) and then if necessary use

tarp

-> tape or tin tape to hold the cracked section stable, until you get time
to
-> replace it.
->
-> When you are replacing it, YES I would install some kind of "V" brace

to

-> help you out. I've noticed the Rebels on floats go through windshields

at

a
-> much higher rate than their wheeled counterparts!
->
-> Wayne
->
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
-> Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
->
->
-> > Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,
-> >
-> > I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my
(Super
-> > Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which
wraps
-> > around the front of the wing at the wing root.
-> >
-> > I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone

has

had
-> > this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to
stop
-> > propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering
-> myself
-> > grounded for now.
-> >
-> > I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in
comments
-> > from those that have been down this road already.
-> >
-> > I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any
sharp
-> > edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the
V-brace
-> in
-> > my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe
though
-> > I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as

popped

-> door
-> > post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!
-> >
-> > Chris Gill
-> > SR#025, Anchorage, AK
-> > 907-227-9352
-> >
-> >
-> >
->

*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*

-> > To unsubscribe from this list go to:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
-> > Archives located at https://www.dcsol.com/default.htm
-> > Archives public username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > To contact the list admin, e-mail mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> >
->

*-------------------------------------------------------------------------*

-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
->

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[Warren & Marg Montgomery]

There is even a third thicker window for the Moose.
If replacing you may want to upgrade to the 1/4"
I actually dropped my 1/8" from the top of the wardrobe in our bedroom
which it's stored on and split it. . I'll do some battle damage repair
to it and mount it first then make a template before cutting the 1/4".

Warren
S029
rebel@dcsol.com wrote:

Peter,

My window is 3/16" thick.

I remember a 1/8" window came with my kit # 025 but then during the build
Murphy replaced it with the 3/16" model at no cost to me due to structural
concerns.

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[Warren & Marg Montgomery]

I've seen how the Battle Damage Repair Unit patches up presurised
fighter canopies.
At least for training to simulate combat operations.
Basically a row of holes either side and then stiched and glued together.
I think they used wire for the stitching. At least this would get you
back in the air until you get a replacement.
Anyone have a contact with the BDRU at CFB Trenton?
You may want to make a call to the base operator at CFB Trenton and ask
for the BDRU, explain your problem and get their advise.
I think the guys there would be more then eager to help.
They were when I was in the forces and this is where I learned that
scraps could be made from full sheets. ;-)

Warren

rebel@dcsol.com wrote:

Wayne,

Actually upon closer inspection it is more like a 12" crack.

I'll post a photo or two later today.

In talking to Murphy it sounds like the V-brace is reccomended on floats.

The trick may be I have the SR2500 4 point O-540 mount but the V-brace is
designed for the newer 5 point O-540 mount for the Moose. I'll have to
figure out how to make this work.

How come these things never break in the cold dark days of winter??

Chris


On 5/25/2004 5:02 PM, OIFA@IRISHFIELD.ON.CA wrote to MURPHY-REBEL:

-> Received: by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v6.0.451.1)
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:39 -0800
-> Received: from frodo.csolve.net ([207.164.81.3]) EHLO=frodo.csolve.net
-> by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP v6.0.451.1) with SMTP
-> id 2412711546; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:37 -0800
-> Received: from cis-206.172.205.182.csolve.net ([206.172.205.182]
helo=celeron266a)
-> by frodo.csolve.net with esmtp (Exim 4.24)
-> id 1BSmqt-000Jaz-3D
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:05:04 -0400
-> Message-ID: <000d01c442bd$118382a0$e401910a@celeron266a>
-> From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> References: <1085531061@dcsol.com>
-> Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
-> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 21:02:04 -0400
-> Organization: O'Shea's Irish Field Aviation
-> X-Orig-MIME-Version: 1.0
-> X-Orig-Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
-> X-Orig-Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
-> X-Priority: 3
-> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
-> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200
-> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200
-> X-Antivirus-Remover: Message was filtered through wsMailGuard (wsAV)
->
-> Funny (well not really) but that is the same side the Rebel windshields
-> always cracks on as well. We had Howard's stop drilled for a few years. He
-> had a crack that was about an inch long at the start that grew to 2" and
-> then about 3" before I pulled it about the time the windshield was full of
-> checks that made flying into the sun no fun.
->
-> Mind you... you are saying a SIX inch crack that is totally?? covered by
the
-> fairing. The crack usually propagates from the heaviest part of the bend
-> right by the wing attach carrythrough and usually heads downward on about a
-> 45* angle following the peak of the formed area. No matter what you have I
-> don't see why you can't stop drill it (shine a light into the acrylic and
-> follow the hairline past what you see as a crack and drill another 1/2" or
-> so past that to be sure you catch it all) and then if necessary use tarp
-> tape or tin tape to hold the cracked section stable, until you get time to
-> replace it.
->
-> When you are replacing it, YES I would install some kind of "V" brace to
-> help you out. I've noticed the Rebels on floats go through windshields at a
-> much higher rate than their wheeled counterparts!
->
-> Wayne
->
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
-> Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
->
->
-> > Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,
-> >
-> > I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my (Super
-> > Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which
wraps
-> > around the front of the wing at the wing root.
-> >
-> > I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone has
had
-> > this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to stop
-> > propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering
-> myself
-> > grounded for now.
-> >
-> > I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in
comments
-> > from those that have been down this road already.
-> >
-> > I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any sharp
-> > edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the V-brace
-> in
-> > my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe
though
-> > I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as popped
-> door
-> > post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!
-> >
-> > Chris Gill
-> > SR#025, Anchorage, AK
-> > 907-227-9352
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> *-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> > To unsubscribe from this list go to:
-> > https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
-> > Archives located at https://www.dcsol.com/default.htm
-> > Archives public username "rebel" password "builder"
-> > To contact the list admin, e-mail mike.davis@dcsol.com
-> >
-> *-------------------------------------------------------------------------*
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> >
->




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[Scott Aldrich]

If you add the V brace it would be a good idea to add a channel on the
firewall that runs down vertically to pick up that main cross channel
between the upper engine mounts. The firewall is so flimsy you are not
gaining a whole lot just adding the brace and its attach angle to the
firewall. If it goes to a fifth engine mount point then it may be strong
enough as you have the loads going through the mount. It wouldn't be a bad
idea to have a vertical channel either way though.

Also, it would be a good idea to have gussets tabs added to the top of the V
tubes at the attach points (See previous posts about these cracking and
breaking on float equipped Moose). Better yet toss it out and make it with
heavier gauge steel on those upper brackets along with gussets.

Scott
Moose 174

-----Original Message-----
From: Scott & Leere' Aldrich [mailto:flynski@mwutah.com]
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 11:52 AM
To: sa@mwutah.com
Subject: FW: SR2500 Carcked Windshield



-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Al
Paxhia
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2004 4:14 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield

Mike,
I asked MAM about drilling through the square tube and Brian said don't do
it.
There are some heavy loads in compression on the tube and the bolt all the
way through to the v-brace could deform the tube over time. I have removed
and replaced the v-brace with the windshield and wings on, it took hours for
two of us. One on the inside with a wrench on the bolt head and the other
working through the slot between the wing and wing attach fitting, with a
wrench made for the job. If I had to do it again, I would pull the wing
bolts, fuel line and slide the wing back an inch.
It may take longer but it's more doable for fat old hands and low levels of
patience.
Al
Moose, N526AP
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Kimball" <mkimball@gci.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Cc: "Chris Gill" <gill@gci.net>
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2004 11:13 AM
Subject: RE: SR2500 Carcked Windshield

I don't see how a four point versus five point engine mount will make any
difference. I have the V-brace installed on my Super Rebel with the
standard four mounting points. MAM sells a 1/4 inch windshield which is
what I used. Might as well get the thickest one. The normal V-brace
install would require you to remove the wings to get to the back side of

the

bolts going through the square tube crossmember where the V-brace bolts

to.

However, I might suggest drilling all the way through the crossmember and
using a longer bolt so that you can put your wrench on the nut inside the
cockpit. With your instrument panel in the way it's going to be difficult
installing the large aluminum angle that goes under the glareshield where

it

meets the firewall. Get your close quarters drill ready. You'll probably
need it.

Mike Kimball
SR #044

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
rebel@dcsol.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2004 1:18 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield


Wayne,

Actually upon closer inspection it is more like a 12" crack.

I'll post a photo or two later today.

In talking to Murphy it sounds like the V-brace is reccomended on floats.

The trick may be I have the SR2500 4 point O-540 mount but the V-brace is
designed for the newer 5 point O-540 mount for the Moose. I'll have to
figure out how to make this work.

How come these things never break in the cold dark days of winter??

Chris


On 5/25/2004 5:02 PM, OIFA@IRISHFIELD.ON.CA wrote to MURPHY-REBEL:

-> Received: by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v6.0.451.1)
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:39 -0800
-> Received: from frodo.csolve.net ([207.164.81.3]) EHLO=frodo.csolve.net
-> by dcsol.com (Wildcat! SMTP v6.0.451.1) with SMTP
-> id 2412711546; Tue, 25 May 2004 17:05:37 -0800
-> Received: from cis-206.172.205.182.csolve.net ([206.172.205.182]
helo=celeron266a)
-> by frodo.csolve.net with esmtp (Exim 4.24)
-> id 1BSmqt-000Jaz-3D
-> for murphy-rebel@dcsol.com; Tue, 25 May 2004 21:05:04 -0400
-> Message-ID: <000d01c442bd$118382a0$e401910a@celeron266a>
-> From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> References: <1085531061@dcsol.com>
-> Subject: Re: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
-> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 21:02:04 -0400
-> Organization: O'Shea's Irish Field Aviation
-> X-Orig-MIME-Version: 1.0
-> X-Orig-Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
-> X-Orig-Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
-> X-Priority: 3
-> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
-> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200
-> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200
-> X-Antivirus-Remover: Message was filtered through wsMailGuard (wsAV)
->
-> Funny (well not really) but that is the same side the Rebel windshields
-> always cracks on as well. We had Howard's stop drilled for a few years.
He
-> had a crack that was about an inch long at the start that grew to 2"

and

-> then about 3" before I pulled it about the time the windshield was full
of
-> checks that made flying into the sun no fun.
->
-> Mind you... you are saying a SIX inch crack that is totally?? covered

by

the
-> fairing. The crack usually propagates from the heaviest part of the

bend

-> right by the wing attach carrythrough and usually heads downward on

about

a
-> 45* angle following the peak of the formed area. No matter what you

have

I
-> don't see why you can't stop drill it (shine a light into the acrylic

and

-> follow the hairline past what you see as a crack and drill another 1/2"
or
-> so past that to be sure you catch it all) and then if necessary use

tarp

-> tape or tin tape to hold the cracked section stable, until you get time
to
-> replace it.
->
-> When you are replacing it, YES I would install some kind of "V" brace

to

-> help you out. I've noticed the Rebels on floats go through windshields

at

a
-> much higher rate than their wheeled counterparts!
->
-> Wayne
->
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <rebel@dcsol.com>
-> To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 8:24 PM
-> Subject: SR2500 Carcked Windshield
->
->
-> > Rebel/Moose/Super Rebel Builders,
-> >
-> > I have just found a 6 inch crack in the upper left hand side of my
(Super
-> > Rebel) windshield. This is in the area covered by the fairing which
wraps
-> > around the front of the wing at the wing root.
-> >
-> > I will take photos and post tomorrow but I was wondering if anyone

has

had
-> > this occur in their windshield. If so, can the crack be drilled to
stop
-> > propogation and can the plane then be flown safely? I'm considering
-> myself
-> > grounded for now.
-> >
-> > I'll discuss this with Murphy tomorrow but I'm also interested in
comments
-> > from those that have been down this road already.
-> >
-> > I'm not sure why the window cracked. It is not in contact with any
sharp
-> > edges and was carefully installed. Perhaps I need to install the
V-brace
-> in
-> > my window as is done on the Moose to reduce flexing in the airframe
though
-> > I've not seen any other indications of flexing problems such as

popped

-> door
-> > post rivets. Bummer, and right before Memorial Day too!!
-> >
-> > Chris Gill
-> > SR#025, Anchorage, AK
-> > 907-227-9352
-> >
-> >
-> >
->

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