Nose Wheel Shimmy 1800 Amphibs

[WALTER KLATT]

You have to add washers to increase the tension. Tightening the bolt won't do it.

Congratulations on getting it up. I was out yesterday, too, in near 70's weather. Assume you guys are getting the same.

Walter

----- Original Message -----
From: Legeorgen@aol.com
Date: Monday, March 22, 2004 8:01 am
Subject: Re:Nose Wheel Shimmy 1800 Amphibs

I Flew and landed the 1800 Amphib Rebel yesterday. It flew and
handled very
well. I was very impressed to say the least.

I did experience a shimmy in both the front nose gear on landing.
I remember
Walter mentioning he had to tighten the bolt on the nose gear
tension washers.

I jacked up the front of the float but I found the bolts to be
hard to turn
(as in already tight) even though there was still a 1/16" of slop
so they could
be moved up and down while jacked up with no weight on the nose
wheel. I
didn't disassemble them put they felt as if there was a spacer
bushing holding
them apart and from closing tight.

The axle spacer bushings had 1/32" slop (ever so slight) so the
wheel could
be moved back and forth. I pinched the forks and retightened these
bolts
removing this space as well, thinking it would be more likely to
cause a shimmy.

I know tail wheels are very touchy and must be set at correct
angles and the
tension just right. So I'm finding these small nose gear on the
amphibs must
be very similar.

I haven't flown it yet after this adjustment. Any suggestions?

Bruce



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[Legeorgen]

I Flew and landed the 1800 Amphib Rebel yesterday. It flew and handled very
well. I was very impressed to say the least.

I did experience a shimmy in both the front nose gear on landing. I remember
Walter mentioning he had to tighten the bolt on the nose gear tension washers.

I jacked up the front of the float but I found the bolts to be hard to turn
(as in already tight) even though there was still a 1/16" of slop so they could
be moved up and down while jacked up with no weight on the nose wheel. I
didn't disassemble them put they felt as if there was a spacer bushing holding
them apart and from closing tight.

The axle spacer bushings had 1/32" slop (ever so slight) so the wheel could
be moved back and forth. I pinched the forks and retightened these bolts
removing this space as well, thinking it would be more likely to cause a shimmy.

I know tail wheels are very touchy and must be set at correct angles and the
tension just right. So I'm finding these small nose gear on the amphibs must
be very similar.

I haven't flown it yet after this adjustment. Any suggestions?

Bruce



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[Drew Dalgleish]

Congradulations Bruce. It'll be a couple months before all the ice is gone
and I get my floats back on. There shouldn't be any up and down movement of
the nosewheel at all. It sounds to me like you need some more wavy washers
to take up the slop. The nosewheel should be slightly stiff to turn from
the drag of the washers.
Drew

At 11:01 AM 3/22/2004 EST, you wrote:

I Flew and landed the 1800 Amphib Rebel yesterday. It flew and handled very
well. I was very impressed to say the least.

I did experience a shimmy in both the front nose gear on landing. I remember
Walter mentioning he had to tighten the bolt on the nose gear tension

washers.

I jacked up the front of the float but I found the bolts to be hard to turn
(as in already tight) even though there was still a 1/16" of slop so they

could

be moved up and down while jacked up with no weight on the nose wheel. I
didn't disassemble them put they felt as if there was a spacer bushing

holding

them apart and from closing tight.

The axle spacer bushings had 1/32" slop (ever so slight) so the wheel could
be moved back and forth. I pinched the forks and retightened these bolts
removing this space as well, thinking it would be more likely to cause a

shimmy.

I know tail wheels are very touchy and must be set at correct angles and the
tension just right. So I'm finding these small nose gear on the amphibs must
be very similar.

I haven't flown it yet after this adjustment. Any suggestions?

Bruce



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Drew




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[Bob Patterson]

Hi Bruce !

Congrats on getting it flying again ! Doesn't it fly GREAT on the
amphibs !??!!!! :-) :-) Bet you're still smiling !!

Sounds like you need more wavy washers in there - should be stiff
to move. It's a good idea to carry a few extra wavy washers with you -
they do wear a bit, and it is good to add more IMMEDIATELY if you get
ANY shimmy, as you can scrape the tread off those little tires in a
very few landings !! Also a good idea to carry a spare tube for both
the nose & main gear, and a spare nose tire ... as you know, these
can be hard to find sometimes ! ;-)

You're going to have LOTS of fun now !! I got a bit in on Friday -
was trying to get my Rebel down to the paint shop, but didn't make it in
time. Had to do "spring cleaning", oil change, etc., and ran out of daylight
BUT - had time for 3 quick circuits around the patch ! :-) :-) :-)
The Rebel hasn't forgotten how to fly - and the McKenzie STOL kit makes
my landings look sooooo good now, I'm spoiled ! Sure felt good after a
loooong coooold winter ! :-)

....bobp

----------------------------orig.-------------------
On Monday 22 March 2004 11:01 am, you wrote:

I Flew and landed the 1800 Amphib Rebel yesterday. It flew and handled very
well. I was very impressed to say the least.

I did experience a shimmy in both the front nose gear on landing. I

remember

Walter mentioning he had to tighten the bolt on the nose gear tension

washers.

I jacked up the front of the float but I found the bolts to be hard to turn
(as in already tight) even though there was still a 1/16" of slop so they

could

be moved up and down while jacked up with no weight on the nose wheel. I
didn't disassemble them put they felt as if there was a spacer bushing

holding

them apart and from closing tight.

The axle spacer bushings had 1/32" slop (ever so slight) so the wheel could
be moved back and forth. I pinched the forks and retightened these bolts
removing this space as well, thinking it would be more likely to cause a

shimmy.

I know tail wheels are very touchy and must be set at correct angles and

the

tension just right. So I'm finding these small nose gear on the amphibs

must

be very similar.

I haven't flown it yet after this adjustment. Any suggestions?

Bruce



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[Walter Klatt]

I vaguely remember that I went to Home Depot to get some extra
washers for mine. If I recall correctly they are 7/8 or 1 inch in
size, much larger than I had in my regular AN hardware inhouse
supply. I just took one of the existing flat ones, and found some
that matched in size.

In any case, you are on the right track. You need enough tension
so they don't shimmy, but not too much so that you have trouble
steering. For sure, there should be no slack.

How are your suspension pucks? You want to be sure that your
suspension is stiff enough so you don't bottom out on landings or
bumps. I think MAM changed them now, but my original ones were
useless, and they would squish out. I got some big blue ones from
Grant when he was there, and they did the trick for me.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com
[mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Legeorgen@aol.com
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 8:01 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Nose Wheel Shimmy 1800 Amphibs


Wayne,

I have wavy washers, just no extra's to pick up the
1/16" space. You answered
my question with the AN970's. I need more tension is
what I'm hearing. Thanks

Bruce



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[Legeorgen]

Walter, Drew,

I don't have any wavy washers. Do you think it would be OK to just add extra
bolt washers to pick up the space so I can make the nose gear tight?

the description you gave me of the first flight, Walter was about as accurate
as it gets. I don't know if you remember but I printed it out and took it
with me. Thanks. It was a big help!

Bruce



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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Are you saying you have no wavy washers (or just don't have any spares), If
none then MAM left some more parts out of yours and I guess I'd better take
a closer look at mine!

If you have some wavy washers in there already then you should be able to
take up the slop with penny AN970's the matching diameter.

Congrats on the first flight!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: <Legeorgen@aol.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 10:49 PM
Subject: Re: Nose Wheel Shimmy 1800 Amphibs

Walter, Drew,

I don't have any wavy washers. Do you think it would be OK to just add

extra

bolt washers to pick up the space so I can make the nose gear tight?

the description you gave me of the first flight, Walter was about as

accurate

as it gets. I don't know if you remember but I printed it out and took it
with me. Thanks. It was a big help!

Bruce

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[Legeorgen]

Wayne,

I have wavy washers, just no extra's to pick up the 1/16" space. You answered
my question with the AN970's. I need more tension is what I'm hearing. Thanks

Bruce



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[Drew Dalgleish]

At 11:01 PM 3/22/2004 EST, you wrote:

Wayne,

I have wavy washers, just no extra's to pick up the 1/16" space. You

answered

my question with the AN970's. I need more tension is what I'm hearing. Thanks

Bruce

There was a discussion about the number and placing of the washers some
time ago. You might be able to find some help in the archives. I'm curious
Bruce does Murphy include an assembly manual with the pre-built floats? If
not I'd be asking for one just to have all the part numbers.
Drew
Drew




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[Legeorgen]

Drew,

MAM included a manual with the prebuilts. I keep it at the hanger, however,
and it's not convenient at home while on the computer to look up part/names and
numbers.

Bruce



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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

The nose tires are still pretty easy to find. The mains I use to be able to
go over to our local Goodyear dealer and within a day have some new Chin
Cheng 11.00 x 4 x 5-8 plys and tubes to match in my hand.

When I was stretching the 1500's to 1800's I found the previous owner had
landed with his foot on one brake and flat spotted one brand new tire.
Luckily I was able to pick up a single tire on Ebay... as I started trying
to get some new tires June of 2002! and thanks to another local guy with the
same problem finally secured some tires, for spares (3 sets), last month
(Feb 2004!).

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <beep@sympatico.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 3:03 PM
Subject: Re:Nose Wheel Shimmy 1800 Amphibs

Hi Bruce !

Congrats on getting it flying again ! Doesn't it fly GREAT on the
amphibs !??!!!! :-) :-) Bet you're still smiling !!

Sounds like you need more wavy washers in there - should be stiff
to move. It's a good idea to carry a few extra wavy washers with you -
they do wear a bit, and it is good to add more IMMEDIATELY if you get
ANY shimmy, as you can scrape the tread off those little tires in a
very few landings !! Also a good idea to carry a spare tube for both
the nose & main gear, and a spare nose tire ... as you know, these
can be hard to find sometimes ! ;-)

You're going to have LOTS of fun now !! I got a bit in on Friday -
was trying to get my Rebel down to the paint shop, but didn't make it in
time. Had to do "spring cleaning", oil change, etc., and ran out of

daylight

BUT - had time for 3 quick circuits around the patch ! :-) :-) :-)
The Rebel hasn't forgotten how to fly - and the McKenzie STOL kit makes
my landings look sooooo good now, I'm spoiled ! Sure felt good after a
loooong coooold winter ! :-)

....bobp

----------------------------orig.-------------------
On Monday 22 March 2004 11:01 am, you wrote:

I Flew and landed the 1800 Amphib Rebel yesterday. It flew and handled

very

well. I was very impressed to say the least.

I did experience a shimmy in both the front nose gear on landing. I

remember

Walter mentioning he had to tighten the bolt on the nose gear tension

washers.

I jacked up the front of the float but I found the bolts to be hard to

turn

(as in already tight) even though there was still a 1/16" of slop so

they

could

be moved up and down while jacked up with no weight on the nose wheel. I
didn't disassemble them put they felt as if there was a spacer bushing

holding

them apart and from closing tight.

The axle spacer bushings had 1/32" slop (ever so slight) so the wheel

could

be moved back and forth. I pinched the forks and retightened these bolts
removing this space as well, thinking it would be more likely to cause a

shimmy.

I know tail wheels are very touchy and must be set at correct angles and

the

tension just right. So I'm finding these small nose gear on the amphibs

must

be very similar.

I haven't flown it yet after this adjustment. Any suggestions?

Bruce

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[Legeorgen]

Bobp,

Yea, those spare tubes can be a problem to find! My plane might still be at
Arlington getting rusty if you hadn't been there.

Are the amphib tubes and tires real aircraft supply or domestic stuff, like
the golf cart spring gear tire and tubes I can pick up locally?

I'm still envious of your McKinzie STOL kit. That might be next winters
project.

Bruce



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[Legeorgen]

Wayne,

That seems like a lot of work to obtain a few spare tire and tubes for the
amphibs. Is ordering spares form MAM to expensive, or did you just not want to
wait 6 months too get them?

Bruce



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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

One of those things when you get use to the local Goodyear guy taking care
of you.... for less money per tire than the shipping would cost from BC!
When they fell through my local fellow amphib owner took up the quest and
yes he contacted MAM and they had only one tire at the time...we wanted 8.
False promises of delivery from a few dealers dragged it out a year + and
then he found a tire shop in Toronto that was bringing a container load of
tires in from China and added our needs to the list. Took 3 months..but at
least his promised delivery date was good.

Guess we could have ordered from MAM and they might have won the delivery
race this time!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: <Legeorgen@aol.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 10:23 AM
Subject: Re: Nose Wheel Shimmy 1800 Amphibs

Wayne,

That seems like a lot of work to obtain a few spare tire and tubes for the
amphibs. Is ordering spares form MAM to expensive, or did you just not

want to

wait 6 months too get them?

Bruce

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[Drew Dalgleish]

At 10:15 AM 3/23/2004 EST, you wrote:

Bobp,

Yea, those spare tubes can be a problem to find! My plane might still be at
Arlington getting rusty if you hadn't been there.

Are the amphib tubes and tires real aircraft supply or domestic stuff, like
the golf cart spring gear tire and tubes I can pick up locally?

I'm still envious of your McKinzie STOL kit. That might be next winters
project.

Bruce

The Chen-shin tires are for industrial use. It never occurred to me that it
might be hard to find relacements. I think I'll try to find a set for spares.
Drew




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