Do you want this big green box to go away? Well here's how...

Click here for full update

Wildcat! photo archives restored.

Click here for full update

Donors can now disable ads.

Click here for instructions

Add yourself to the user map.

Click here for instructions

Floatplane engine falling off

General building discussions, not model specific.
WWhunter
Posts: 336
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 5:16 pm

Floatplane engine falling off

Post by WWhunter » Thu Dec 20, 2018 4:55 pm

I recently viewed a video on FB (The Aviator's Lounge) that appears to be a Rebel on Full Lotus floats. It makes a very hard landing on water, the engine dislodges and the plane flips. Anyone know the aircraft or of the incident? There is a guy commenting on the post and he definitely has a serious dislike of Murphy aircraft.
Last edited by WWhunter on Fri Dec 21, 2018 5:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

Washington Rebel
Posts: 501
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:01 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by Washington Rebel » Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:09 pm

I saw that. Was a very hard landing.
Tom
Rebel 831R
Flying as of May 2016

User avatar
schaumr
Posts: 319
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:06 am
Contact:

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by schaumr » Fri Dec 21, 2018 4:18 am

I'm not finding "The Aviators Lounge" on FB. Is this the exact spelling?

I see 'The Aviation Lounge' and lots of sites under 'Aviator's Lounge' but no site called 'The Aviators Lounge'.

Rob
Rob Schaum
Rebel 786 - Flying Since 2022
Connecticut
http://mykitlog.com/schaumr

WWhunter
Posts: 336
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 5:16 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by WWhunter » Fri Dec 21, 2018 5:07 am

The Aviator's Lounge but you might have to put the ' in before the s. The poster is Richard Smith.

SR Tim
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:42 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by SR Tim » Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:34 am

The hard landing is near the end of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC5yscm9dsI&t=24s
Tim Saxton
SR060


Flying Indian
Posts: 271
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2016 8:41 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by Flying Indian » Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:48 am

I saw that video too and it concerned me!!! Big engine installed with no mods done ?????

Coastflyer
Posts: 438
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:18 am

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by Coastflyer » Sat Dec 22, 2018 9:26 am

Very scary. It sure doesn’t seem like he hit hard enough to break the whole nose off the airplane. Definitely has a high sink rate though, and doesn’t appear to have any flaps deployed.
Jesse

Washington Rebel
Posts: 501
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:01 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by Washington Rebel » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:35 pm

Probably not the first time it has hit that hard.
Tom
Rebel 831R
Flying as of May 2016

irishfield
Posts: 1707
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:17 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by irishfield » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:58 pm

Only takes ONE of those 3000 FPM descents onto water to do that! Especially when you haven't double riveted your door post and / or added MAM's "float fix" doubler at the top between Fus-9 and the wing root panel.

It only takes the shearing of the first rivet to continue the shear process right to the bottom. Just like shearing a sheet of aluminum in the Browns and Boggs!

irishfield
Posts: 1707
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:17 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by irishfield » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:59 pm

BTW, that is Rick Porteous' Rebel. Built in 1993..

irishfield
Posts: 1707
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:17 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by irishfield » Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:13 pm

I was actually watching that video expecting the low wing to stall and spin into the crowd, trying to fly as slow as the Rebel! Just a dumb.. dumb.. exhibition to start with. Surprised TC didn't violate both involved.

Coastflyer
Posts: 438
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:18 am

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by Coastflyer » Sun Dec 23, 2018 8:50 am

Wayne, I paused the video as the nose separates and it looks like it broke below the windshield. So, the “float fix doublers” didn’t come into play I guess. It basically unzipped at the door posts, right? I did a double row of rivets there. My question is: if there is a sheared rivet there will it be obvious with a visual inspection? I’ve never seen a sheared Avex, so not sure what to look for.
Thanks
Jesse

irishfield
Posts: 1707
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:17 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by irishfield » Sat Dec 29, 2018 7:09 am

I double rivet right from the bottom of the door post. I've also had a fair number of Rebel's in the shop and / or walked by at fly ins that didn't have the Z pattern of rivets from Fus-9 into the upper corner wrap. It all adds up, but not much is going to save a -3000FPM arrival to water!

User avatar
Linlei
Posts: 172
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2012 1:11 pm

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by Linlei » Sat Dec 29, 2018 4:09 pm

I watched the video as well and was intrigued.
It's not the first time an engine has fallen off any given float plane on a water landing and there is at least one picture out there of another Rebel that lost its engine landing on water.
I had this conversation with an engineer friend if mine and he pointed me in the direction of load factors.
From the Murphy Rebel manual the load factors are +5.7/-3.8 at 1650 lbs. Who knows how much the airplane in question weighed during the accident so I had to make some assumptions.
It would follow that if -3.8 x 1650= -6270lbs of force was exceeded at touchdown that something bad would happen.
The long and the short of it was that after a bit of math it looks like less than 1800 fpm (6892 lbs force) would do the trick. Not as much as one might think but still excessive.
This leads me to believe there is not much point in worrying about engines falling off all the Rebels out there, however it does cause me to recall what my grandfather told me in a rare moment of sobriety " The earth is hard ".

Mike B.

Coastflyer
Posts: 438
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:18 am

Re: Floatplane engine falling off

Post by Coastflyer » Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:31 pm

Them would be positive Gs though
Jesse


Post Reply