for a kit or just for a ride, really has to be signed by all members of the
person's immediate and even extended family--as those are the ones likely to
be claimants in any lawsuit--if they sighed the release document (rather
than the person that was injured or killed) then it at least makes it harder
for them to win a lawsuit.
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Mike
Kimball
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2008 8:34 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] looking for SR kit
I love your addendum after your name Ron. Very funny. To add some more
thoughts, a friend of mine died in a car accident a few years ago and his
widow was advised by his brothers (both lawyers) to sell his flying Kitfox
as parts only. Some friends and I dissassembled the Kitfox for her so that
it would not be sold as an airplane. Just parts. From what you've said,
Ron, it sounds like that would protect the original Kitplane builder's
estate very little from potential liability. I would also assume that any
release of liability document you might get a buyer to sign would also be
worth less than the paper it's written on.
Mike
044SR
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mail to:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Ron
Shannon
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2008 9:38 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] looking for SR kit
Ben,
A few general thoughts on your query:
The final builder who applies for the cert is the official builder as far as
the FAA is concerned, and his name goes on the ID plate. Except as regarding
the final builder's qualification for a repairman's certificate, the DAR
doesn't care either way, as long as he's convinced it's been "51%" amateur
built.
The concern for the first builder, if he's listed somewhere without consent,
may be potential liability to third parties, like passengers. However, the
original builder is going to have the same potential liability exposure to
third parties -- for defects in any work done by that original builder --
whether the original builder is listed as a co-builder in the paperwork or
not. Even if not listed, his involvement would be discovered during
liability litigation, and if his work was alleged to be involved in causing
the injury or damage, he would likely be added to the case as an additional
defendant at that time.
It is highly unlikely that the original builder would have any claim against
the final builder for listing his name or including his logs without consent
because the implied representation by the final builder (that the original
did some of the work) would, in fact, be true. The consent of the original
builder is not required as a pre-condition to any accurate and truthful
statements of fact by the final builder. In fact, in most situations it
would be misleading, therefore wrong, if the final builder did _not_
accurately disclose any significant involvement by an original builder to a
subsequent buyer -- with or without permission.
BTW, the final builder would still _also_ be liable for _any_ defects
causing injury or damage because the final builder is responsible for the
whole airplane, i.e., responsible for checking the work of the first.
There have been some good articles in EAA publications about how to do your
utmost to avoid liability when selling your experimental -- highly
recommended reading. Still, the bottom line is that in most jurisdictions,
there's no bulletproof way to guarantee you're always going to be off the
hook in every situation, particularly vis-a-vis third parties like
passengers, relatives, property owners on the ground, etc.
Ron
[Ex-lawyer long ago, now reformed, though regrettably, vestiges of
degenerate thought processes remain. <g> DISCLAIMER: Your legal mileage is
almost certain to vary and, as applied to any particular case, the above
ramblings came from someone who has no idea what he'd talking about, and are
worth less than you paid for them.]
On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 9:32 AM, <bransom@dcsol.com> wrote:
asI've always assumed that a previous owner/builder would have to consent to
having his name included as one of the builders. By consent, I mean
selling the project with build logs showing that he actually made part of
the plane. I've not paid attention to a lot of sold projects, but I know
of some where the previous owner provided build photos, but no signatures
indicating who did what. And also one where the new owner lucked out in
finally coercing the previous owner to stay on record as a builder.
Anyway, I wonder what happens if a new owner includes the previous owner
a builder without his knowledge or consent. Probably depends on how the
DAR wants to handle it.
-Ben/496R
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