The Murphy Builders Site

I am flying a Rebel with a Lycoming O-235 L2C engine, and I am burning 93 octane auto fuel (normally BP brand). I am noticing more and more auto fuel pumps stating that they contain 10% ethanol. Is this enough ethanol to do any harm to my engine, fuel system or wing tanks? Also, is there a procedure for removing the ethanol from the gasoline once it is in solution in the gas. Any response will be appreciated.

Safe flying,
Scott

-------------- Original message from Drew Dalgleish <drewjan@cabletv.on.ca>: --------------

Just got my COPA newspaper and there's a lovely picture of a tubine powered
moose on the cover.
Drew



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Yes. Corrosion, rubber deterioration, burnt valves, and sudden failure
due to phase separation. Look at the EAA articles and such.

Alcohol can be removed by the same process that we use to test for it
but I'd suggest that it is not practical.
Even with an automotive fuel system I still test every batch of gas for
alcohol and it does not go in the plane or any of my small engines if it
has booze in it. My engine will still quit if the alcohol separates and
I've had huge problems with separation in small carbuerated engines in
cool weather.

Coming through the Northern States last summer, several service stations
advertised "non-oxygenated" premium fuel for older vehicles, farm
vehicles, etc. That would be without alcohol.

In Ontario here so far I've not seen booze in premium fuel. There is no
requirement to label gas that contains booze here in Ontario but some
stations put the label on regardless of whether or not there is alcohol
in it. Booze also leans out the engine but that is the least of my
concerns. Mind you, the current alcohol level in regular grade gas near
Toronto leans out my little Saturn car so far that it will throw a fault
code for missing if idled more than about a minute when cold. It was OK
at 5% but not at our currently mandated 10+ %. Interestingly I recently
browsed a 2007 Toyota manual that specifies 5% max.

If pure gas is not available I'd recommend avgas and a lead scavenging
additive.

Ken

flyexp@bellsouth.net wrote:

I am flying a Rebel with a Lycoming O-235 L2C engine, and I am burning 93 octane auto fuel (normally BP brand).

I am noticing more and more auto fuel pumps stating that they contain
10% ethanol.

Is this enough ethanol to do any harm to my engine, fuel system or
wing tanks?

Also, is there a procedure for removing the ethanol from the gasoline
once it is in solution in the gas. Any response will be appreciated.

Safe flying,
Scott

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Hi Scott !

You will do your engine a lot of good by running at least one
tankful of 100LL for every 3 or 4 of mogas. This is 1938 tractor
technology, and these engines need lead to lubricate the valve
seats !

I ran a Rebel with an O-235 for about 7 years, with one tank
full of 100 LL, and the other with Shell Bronze... Used the 100LL
for takeoof & climb, to put the lead on when the engine was hot,
and the Shell for cruise .... had just the normal Lycosaurus wear
things... This was before they started adding ethanol, which is
just dumb - bad science !! Here, you are pretty safe with Shell
Gold - the premium gas, as they have promissed not to add
alcohol to it as long as they can .... Might be the same in your
area. Once you get to premium gas, it's not much more $$ to
go to 100 LL, and a LOT safer !!!
(It also keeps FBO's friendly and helpful ! ;-) )

Long term, the ethanol will eat gaskets, and all aluminum -
piping, tanks, carburetor bowls, manifolds ..... BAD NEWS !!!

--
......bobp
bobp@prosumers.ca
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com
http://apatterson2.ordermygift.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Friday 29 February 2008 23:08, flyexp@bellsouth.net wrote:

I am flying a Rebel with a Lycoming O-235 L2C engine, and I am burning 93
octane auto fuel (normally BP brand). I am noticing more and more auto
fuel pumps stating that they contain 10% ethanol. Is this enough ethanol
to do any harm to my engine, fuel system or wing tanks? Also, is there a
procedure for removing the ethanol from the gasoline once it is in
solution in the gas. Any response will be appreciated.

Safe flying,
Scott

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To All,

Thanks for the response on my question concerning using auto fuel containing ethanol in my Rebel. I am switch to 100LL.

Scott
-------------- Original message from Bob Patterson <bobp@prosumers.ca>: --------------

Hi Scott !

You will do your engine a lot of good by running at least one
tankful of 100LL for every 3 or 4 of mogas. This is 1938 tractor
technology, and these engines need lead to lubricate the valve
seats !

I ran a Rebel with an O-235 for about 7 years, with one tank
full of 100 LL, and the other with Shell Bronze... Used the 100LL
for takeoof & climb, to put the lead on when the engine was hot,
and the Shell for cruise .... had just the normal Lycosaurus wear
things... This was before they started adding ethanol, which is
just dumb - bad science !! Here, you are pretty safe with Shell
Gold - the premium gas, as they have promissed not to add
alcohol to it as long as they can .... Might be the same in your
area. Once you get to premium gas, it's not much more $$ to
go to 100 LL, and a LOT safer !!!
(It also keeps FBO's friendly and helpful ! ;-) )

Long term, the ethanol will eat gaskets, and all aluminum -
piping, tanks, carburetor bowls, manifolds ..... BAD NEWS !!!

--
......bobp
bobp@prosumers.ca
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com
http://apatterson2.ordermygift.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Friday 29 February 2008 23:08, flyexp@bellsouth.net wrote:

I am flying a Rebel with a Lycoming O-235 L2C engine, and I am burning 93
octane auto fuel (normally BP brand). I am noticing more and more auto
fuel pumps stating that they contain 10% ethanol. Is this enough ethanol
to do any harm to my engine, fuel system or wing tanks? Also, is there a
procedure for removing the ethanol from the gasoline once it is in
solution in the gas. Any response will be appreciated.

Safe flying,
Scott

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