Page 1 of 2

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by jean.poirier
Hello Keith

I have see a Rebel with a Continental A-65! It was flying under A.U.L.A. (like light sport in USA) . My C150 fly very well with a 0-200 at
1600# gross (official weight... I am 225#, full gas and a passenger...) so I am sure the Rebel will fly behind those engine! But my Rebel is
not flying yet (will with a 0-235) so my opinion is surely not the best one to have...!

Jean

On Thu Feb 7 12:22 , Keith Leitch <im_planecrazy@yahoo.com> sent:
Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.

Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel? They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food
for thought.
Keith
R661

Jean Poirier jean.poirier@oxyportneuf.com> wrote: So quiet

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Keith Leitch
Jean,
A 65!!! That must be quite the little fuel efficient Rebel.
I know now that I will have to go the Sport Pilot route as far as license/rating goes. I have been flying with a medical for 20 years but guess those days are over. The problem is I have been building my Rebel for the O-320 and have been spraying every piece with Epoxy Primer and plan on putting on Alex's leading edge kit. Already have Dave Fife's tips.
Maybe this summer I can find someone with a Rebel with a Rotax and go for a ride. Going to try and get a ride in a 320 powered one also.
Keith

jean.poirier@oxyportneuf.com wrote: Hello Keith

I have see a Rebel with a Continental A-65! It was flying under A.U.L.A. (like light sport in USA) . My C150 fly very well with a 0-200 at
1600# gross (official weight... I am 225#, full gas and a passenger...) so I am sure the Rebel will fly behind those engine! But my Rebel is
not flying yet (will with a 0-235) so my opinion is surely not the best one to have...!

Jean

On Thu Feb 7 12:22 , Keith Leitch sent:
Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.

Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel? They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food
for thought.
Keith
R661

Jean Poirier jean.poirier@oxyportneuf.com> wrote: So quiet

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by jean.poirier
You shoul talk to Bob Patterson!

He is the MAM salesman in Canada. He have owned 3-4 Rebel and he alwasy say that the next and ultimite will be again with a Rotax 912...
My self, I would like also the new light version of the 0-200 (check the last Kitplane, the one with the Texas Cub/0-200). The LSA Cessna will
also fly with that engine. The GreatPlains Volks convertion with the reduction could also be fit but reliability have to be proove... The Rotech
radial will do the job also but at that price I would go for a Rotax.

2 cents opinion

Jean
Rebel 747R

On Thu Feb 7 16:04 , Keith Leitch <im_planecrazy@yahoo.com> sent:
Jean,
A 65!!! That must be quite the little fuel efficient Rebel.
I know now that I will have to go the Sport Pilot route as far as license/rating goes. I have been flying with a medical for 20 years but guess
those days are over. The problem is I have been building my Rebel for the O-320 and have been spraying every piece with Epoxy Primer and
plan on putting on Alex's leading edge kit. Already have Dave Fife's tips.
Maybe this summer I can find someone with a Rebel with a Rotax and go for a ride. Going to try and get a ride in a 320 powered one also.
Keith

jean.poirier@oxyportneuf.com wrote: Hello Keith

I have see a Rebel with a Continental A-65! It was flying under A.U.L.A. (like light sport in USA) . My C150 fly very well with a 0-200 at
1600# gross (official weight... I am 225#, full gas and a passenger...) so I am sure the Rebel will fly behind those engine! But my Rebel is
not flying yet (will with a 0-235) so my opinion is surely not the best one to have...!

Jean

On Thu Feb 7 12:22 , Keith Leitch sent:
Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the
computer.
Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel? They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just
food
for thought.
Keith
R661

Jean Poirier jean.poirier@oxyportneuf.com> wrote: So quiet

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Charlie Eubanks
Keith

I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I had
originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the price in
the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used Rotax is rare and
hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a lot better even
though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would like to hear from any
one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and what kind of performance
they are getting just operating wheels only.

Charlie E.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Keith Leitch" <im_planecrazy@yahoo.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 11:22 AM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again


[quote]Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if
we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.

Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel?
They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food for
thought.

Keith
R661

Jean Poirier <jean.poirier@oxyportneuf.com> wrote: So quiet. prefer make
a test !

Jean
Rebel 747R

Jean Poirier
Pr

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Keith Leitch
Charlie,

That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily researching the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to where I feel it will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read where places that use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach TBO. And repair is as much as buying a new engine. They do relay that they are reliable and fuel efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an engine that only lasts 1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!!
That Continental is looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320 but now that I need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else out.
Another member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its a Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the progress of both of these guys.

Keith

Charlie Eubanks <charlie@troyairpark.com> wrote:
Keith

I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I had
originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the price in
the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used Rotax is rare and
hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a lot better even
though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would like to hear from any
one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and what kind of performance
they are getting just operating wheels only.

Charlie E.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Keith Leitch"
To:
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 11:22 AM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again


[quote]Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if
we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.

Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel?
They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food for
thought.

Keith
R661

Jean Poirier wrote: So quiet. prefer make
a test !

Jean
Rebel 747R

Jean Poirier
Pr

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Joe Ronco
KEITH: Do you have any more information about the EI260(?) Scandinavian
engine that you referred to? A web site? Is this the ULPower UL260i from
Belgium?



Joe Ronco



-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Keith
Leitch
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 11:59 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again



Charlie,



That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily researching
the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to where I feel it
will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read where places that
use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach TBO. And repair is as
much as buying a new engine. They do relay that they are reliable and fuel
efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an engine that only lasts
1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!!

That Continental is looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320
but now that I need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else
out.

Another member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its
a Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru
than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the progress
of both of these guys.



Keith



Charlie Eubanks <charlie@troyairpark.com> wrote:

Keith



I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I had

originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the price in

the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used Rotax is rare and


hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a lot better even

though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would like to hear from any

one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and what kind of performance

they are getting just operating wheels only.



Charlie E.



----- Original Message -----

From: "Keith Leitch"

To:

Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 11:22 AM

Subject: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again




Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if
we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.
Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel?
They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food for
thought.
Keith
R661
Jean Poirier wrote: So quiet. prefer make
a test !
Jean
Rebel 747R
Jean Poirier
Pr

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Keith Leitch
Joe,
Sorry....that is the one I am refering to. I am on a borrowed computer and didn't have the info in front of me. I was trying to get it out of my head and there's not much in there. LOL
Keith

Joe Ronco <joe@halzel.com> wrote:
KEITH: Do you have any more information about the EI260(?) Scandinavian
engine that you referred to? A web site? Is this the ULPower UL260i from
Belgium?



Joe Ronco



-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Keith
Leitch
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 11:59 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again



Charlie,



That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily researching
the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to where I feel it
will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read where places that
use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach TBO. And repair is as
much as buying a new engine. They do relay that they are reliable and fuel
efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an engine that only lasts
1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!!

That Continental is looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320
but now that I need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else
out.

Another member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its
a Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru
than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the progress
of both of these guys.



Keith



Charlie Eubanks wrote:

Keith



I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I had

originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the price in

the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used Rotax is rare and


hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a lot better even

though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would like to hear from any

one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and what kind of performance

they are getting just operating wheels only.



Charlie E.



----- Original Message -----

From: "Keith Leitch"

To:

Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 11:22 AM

Subject: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again




Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if
we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.
Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel?
They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food for
thought.
Keith
R661
Jean Poirier wrote: So quiet. prefer make
a test !
Jean
Rebel 747R
Jean Poirier
Pr

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Joe Ronco
Thanks Keith.

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Keith
Leitch
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 12:50 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Joe,
Sorry....that is the one I am refering to. I am on a borrowed computer and
didn't have the info in front of me. I was trying to get it out of my head
and there's not much in there. LOL
Keith

Joe Ronco <joe@halzel.com> wrote:
KEITH: Do you have any more information about the EI260(?) Scandinavian
engine that you referred to? A web site? Is this the ULPower UL260i from
Belgium?



Joe Ronco



-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Keith
Leitch
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 11:59 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again



Charlie,



That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily researching
the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to where I feel it
will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read where places that
use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach TBO. And repair is as
much as buying a new engine. They do relay that they are reliable and fuel
efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an engine that only lasts
1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!!

That Continental is looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320
but now that I need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else
out.

Another member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its
a Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru
than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the progress
of both of these guys.



Keith



Charlie Eubanks wrote:

Keith



I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I had

originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the price in

the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used Rotax is rare and


hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a lot better even

though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would like to hear from any

one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and what kind of performance

they are getting just operating wheels only.



Charlie E.



----- Original Message -----

From: "Keith Leitch"

To:

Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 11:22 AM

Subject: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again




Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if
we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.
Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel?
They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food for
thought.
Keith
R661
Jean Poirier wrote: So quiet. prefer make
a test !
Jean
Rebel 747R
Jean Poirier
Pr

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Ken
Has anyone considered VW engine such as Great Plains or a Corvair for
cheap power?
At LSA weights I'd think it might be viable if you just wanted to fly
economically and not go fast... Remember engine weight is only part of
it, engine + fuel weight for the mission is what counts.

There is a good recent VW thread on the RAH list.

Ken

Keith Leitch wrote:
Charlie,

That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily researching the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to where I feel it will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read where places that use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach TBO. And repair is as much as buying a new engine. They do relay that they are reliable and fuel efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an engine that only lasts 1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!!
That Continental is looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320 but now that I need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else out.
Another member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its a Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the progress of both of these guys.

Keith

Charlie Eubanks <charlie@troyairpark.com> wrote:
Keith

I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I had
originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the price in
the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used Rotax is rare and
hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a lot better even
though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would like to hear from any
one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and what kind of performance
they are getting just operating wheels only.

Charlie E.

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[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Walter Klatt
Not sure about the current used prices and availability of the O-200, but I
know they were very, very cheap a few years back. A couple local guys
upgraded their Renegades to mid-time O-200s for around $5000.

If a 912 only lasts 1000 - 1500 hours, it would have to be treated very,
very badly. I have heard of some going over 3000 hours with no major work. I
would bet you have a better chance of reaching 2000 hours with the 912, than
the O-200. Both Lycs and Conts are susceptible to valve train problems and
cracked cylinders. Lycs are also really bad with camshaft corrosion.

Of course, you can't beat a new Lycoming clone with roller lifters, EI, high
flow cylinders that don't rust, balanced oil case, blah, blah,... Now if I
could just get it flying... Who was it that talked me into getting that
@#&%ing Vans airbox?? Besides getting it to fit, you even have to fabricate
your own carb heat mechanism...

Well, at least, not missing much good flying here with our weather this
winter. Great skiing, though.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Keith
Leitch
Sent: February 10, 2008 10:59 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Charlie,

That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily researching
the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to where I feel it
will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read where places that
use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach TBO. And repair is as
much as buying a new engine. They do relay that they are reliable and fuel
efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an engine that only lasts
1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!!
That Continental is looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320
but now that I need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else
out.
Another member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its
a Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru
than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the progress
of both of these guys.

Keith

Charlie Eubanks <charlie@troyairpark.com> wrote:
Keith

I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I had
originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the price in
the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used Rotax is rare and

hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a lot better even
though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would like to hear from any
one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and what kind of performance
they are getting just operating wheels only.

Charlie E.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Keith Leitch"
To:
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 11:22 AM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again


[quote]Okay Jean, since it has been so quite I'll throw out a question to see if
we can get these guys away from their fireplaces and on the computer.

Has anyone ever thought of using an Continental C-90 or O-200 on a Rebel?
They put out decent HP and lots of O-200's out there. Just food for
thought.

Keith
R661

Jean Poirier wrote: So quiet. prefer make
a test !

Jean
Rebel 747R

Jean Poirier
Pr

[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Bob Patterson
Another VW to look at would be the Aero-V from the Sonex folks ....

The problem with VW's and Jabiru's is that the peak power comes in
past 3,200 rpm - this means a short prop, which doesn't work well with
the fat Rebel fuselage stopping most of the meager wash ...

I suspect you could fly a Rebel with the 80 hp or so .. VW engines, but
you would likely get the effect of maybe 65 hp - still flyable, but not
great performance. The Rotax works so well because the gearbox
allows a longer, slow turning prop - lots of torque & pull.

My 80 hp. Rotax 912 took over 600 hours just to break-in !! There
are several of these engines still pulling training aircraft after 4,000 +
hours, with only minor maintenance. They require 'way less regular
work than Lycosauruses or Clunktinentals !

Total parts cost to run my 912 for 1,000 hours was about $700.00,
including spark plugs & oil filters. To run my Lycoming O-235 for
1,000 hours, parts cost (not incl. LABOUR !) was about $7,000 !!
(2 cracked, worn cylinders, exhaust system, 1 magneto, carb overhaul ...)
.... and it burned almost twice as much fuel !
You pays me now, or you pays me later !!! ;-)

--
......bobp
bobp@prosumers.ca
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com
http://apatterson2.ordermygift.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Sunday 10 February 2008 20:56, Ken wrote:
Has anyone considered VW engine such as Great Plains or a Corvair for
cheap power?
At LSA weights I'd think it might be viable if you just wanted to fly
economically and not go fast... Remember engine weight is only part of
it, engine + fuel weight for the mission is what counts.

There is a good recent VW thread on the RAH list.

Ken

Keith Leitch wrote:
Charlie,

That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily
researching the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to
where I feel it will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read
where places that use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach
TBO. And repair is as much as buying a new engine. They do relay that
they are reliable and fuel efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an
engine that only lasts 1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!! That Continental is
looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320 but now that I
need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else out. Another
member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its a
Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru
than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the
progress of both of these guys.

Keith

Charlie Eubanks <charlie@troyairpark.com> wrote:
Keith

I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I
had originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the
price in the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used
Rotax is rare and hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a
lot better even though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would
like to hear from any one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and
what kind of performance they are getting just operating wheels only.

Charlie E.



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[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Dale Fultz
How is the engine change going overall though Walter... is it worth it or
won't you know til flying comes..??? Dale




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[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Walter Klatt
It's going,... just slow. Basically redoing my FWF from scratch. Just about
done my airbox, or so I hope... Still have to redo the bottom of my cowl, to
clear the airbox, and just better airflow. This cowl is better than my old
one, but still needs lots of work. Then will have to do my exhaust (still
waiting for a heat muff), spinner (hope the Van's spinner is easier to do
than their airbox), wiring my EI, painting. And it's not like I was sitting
around the last couple of months...

Heading to Maui in a couple of weeks, so won't get done much then either.
Was planning to have it flying in March, now be lucky if I have it going by
the end of April.

Yeah, I think it will be worth it. It was a pretty good performer before.
Now it will just be better...

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Dale
Fultz
Sent: February 10, 2008 8:05 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Engine question...again

How is the engine change going overall though Walter... is it worth it or
won't you know til flying comes..??? Dale




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[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by Keith Leitch
Bob,

Maybe what I have been reading is a bunch of baloney on the Rotax. I was only relaying what a guy said that runs several of them in a fleet of trainers. I'll have to see if I can find the thread and on what forum I was on. I do remember him saying they were good but longevity sucked. I really do like the Rotax but I think it is out of my price range.

Keith

Bob Patterson <bobp@prosumers.ca> wrote:

Another VW to look at would be the Aero-V from the Sonex folks ....

The problem with VW's and Jabiru's is that the peak power comes in
past 3,200 rpm - this means a short prop, which doesn't work well with
the fat Rebel fuselage stopping most of the meager wash ...

I suspect you could fly a Rebel with the 80 hp or so .. VW engines, but
you would likely get the effect of maybe 65 hp - still flyable, but not
great performance. The Rotax works so well because the gearbox
allows a longer, slow turning prop - lots of torque & pull.

My 80 hp. Rotax 912 took over 600 hours just to break-in !! There
are several of these engines still pulling training aircraft after 4,000 +
hours, with only minor maintenance. They require 'way less regular
work than Lycosauruses or Clunktinentals !

Total parts cost to run my 912 for 1,000 hours was about $700.00,
including spark plugs & oil filters. To run my Lycoming O-235 for
1,000 hours, parts cost (not incl. LABOUR !) was about $7,000 !!
(2 cracked, worn cylinders, exhaust system, 1 magneto, carb overhaul ...)
.... and it burned almost twice as much fuel !
You pays me now, or you pays me later !!! ;-)

--
......bobp
bobp@prosumers.ca
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com
http://apatterson2.ordermygift.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Sunday 10 February 2008 20:56, Ken wrote:
Has anyone considered VW engine such as Great Plains or a Corvair for
cheap power?
At LSA weights I'd think it might be viable if you just wanted to fly
economically and not go fast... Remember engine weight is only part of
it, engine + fuel weight for the mission is what counts.

There is a good recent VW thread on the RAH list.

Ken

Keith Leitch wrote:
Charlie,

That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily
researching the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to
where I feel it will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read
where places that use them a lot have a hard time getting them to reach
TBO. And repair is as much as buying a new engine. They do relay that
they are reliable and fuel efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an
engine that only lasts 1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!! That Continental is
looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320 but now that I
need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else out. Another
member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its a
Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the Jabiru
than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the
progress of both of these guys.

Keith

Charlie Eubanks wrote:
Keith

I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I
had originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the
price in the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used
Rotax is rare and hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a
lot better even though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would
like to hear from any one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200 and
what kind of performance they are getting just operating wheels only.

Charlie E.



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[rebel-builders] Engine question...again

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:26 pm
by schaumr
Keith,

Check out www.flycorvair.com for an alternative to VW engines.

A Wagabond, Skycoupe, and Zenith 701 are just 3 examples of slower, high
wing aircraft (not to mention the countless Pietenpols) that seem to have
found sufficient performance behind a ~3000 rpm prop. William Wynne has
some thoughts on the long v. short prop debate; he worked for MT propellers
for several years.

Rob



On 2/10/2008 9:38 PM, im_planecrazy@yahoo.com wrote to rebel-builders:

-> Bob,
->
-> Maybe what I have been reading is a bunch of baloney on the Rotax. I
was only relaying what a guy said that runs several of them in a fleet of
trainers. I'll have to see if I can find the thread and on what forum I was on.
I do remember him saying they were good but longevity sucked. I really do
like the Rotax but I think it is out of my price range.
->
-> Keith
->
-> Bob Patterson <bobp@prosumers.ca> wrote:
->
-> Another VW to look at would be the Aero-V from the Sonex folks ....
->
-> The problem with VW's and Jabiru's is that the peak power comes in
-> past 3,200 rpm - this means a short prop, which doesn't work well with
-> the fat Rebel fuselage stopping most of the meager wash ...
->
-> I suspect you could fly a Rebel with the 80 hp or so .. VW engines, but
-> you would likely get the effect of maybe 65 hp - still flyable, but not
-> great performance. The Rotax works so well because the gearbox
-> allows a longer, slow turning prop - lots of torque & pull.
->
-> My 80 hp. Rotax 912 took over 600 hours just to break-in !! There
-> are several of these engines still pulling training aircraft after 4,000 +
-> hours, with only minor maintenance. They require 'way less regular
-> work than Lycosauruses or Clunktinentals !
->
-> Total parts cost to run my 912 for 1,000 hours was about $700.00,
-> including spark plugs & oil filters. To run my Lycoming O-235 for
-> 1,000 hours, parts cost (not incl. LABOUR !) was about $7,000 !!
-> (2 cracked, worn cylinders, exhaust system, 1 magneto, carb overhaul ...)
-> .... and it burned almost twice as much fuel !
-> You pays me now, or you pays me later !!! ;-)
->
-> --
-> ......bobp
-> bobp@prosumers.ca
-> http://www.prosumers.ca
-> http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
-> http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com
-> http://apatterson2.ordermygift.com
->
-> -------------------------------orig.-------------------------
-> On Sunday 10 February 2008 20:56, Ken wrote:
-> > Has anyone considered VW engine such as Great Plains or a Corvair for
-> > cheap power?
-> > At LSA weights I'd think it might be viable if you just wanted to fly
-> > economically and not go fast... Remember engine weight is only part of
-> > it, engine + fuel weight for the mission is what counts.
-> >
-> > There is a good recent VW thread on the RAH list.
-> >
-> > Ken
-> >
-> > Keith Leitch wrote:
-> > > Charlie,
-> > >
-> > > That is the main reason for my question. I have been heavily
-> > > researching the Rotax and like you, I noticed the price has gone up to
-> > > where I feel it will not be feasable for me to use one. I also have read
-> > > where places that use them a lot have a hard time getting them to
reach
-> > > TBO. And repair is as much as buying a new engine. They do relay that
-> > > they are reliable and fuel efficient but to me paying $20,000+ for an
-> > > engine that only lasts 1,000-1,500 hrs is NUTS!! That Continental is
-> > > looking better all the time. I had planned on an O-320 but now that I
-> > > need to go the LSA route I'll have to figure something else out.
Another
-> > > member on this site is strongly leaning towards the IE260 (?), its a
-> > > Scandanavian engine and it does look promising. There is also the
Jabiru
-> > > than another member is using. I'll definitely be keeping up on the
-> > > progress of both of these guys.
-> > >
-> > > Keith
-> > >
-> > > Charlie Eubanks wrote:
-> > > Keith
-> > >
-> > > I am building my Rebel to gross at 1320 Lbs. so I can fly it as LSA. I
-> > > had originally planed on installing a 100 HP Rotax in my Rebel but the
-> > > price in the last 8-10 months has increased a good 30+%. and a used
-> > > Rotax is rare and hard to find. As a result the 0-200 Cont. is looking a
-> > > lot better even though it is 65+ Lbs. heaver then the Rotax. I would
-> > > like to hear from any one out there who is flying a Rebel with 0-200
and
-> > > what kind of performance they are getting just operating wheels only.
-> > >
-> > > Charlie E.
-> >
->
->
->
->
->
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