The Murphy Builders Site

Hi everybody, summer greetings!

I've been running a McCauley 74X56 (now re-pitched 54") that was on my

Built the engine up to 160+hp; the prop worked great at 56" on wheels and

Off the water in fairly quick times at gross+ and cruises at 80kts IAS at

Max static rpm is 2400 and max level flight rpm is 2550.

Not getting to the 2700rpm where all the horsepower lives. Possibly a bit

So, to complicate the equation I bought an 80X40 Borer (McCauley) off a

I intend to install this prop as-is and verify performance but I'm

Has anyone else tried a Borer? Results? Numbers? Advice? I know that

As an aside to this I heard today from Carm Titus that his cousin Mike

Thanks and best regards to everyone, Angus

Hi Drew,
Please tell me more about your Prince prop.
Weight, pitch, rpm's, performance, $??

I was talking to Clair about replacing my float-brace wires with his
Scottish made-rolled thread, aerodynamic flying rods and he is putting a
price together for me. Will let you know.

We've been up around MacKeller; and into Manitouabin, Long, Axe and
Snakeskin lakes this year, is that near where you are?
Thanks........Angus

Hi Drew,
Please tell me more about your Prince prop.
Weight, pitch, rpm's, performance, $??

I was talking to Clair about replacing my float-brace wires with his
Scottish made-rolled thread, aerodynamic flying rods and he is putting a
price together for me. Will let you know.

We've been up around MacKeller; and into Manitouabin, Long, Axe and
Snakeskin lakes this year, is that near where you are?
Thanks........Angus

Thanks for the info Drew,
Did you purchase the prop through Murphy?
All your numbers sound real good to me, my plane is a bit heavy, I always
fill the fuel tank and tend to load too much stuff.
As an aside; I have not moved my trim for almost 2 years it is aligned at
neutral with the trailing edge, in flight I can tell when the dog is moving
around behind me but it doesn't change the angle of attack or stick
pressure.
The flying rods are intended to be a more certain structural member than the
wires. Not concerned about aerodynamics as much as worried about stretching
the thimbles or breaking on rough water.
We stayed home from Muskoka this week due to the crapy weather, I'm working
over the weekend then we plan to head back up north on the 26th.
Regards, Angus

Drew, what is your top speed straight and level, WOT, and at what rpm? Do
you have 150 or 160 hp?

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Drew
Dalgleish
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 6:59 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Props

At 08:56 AM 8/21/2007 -0400, you wrote:

Hi Drew,
Please tell me more about your Prince prop.
Weight, pitch, rpm's, performance, $??

I was talking to Clair about replacing my float-brace wires with his
Scottish made-rolled thread, aerodynamic flying rods and he is putting a
price together for me. Will let you know.

We've been up around MacKeller; and into Manitouabin, Long, Axe and
Snakeskin lakes this year, is that near where you are?
Thanks........Angus

Hi Angus I'll have to check my log book for the prop size. I'm not sure of
the weight but it's less than 10lbs. It seems to be well matched to my
engine it'll run up around 2600rpm for climb out and up just past red line
in level flight. 2400rpm gives 105mph indicated 2500 gets me close to 115.
I'm pretty sure my airspeed indicator is a bit optomistic though. I don't
often fly at gross but with me full fuel and 50lbs baggage I climb at
around 1000fpm at 80mph. It'll climb a bit faster at 70 but I can't see
where I'm going then. Real world performance is it's 172 miles to the
cottage from Centralia by GPS and I can get there in about 1.8hrs hobbs
time that includes taxiing etc. We're on little McKellar lake that's the
next one north of Manitouwabing so you were right in the neighbourhood.

I don't know much about flying rods I'm sure more aerodynamic is better but
would they make a noticable difference. Also is there any spring in the
wires we have now and if so is that a good or bad thing?
Drew



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Drew, what is your top speed straight and level, WOT, and at what rpm? Do
you have 150 or 160 hp?

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Drew
Dalgleish
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 6:59 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Props

At 08:56 AM 8/21/2007 -0400, you wrote:

Hi Drew,
Please tell me more about your Prince prop.
Weight, pitch, rpm's, performance, $??

I was talking to Clair about replacing my float-brace wires with his
Scottish made-rolled thread, aerodynamic flying rods and he is putting a
price together for me. Will let you know.

We've been up around MacKeller; and into Manitouabin, Long, Axe and
Snakeskin lakes this year, is that near where you are?
Thanks........Angus

Hi Angus I'll have to check my log book for the prop size. I'm not sure of
the weight but it's less than 10lbs. It seems to be well matched to my
engine it'll run up around 2600rpm for climb out and up just past red line
in level flight. 2400rpm gives 105mph indicated 2500 gets me close to 115.
I'm pretty sure my airspeed indicator is a bit optomistic though. I don't
often fly at gross but with me full fuel and 50lbs baggage I climb at
around 1000fpm at 80mph. It'll climb a bit faster at 70 but I can't see
where I'm going then. Real world performance is it's 172 miles to the
cottage from Centralia by GPS and I can get there in about 1.8hrs hobbs
time that includes taxiing etc. We're on little McKellar lake that's the
next one north of Manitouwabing so you were right in the neighbourhood.

I don't know much about flying rods I'm sure more aerodynamic is better but
would they make a noticable difference. Also is there any spring in the
wires we have now and if so is that a good or bad thing?
Drew



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Yes, it sounds like you have a good performer, which is why I am curious.
Got to get you out to BC one of these years, so we can put those ponies to
work.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Drew
Dalgleish
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 8:00 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] Props

Hi Walter When did I ever give you the impression that I have the skills to
fly straight and level? :) I've never checked top speed bt I think it
sounds like a fun thing to try one of these days. I'll let you know if it
happens. The engine is an ECI titan clone 160hp. I think they said it made
168 on the dyno with test magnetos. I have the emag electronic ignition
Which at least one RV driver tells me is worth another 10hp.

At 08:36 PM 8/21/2007 -0700, you wrote:

Drew, what is your top speed straight and level, WOT, and at what rpm? Do
you have 150 or 160 hp?

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Drew
Dalgleish
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 6:59 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Props

At 08:56 AM 8/21/2007 -0400, you wrote:

Hi Drew,
Please tell me more about your Prince prop.
Weight, pitch, rpm's, performance, $??

I was talking to Clair about replacing my float-brace wires with his
Scottish made-rolled thread, aerodynamic flying rods and he is putting a
price together for me. Will let you know.

We've been up around MacKeller; and into Manitouabin, Long, Axe and
Snakeskin lakes this year, is that near where you are?
Thanks........Angus

Hi Angus I'll have to check my log book for the prop size. I'm not sure of
the weight but it's less than 10lbs. It seems to be well matched to my
engine it'll run up around 2600rpm for climb out and up just past red line
in level flight. 2400rpm gives 105mph indicated 2500 gets me close to 115.
I'm pretty sure my airspeed indicator is a bit optomistic though. I don't
often fly at gross but with me full fuel and 50lbs baggage I climb at
around 1000fpm at 80mph. It'll climb a bit faster at 70 but I can't see
where I'm going then. Real world performance is it's 172 miles to the
cottage from Centralia by GPS and I can get there in about 1.8hrs hobbs
time that includes taxiing etc. We're on little McKellar lake that's the
next one north of Manitouwabing so you were right in the neighbourhood.

I don't know much about flying rods I'm sure more aerodynamic is better but
would they make a noticable difference. Also is there any spring in the
wires we have now and if so is that a good or bad thing?
Drew



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Drew



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Sure would like to see someone try a Borer. I had a chance a couple years
ago, when someone offered to lend me one. But with my cowl and need for a
spacer, it wouldn't fit. I realize the cruise speed would be less, but am
really curious to see how fast it can come off the water, and what the
climb
rate would be.

My prediction for 150 hp is less than 10 seconds (in near no wind
conditions) and 1500 fpm. If not, then it is not worth it.

The only way I get less than 10 seconds with mine, is with a good head
wind.
Top climb for me solo, is 1100 fpm. That is with the Sensenich 74 X 54 and
150 hp.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Angus
McKenzie
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2007 9:29 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] Props

Hi everybody, summer greetings!

I've been running a McCauley 74X56 (now re-pitched 54") that was on my
0-320-A2B on the Champion GCBC it came from.

Built the engine up to 160+hp; the prop worked great at 56" on wheels and
then I went on MAM amphibs, after trying a friends' 74X52 I had the 56"
re-pitched to 54". Works quite well.

Off the water in fairly quick times at gross+ and cruises at 80kts IAS at
2400rpm.

Max static rpm is 2400 and max level flight rpm is 2550.

Not getting to the 2700rpm where all the horsepower lives. Possibly a bit
over-propped.

So, to complicate the equation I bought an 80X40 Borer (McCauley) off a
150hp Champion GCBC.
I intend to install this prop as-is and verify performance but I'm
expecting
to need to re-pitch to about 43". Oh', as well, there was a 2" McCauley
spacer came with the prop if anybody needs one let me know.

Has anyone else tried a Borer? Results? Numbers? Advice? I know that
"rule-of-thumb" is: 1" of pitch = 100rpm

As an aside to this I heard today from Carm Titus that his cousin Mike
Titus
(longtime Leavens employee who has helped many of us Rebel types with our
engines) was working on a plane at Brampton in recent weeks and
momentarily
distracted by a bystander got hit in the head by a prop blade. Carm said
Mike is going to lose one eye. You can't be too careful.

Thanks and best regards to everyone, Angus



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Sure would like to see someone try a Borer. I had a chance a couple years
ago, when someone offered to lend me one. But with my cowl and need for a
spacer, it wouldn't fit. I realize the cruise speed would be less, but am
really curious to see how fast it can come off the water, and what the
climb
rate would be.

My prediction for 150 hp is less than 10 seconds (in near no wind
conditions) and 1500 fpm. If not, then it is not worth it.

The only way I get less than 10 seconds with mine, is with a good head
wind.
Top climb for me solo, is 1100 fpm. That is with the Sensenich 74 X 54 and
150 hp.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Angus
McKenzie
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2007 9:29 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] Props

Hi everybody, summer greetings!

I've been running a McCauley 74X56 (now re-pitched 54") that was on my
0-320-A2B on the Champion GCBC it came from.

Built the engine up to 160+hp; the prop worked great at 56" on wheels and
then I went on MAM amphibs, after trying a friends' 74X52 I had the 56"
re-pitched to 54". Works quite well.

Off the water in fairly quick times at gross+ and cruises at 80kts IAS at
2400rpm.

Max static rpm is 2400 and max level flight rpm is 2550.

Not getting to the 2700rpm where all the horsepower lives. Possibly a bit
over-propped.

So, to complicate the equation I bought an 80X40 Borer (McCauley) off a
150hp Champion GCBC.
I intend to install this prop as-is and verify performance but I'm
expecting
to need to re-pitch to about 43". Oh', as well, there was a 2" McCauley
spacer came with the prop if anybody needs one let me know.

Has anyone else tried a Borer? Results? Numbers? Advice? I know that
"rule-of-thumb" is: 1" of pitch = 100rpm

As an aside to this I heard today from Carm Titus that his cousin Mike
Titus
(longtime Leavens employee who has helped many of us Rebel types with our
engines) was working on a plane at Brampton in recent weeks and
momentarily
distracted by a bystander got hit in the head by a prop blade. Carm said
Mike is going to lose one eye. You can't be too careful.

Thanks and best regards to everyone, Angus



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Hi Drew,
Please tell me more about your Prince prop.
Weight, pitch, rpm's, performance, $??

I was talking to Clair about replacing my float-brace wires with his
Scottish made-rolled thread, aerodynamic flying rods and he is putting a
price together for me. Will let you know.

We've been up around MacKeller; and into Manitouabin, Long, Axe and
Snakeskin lakes this year, is that near where you are?
Thanks........Angus