The Murphy Builders Site

Hi Ian

I did not realize that you are putting the 912 in the Rebel. The speed
cowling I don't believe is an option for that engine. It was designed to
fit the marvelous Lycomings.

I think their are 912 engine instructions available but Bob P. may have
several photos available.

Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: Ian Donaldson [mailto:allsure@primus.com.au]
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2000 9:31 AM
To: (Murphy Rebel Builders List)
Subject: Rebel cowling


G'day

Thanks for the responses from Brian & bobp. I have the 912 version and
did get the mounting kit which consisted of radiators, mounts and
cowling. I did not realize that there was an option with the cowlings.

I guess that I can get around the engine installation, but it would be
easier if I could see just how someone had done it before. Does any one
have any pictures of a 912 installation that they would be prepared to
send?

I will contact the factory and see if I can get their cowling
installation instructions.

Regards

Ian Donaldson

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Your following message has been delivered to the 152 members of
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Ian, you are welcome to view mine on our website. Not extremely detailed
however! Go to services page, click on engine installations and then either
the 912, O-235 or O-320 pictures. All pictures are "clickable" to full size!
The 912 pic's do show how I "slung" the radiator and attached the oil cooler
to the motor. MAM's stupidity is to mount both directly to the cowling so
you can never remove it, without dismantling everything (hoses etc.)

Blues skies,
Wayne

-----Original Message-----
From: Ian Donaldson <allsure@primus.com.au>
To: (Murphy Rebel Builders List) <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Tuesday, May 23, 2000 9:27 AM
Subject: Rebel cowling

G'day

Thanks for the responses from Brian & bobp. I have the 912 version and
did get the mounting kit which consisted of radiators, mounts and
cowling. I did not realize that there was an option with the cowlings.

I guess that I can get around the engine installation, but it would be
easier if I could see just how someone had done it before. Does any one
have any pictures of a 912 installation that they would be prepared to
send?

I will contact the factory and see if I can get their cowling
installation instructions.

Regards

Ian Donaldson

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G'day Ian !

The cowling options are for different engines. The 912 package is
pretty complete, even includes a GSC prop, if I recall.

There are a couple of things, though ....

DON'T mount the radiator to the cowling, as the drawings suggest -
this makes it a REAL PIG to do maintenance, because you have to drain
the coolant just to drop the cowl !!! Instead, make up a bracket that
will support the radiator from the engine mounts (Geert Frank did this,
and other things, for his Subaru - made a VERY nice installation!).
You might want to try to use captive nuts for the back of the cowl,
again, just for ease of removal. You MIGHT also want to try making the
aluminum top cowl doors a little deeper, so you can get at the bottom
spark plugs without dropping the cowling...

A very nice fit for the top cowl doors can be achieved by rivetting
a strip of 1 1/2" or 2" .025 aluminum all around the inside of the
fiberglass nose bowl, with half of it extending back behind the fiberglas,
so that it makes a lip to support the top cowl. The lip can be lined
with 'chafing tape'. This makes the top cowl flush, instead of sitting
on top of the fibreglas, where it digs in. You will have to do a bit
of fiddling at the bottoms of the sides, as well, to get them flush...
(perhaps raise the channel a bit). A little extra effort will let
you put the piano hinges on the inside, for a REALLY clean cowl ...

If the Rotax oil reservoir doesn't have one now, (haven't seen
a new one for years), do yourself a BIG favour and install a quick drain
valve on the bottom. This can be just a brass valve that you can put a
hose on, as long as you drill the handle so you can safety wire it
closed. The drain fitting can be welded (if you know a wizard), or
you <could> rivet in a fitting with a big flange, with lots of Pro-Seal.

If this kit comes with a 3" flat (approx.) black vernier throttle
cable, you likely should take it apart and either grind the guide balls
down, weaken the spring, or just remove the balls & spring completely.
The push required on the center button is 'WAY TOO HARD - just plain
DANGEROUS (IMHO !) - good for a broken thumb (or Rebel ...) With the
balls ground down, there is still some vernier action, but it can be
easily over-ridden by pushing in the throttle.

We are VERY pleased with our 912 - about 950 hr. of trouble-free
flying so far ! Be VERY careful to follow the instructions about the
position of the oil tank, and pumping oil into the lines before starting.
You can burn out the engine in about 1 minute, because of lack of oil !!
Be sure to fill the oil filter with oil before installing it after
oil changes, and don't leave the oil tank empty for more than a few
minutes when changing oil. Use Castrol GTX 50 for the first 100 hr.,
so it will break in, then go to 100% synthetic (Mobil One, etc...)
Oil changes at 25 hr. on regular oil, and 50 hr. on synthetic (or
sooner, if it gets dirty !).

(We have a list of alternative part no.'s for oil filters from
Fram, etc., if needed. )

Our TOTAL maintenance in 9 years, is 4 sets of spark plugs,
and 2 air filters !!!! This is CHEAP, FUN flying !!!

Best of luck !!
....bobp

------------------------------orig.-----------------------------------------
At 11:31 PM 5/23/00 +1000, you wrote:

G'day

Thanks for the responses from Brian & bobp. I have the 912 version and
did get the mounting kit which consisted of radiators, mounts and
cowling. I did not realize that there was an option with the cowlings.

I guess that I can get around the engine installation, but it would be
easier if I could see just how someone had done it before. Does any one
have any pictures of a 912 installation that they would be prepared to
send?

I will contact the factory and see if I can get their cowling
installation instructions.

Regards

Ian Donaldson

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G'day

Thanks for the responses from Brian & bobp. I have the 912 version and
did get the mounting kit which consisted of radiators, mounts and
cowling. I did not realize that there was an option with the cowlings.

I guess that I can get around the engine installation, but it would be
easier if I could see just how someone had done it before. Does any one
have any pictures of a 912 installation that they would be prepared to
send?

I will contact the factory and see if I can get their cowling
installation instructions.

Regards

Ian Donaldson

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Your following message has been delivered to the 153 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 12:41:49 on 25 May 2000.
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Ian, even a 76" propellor has about 9 to10" of ground clearance in the tail
up position, when on the 8.00 X 6.00 Turf tires. Having BOTH tires go flat
would still leave clearance in the tail up position! They must think you are
looking for (or they are overstocked with) a propellor for a CH701 Zenair.
The 68" three blade is the common prop for the Zenair Line of aircraft. The
912 Rebel I built and sold had a 2 blade 72" GSC (the same as Bob's I
believe) propellor on it. It worked great and is priced about as cheap as
you can get a propellor! Maybe GSC is worried that their 2 blade product
will not take 100 H.P. and they are using clearance as an excuse.?!?!?

Sorry to take Bob's mail, but thought I would add my 2 cents as usual!

Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

-----Original Message-----
From: Ian Donaldson <allsure@primus.com.au>
To: (Murphy Rebel Builders List) <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Thursday, May 25, 2000 10:11 AM
Subject: Rebel cowling

G'day bobp

I have been in contact with the factory and they have sent me some
detailed instructions, however I cannot get my computer to open the
file. That's something to sort out tomorrow.

I had some preliminary discussion with the factory and they contacted
GSC who suggested 68" three blade propellor. They felt that the two
blade 74" would not have sufficient ground clearance. Any thoughts?

Do you have any contacts with a GSC dealer ?

Regards

Ian Donaldson





The three blade was quoted at about $900

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Hi Ian !
I don't know who the IDIOT was who thought there wasn't enough
ground clearance !!! or where the 74" came from either ! A 3 blade
WILL NOT work as well as a 2 blade - we've had BOTH on our Rebel,
and the 2 blade is definitely better, both in climb and cruise !
There is absolutely NO problem with ground clearance with 72" !!!!!
(There wouldn't be a problem with 74" either, but I think you'd be
better off with the 72" because of lower tip speeds at given rpm.)

Our props were GSC 72" 2 blades, ground adjustable - we've had
2 sets of blades over the years, and GREAT results. I'm not up on current
prices, but I think it should be about $395 or $495 CDN (- which I think
is close to the Aussie $ - not sure about Kiwi ..). Ask for the
"Type M" blade - this is a 'Murphy blade', which is MUCH more efficient
than the standard GSC paddle blades.

We have dealt with ASAP Aircraft Supplies, but you can order
the GSC thru Murphy, at the same price... I will also buy my Rotax
912-S from MAM, as their deal on engines for Rebel builders is GREAT.
(The savings are even higher on Lycomings ...)

The GSC in-flight variable pitch 2 blade 72" runs about $1,500 USD,
I think....

.....bobp

------------------------------orig.----------------------------------
At 12:15 AM 5/26/00 +1000, you wrote:

G'day bobp

I have been in contact with the factory and they have sent me some
detailed instructions, however I cannot get my computer to open the
file. That's something to sort out tomorrow.

I had some preliminary discussion with the factory and they contacted
GSC who suggested 68" three blade propellor. They felt that the two
blade 74" would not have sufficient ground clearance. Any thoughts?

Do you have any contacts with a GSC dealer ?

Regards

Ian Donaldson





The three blade was quoted at about $900

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G'day bobp

I have been in contact with the factory and they have sent me some
detailed instructions, however I cannot get my computer to open the
file. That's something to sort out tomorrow.

I had some preliminary discussion with the factory and they contacted
GSC who suggested 68" three blade propellor. They felt that the two
blade 74" would not have sufficient ground clearance. Any thoughts?

Do you have any contacts with a GSC dealer ?

Regards

Ian Donaldson





The three blade was quoted at about $900

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Hi Ian

I agree with Bob & Wayne. I am running the same prop as Jack Wiebe who has
the 72" 3 blade Warp Drive. Jack has flown wheels & floats with no issues &
I have about 110 hours on my Rebel, &, the only issue I have is my own lack
of flying skills!

About the 2 vs. 3 blade question, it probably depends on a number of things
and when you talk props, you will certainly not get a shortage of opinions.

Brian #328R

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson [mailto:bob.patterson@canrem.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2000 7:55 PM
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List
Subject: Re: Rebel cowling



Hi Ian !
I don't know who the IDIOT was who thought there wasn't enough
ground clearance !!! or where the 74" came from either ! A 3 blade
WILL NOT work as well as a 2 blade - we've had BOTH on our Rebel,
and the 2 blade is definitely better, both in climb and cruise !
There is absolutely NO problem with ground clearance with 72" !!!!!
(There wouldn't be a problem with 74" either, but I think you'd be
better off with the 72" because of lower tip speeds at given rpm.)

Our props were GSC 72" 2 blades, ground adjustable - we've had
2 sets of blades over the years, and GREAT results. I'm not up on current
prices, but I think it should be about $395 or $495 CDN (- which I think
is close to the Aussie $ - not sure about Kiwi ..). Ask for the
"Type M" blade - this is a 'Murphy blade', which is MUCH more efficient
than the standard GSC paddle blades.

We have dealt with ASAP Aircraft Supplies, but you can order
the GSC thru Murphy, at the same price... I will also buy my Rotax
912-S from MAM, as their deal on engines for Rebel builders is GREAT.
(The savings are even higher on Lycomings ...)

The GSC in-flight variable pitch 2 blade 72" runs about $1,500 USD,
I think....

.....bobp

------------------------------orig.----------------------------------
At 12:15 AM 5/26/00 +1000, you wrote:

G'day bobp

I have been in contact with the factory and they have sent me some
detailed instructions, however I cannot get my computer to open the
file. That's something to sort out tomorrow.

I had some preliminary discussion with the factory and they contacted
GSC who suggested 68" three blade propellor. They felt that the two
blade 74" would not have sufficient ground clearance. Any thoughts?

Do you have any contacts with a GSC dealer ?

Regards

Ian Donaldson





The three blade was quoted at about $900

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