Page 1 of 1

[rebel-builders] Elite - It flies.........

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:52 am
by Bob Patterson
Congratulations Mike !!!

Like that smile !!! :-)

A 45 degree angle isn't far off - you want the prop to be coming
up on compression at about the 10 o'clock position, viewed from
the front. This is perfect for hand swinging, if you ever have to
start it that way. Sometimes just moving the prop 1 hole can
make a big difference ...

Sounds like the oil's a bit cool - maybe block off more of the
cooler to get it above 180 degrees anyway. That might account
for a bit of rough running ....

Having the ailerons out shouldn't matter - if you let go of
the stick, they should equalize. If it still rolls, I'd have a real
good look at the wing tips. Almost all of the Rebels with the
original tips rolled - about 95 % of them to the left .... It turned
out that one tip was about 1/4" lower than the other. It's VERY
difficult to build them even, when you're glueing together
pieces of fiberglass ! If you can, just lower the rear of the right
tip a bit - doesn't take much. It's always better to add a tab
on the bottom, lifting, than one on top pushing down.
Drooping a flap will work too, but may not be necessary...

Before you do much with the tips, be sure the ball is in the
center when testing .... if the fin is offset, you could be yawing
a bit, which would create roll .... Not usually a problem
on Elites, but worth checking.


--
......bobp
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Monday 19 February 2007 23:25, Mike Betti wrote:
Wayne,
You may have something there. The prop stops on a 45 degree angle. I was
shooting for parallel with the ground but hit it wrong I guess.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 5:13 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] It flies.........

Dang...what a goofy smile on your face Mike ! LOL

Glad all went well !! CONGATS!

The vibration may even be the exhaust system noise at full throttle, but
if
it is the prop....many a vibration has been solved by simply rotating it
180
degrees. I'm also assuming that when you shut down it indexes properly and
stops in the "hand swing" postion.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Betti" <mbetti@hughes.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 6:01 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] It flies.........

Well everyone, N771ME Elite flew today for the maiden voyage. This was
the
first opportunity with out wind to make a flight. The rest of the week
looks bad, but have some adjustments to make in the mean time. All went
well. Outside temp at 35 F.

Climb out was around 2450, oil temp made 155, EGT 1400, CHT
highest seen was 375. Air speed indicator looks good.
I notice at full throttle the engine has some vibration, but at 2400 it
is
smooth as glass. I think it is a rotation problem up front related to
balance and not an engine running condition.

2 problems, it flies out of trim right wing heavy. Almost looks like the
left aileron is drooped slightly when the other side is neutral, at least
it looks that way in flight, but it looks that way on the ground too, not
sure if that adjustment will correct this or not. Maybe droop a flap?

Second problem is flap lever won't hold detent. It looks like the detent
bolt isn't going to the bottom of the notch far enough. Going to have to
change something and try again.

Also planning on cutting the oil filter to make sure all is well before
going up again too.

Thanks for all the support this group gave me for 2 years. Hope I can
help
someone else in the future.

Mike Betti


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[rebel-builders] Elite - It flies.........

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:52 am
by Mike Betti
Thanks Bob,
I have a cable operated door on the oil cooler, it blocks it off about 90%
when closed and still only gettin this temp. I don't think the engine runs
rough at all, just the vibration I need to tweak.
The airplane definately flies with the ball swung from center which I guess
I contibuted to the wing rigging or such. The tips look good with
relationship to the control surfaces. Problem it trying to tweak the wing
tip is a major deal. Drill out a hundred rivets, and then what do you do
with the holes? I need to find a better fix than that.
As far as the fin. I fought with that when it was first mounted due to no
real good flat surfaces to guide by. After it was mounted I went back and
drilled out some rivets to tweak it, but I ended up putting it in the same
spot any way.
??
Mike

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <beep@sympatico.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 5:50 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Elite - It flies.........

Congratulations Mike !!!

Like that smile !!! :-)

A 45 degree angle isn't far off - you want the prop to be coming
up on compression at about the 10 o'clock position, viewed from
the front. This is perfect for hand swinging, if you ever have to
start it that way. Sometimes just moving the prop 1 hole can
make a big difference ...

Sounds like the oil's a bit cool - maybe block off more of the
cooler to get it above 180 degrees anyway. That might account
for a bit of rough running ....

Having the ailerons out shouldn't matter - if you let go of
the stick, they should equalize. If it still rolls, I'd have a real
good look at the wing tips. Almost all of the Rebels with the
original tips rolled - about 95 % of them to the left .... It turned
out that one tip was about 1/4" lower than the other. It's VERY
difficult to build them even, when you're glueing together
pieces of fiberglass ! If you can, just lower the rear of the right
tip a bit - doesn't take much. It's always better to add a tab
on the bottom, lifting, than one on top pushing down.
Drooping a flap will work too, but may not be necessary...

Before you do much with the tips, be sure the ball is in the
center when testing .... if the fin is offset, you could be yawing
a bit, which would create roll .... Not usually a problem
on Elites, but worth checking.


--
......bobp
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Monday 19 February 2007 23:25, Mike Betti wrote:
Wayne,
You may have something there. The prop stops on a 45 degree angle. I was
shooting for parallel with the ground but hit it wrong I guess.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 5:13 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] It flies.........

Dang...what a goofy smile on your face Mike ! LOL

Glad all went well !! CONGATS!

The vibration may even be the exhaust system noise at full throttle,
but
if
it is the prop....many a vibration has been solved by simply rotating
it
180
degrees. I'm also assuming that when you shut down it indexes properly
and
stops in the "hand swing" postion.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Betti" <mbetti@hughes.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 6:01 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] It flies.........



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[rebel-builders] Elite - It flies.........

Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:52 am
by Bob Patterson
Ok Mike !

Now we're getting somewhere ! First thing is to go fly her
and hold rudder as needed to center the ball - then see if she
still wants to roll. Bet she won't ! You can put a tab (maybe
5 or 6" long, about 2" wide + whatever you need to fasten it
to the rudder) in the center of the rudder, and bend it just
enough to remove the pressure on the pedals. (Some guys
like to just pull up the rudder pedal springs on one side -
I prefer the tab, so it adjusts to air pressure ... the force
needed varies with speed.)

You may have to tape over more of the oil cooler opening -
I only have about 1/2" square open on mine, and it's none too
hot yet ! Love to see some pics or drawings of your
cable-operated oil cooler door - sounds like a great idea !!

An easy fix for the tips is to get a piece of Lexan, about
2 - 3" wide (if there's room in the width of the Elite tip ...)
and bend it up into a ramp so it's flat at the front, and
maybe 1/2" down at the back, bend in tabs, and rivet it
to the bottom of the tip. It'll provide the extra lift needed
to pick up that wing.. But only do that if you really can't
sort things out by correcting the yaw !
_____ _______
\ |
\ | <------ angle should be MUCH more
\ | SHALLOW - most of the length


Moving the prop around to hand-prop position
might just solve the vibration.

Anyway, these are just little tweaks - and part of the
fun now is getting to fly it !! Have fun & enjoy it !! :-)
Looks like we'll be seeing you on the Ramble for sure !

--
......bobp
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Tuesday 20 February 2007 01:42, Mike Betti wrote:
Thanks Bob,
I have a cable operated door on the oil cooler, it blocks it off about 90%
when closed and still only gettin this temp. I don't think the engine runs
rough at all, just the vibration I need to tweak.
The airplane definately flies with the ball swung from center which I guess
I contibuted to the wing rigging or such. The tips look good with
relationship to the control surfaces. Problem it trying to tweak the wing
tip is a major deal. Drill out a hundred rivets, and then what do you do
with the holes? I need to find a better fix than that.
As far as the fin. I fought with that when it was first mounted due to no
real good flat surfaces to guide by. After it was mounted I went back and
drilled out some rivets to tweak it, but I ended up putting it in the same
spot any way.
??
Mike

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <beep@sympatico.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 5:50 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Elite - It flies.........

Congratulations Mike !!!

Like that smile !!! :-)

A 45 degree angle isn't far off - you want the prop to be coming
up on compression at about the 10 o'clock position, viewed from
the front. This is perfect for hand swinging, if you ever have to
start it that way. Sometimes just moving the prop 1 hole can
make a big difference ...

Sounds like the oil's a bit cool - maybe block off more of the
cooler to get it above 180 degrees anyway. That might account
for a bit of rough running ....

Having the ailerons out shouldn't matter - if you let go of
the stick, they should equalize. If it still rolls, I'd have a real
good look at the wing tips. Almost all of the Rebels with the
original tips rolled - about 95 % of them to the left .... It turned
out that one tip was about 1/4" lower than the other. It's VERY
difficult to build them even, when you're glueing together
pieces of fiberglass ! If you can, just lower the rear of the right
tip a bit - doesn't take much. It's always better to add a tab
on the bottom, lifting, than one on top pushing down.
Drooping a flap will work too, but may not be necessary...

Before you do much with the tips, be sure the ball is in the
center when testing .... if the fin is offset, you could be yawing
a bit, which would create roll .... Not usually a problem
on Elites, but worth checking.


--
......bobp
http://www.prosumers.ca
http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com
http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Monday 19 February 2007 23:25, Mike Betti wrote:
Wayne,
You may have something there. The prop stops on a 45 degree angle. I was
shooting for parallel with the ground but hit it wrong I guess.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2007 5:13 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] It flies.........



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