[rebel-builders] Fuel Tanks- 1 or 2 ports
Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:39 am
1 port or 2, a good question!
Piper and a few other brand names have only; left-right-off option.
Cessna 150, 152 have; both or off option---not too many choices here.
Cessna 172, 182 have; both, left, right, off system, and 2 ports to pick
up at front and rear of tank.
Most of the Cessna 206 / 210 (about 1981 & earlier), have; left, right,
off, with the fuel valve porting injection system surplus back to the
tank that is selected, & ports at the front & rear of the tank.
The Cessna 120, 140 & 170 only picked up fuel from the front of the
tanks. Thus the red line on the bottom 1/4 of the fuel gage and a
statement "No takeoff below 1/4 fuel---" Because you WILL experience an
engine out on climb out.
The later Cessna 206 / 210 series, (about)1981 and later till the end of
the production run in 1986 had; left, right, both & off. With injector
surplus ported back to the selected tank. & ports at the front & rear
of the tank.
I know for a fact that you can use all but about 2 quarts of this fuel
before the engine quits completely! Please don't ask!
Carbureted engines normally need about one pound of fuel pressure. In a
high wing airplane a 39" fuel drop from the tank to the carb normally
gives you this required 1 LB. and the float is set to this pressure
requirement. A plane with a extreme nose high climb angle will not meet
this required pressure, thus an engine driven fuel pump is normally
required, & if it has an engine driven pump then it must have an
electric (or other) back up pump. Low wing planes require the pumps
because gravity will not give the 39" / 1 LB requirement.
Injected engines all have pumps, (That I know of).
So back to the original thaught here. To pump or not to pump, & 1 port
or 2 Those are all good questions!
What do you feel good with? What did the designer of the plane have in
mind? What did the designer of the engine have in mind? What kind of
flying do you plan to do? And what engine configuration are you using?
What fuel pressure did the plane it was taken from use?
I hope this does not cloud the thinking here!
As for my SR-3500, I am starting out with a high time (experienced) Lyc.
O-540 from a Cessna R-182 and matching Propeller. I do not know what
the next choice will be. With this engine configuration I have
installed the required fuel pumps. Also 2 ports from each tank "Tee'd"
to a P-210 fuel valve. I hope to have all of the bases covered & not
worry about any fuel starvation or vapor-lock.
Good luck on your choice!
Dick Wampach SR-108
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Rick Harper
Sent: Friday, February 02, 2007 2:53 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Fuel Tanks
G'day Alvin & Welcome to the group !
(I'm down here in OZ BTW - ( that's "by the way" Jean !)
It's "standard practise" in just about everything flying - to take off
on BOTH tanks, and once you are at your cruising altitude you then
switch to the fullest tank ONLY for the first half an hours' flight, ...
then back to the other tank for the next half an hours' flight, and so
on & so on ... and then BOTH tanks back on for landing - (just in case
you need full power / go around )
This means that if "something happens" to the flow rate of one tank (for
whatever reason) - you KNOW that the other side WILL flow - because it
WAS running fine a half an hour ago !)
IE: Here's a "both taps open" scenario ....
Your happily flying along with BOTH valves open ..... and unbeknownst to
you "something" has happened to one of the tanks - call it "tank A" and
you either aren't watching your fuel gauges, OR, they are not indicating
correctly .... or, you just don't notice the lack of change in the tank
level for whatever reason ...
Anyway , ... "Tank A" runs out of fuel - worked up a vacuum in it due
to a blockage in the vent system, dead bug jammed in the feed line, lack
of fossilised fuel deposits - whatever .... BUT, ... the engine still
runs OK - because "tank B" is still feeding it ! ....
BUT - when "tank B" runs out / gets used up / has a separate problem &
the engine starts to splutter through fuel starvation and STOPS ...
You think "WHATTHE$#@& !?!?!?!?!?" - WHY ?!?
a) In your PANIC, you don't know which tank is the problem tank if they
were both open
b) Even if the gauge is telling you "Tank A" has fuel IN IT ... it still
isn't going to give it to you !
c) You now have a FORCED LANDING situation on your hands !
BUT ...
However - If you were running a different tank every half an hour - and
then IF one tank developed a problem - you could switch to the other
tank an KNOW that it IS going to give you what was in it !
That's why we alternate the tank feeds
Hope this helps
Rick "Biggus" Harper
541R
PS : Please excuse my "odd" spelling .... we use English here in
Australia
----- Original Message -----
From: Alvin and Glenys Adams
To: rebel
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 8:57 AM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Fuel Tanks
I read the comments on the fuel system with great interest.Not fond
off the fuel system on the rebel as i have created a bad habit off not
wanting to carry around uncessary pounds off fuel,would rather carry
items that i need.What would be the practical reason to shut off either
off your fuel valves ever while flying.
This is agreat site.
regards: alvin rebel 776 40 Hrs 1000hrs on PA-11
-----------------------------------------------------------------
List archives located at: https://mail.dcsol.com/login
username "rebel" password "builder"
Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------
List archives located at: https://mail.dcsol.com/login
username "rebel" password "builder"
Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------
List archives located at: https://mail.dcsol.com/login
username "rebel" password "builder"
Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Piper and a few other brand names have only; left-right-off option.
Cessna 150, 152 have; both or off option---not too many choices here.
Cessna 172, 182 have; both, left, right, off system, and 2 ports to pick
up at front and rear of tank.
Most of the Cessna 206 / 210 (about 1981 & earlier), have; left, right,
off, with the fuel valve porting injection system surplus back to the
tank that is selected, & ports at the front & rear of the tank.
The Cessna 120, 140 & 170 only picked up fuel from the front of the
tanks. Thus the red line on the bottom 1/4 of the fuel gage and a
statement "No takeoff below 1/4 fuel---" Because you WILL experience an
engine out on climb out.
The later Cessna 206 / 210 series, (about)1981 and later till the end of
the production run in 1986 had; left, right, both & off. With injector
surplus ported back to the selected tank. & ports at the front & rear
of the tank.
I know for a fact that you can use all but about 2 quarts of this fuel
before the engine quits completely! Please don't ask!
Carbureted engines normally need about one pound of fuel pressure. In a
high wing airplane a 39" fuel drop from the tank to the carb normally
gives you this required 1 LB. and the float is set to this pressure
requirement. A plane with a extreme nose high climb angle will not meet
this required pressure, thus an engine driven fuel pump is normally
required, & if it has an engine driven pump then it must have an
electric (or other) back up pump. Low wing planes require the pumps
because gravity will not give the 39" / 1 LB requirement.
Injected engines all have pumps, (That I know of).
So back to the original thaught here. To pump or not to pump, & 1 port
or 2 Those are all good questions!
What do you feel good with? What did the designer of the plane have in
mind? What did the designer of the engine have in mind? What kind of
flying do you plan to do? And what engine configuration are you using?
What fuel pressure did the plane it was taken from use?
I hope this does not cloud the thinking here!
As for my SR-3500, I am starting out with a high time (experienced) Lyc.
O-540 from a Cessna R-182 and matching Propeller. I do not know what
the next choice will be. With this engine configuration I have
installed the required fuel pumps. Also 2 ports from each tank "Tee'd"
to a P-210 fuel valve. I hope to have all of the bases covered & not
worry about any fuel starvation or vapor-lock.
Good luck on your choice!
Dick Wampach SR-108
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Rick Harper
Sent: Friday, February 02, 2007 2:53 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Fuel Tanks
G'day Alvin & Welcome to the group !
(I'm down here in OZ BTW - ( that's "by the way" Jean !)
It's "standard practise" in just about everything flying - to take off
on BOTH tanks, and once you are at your cruising altitude you then
switch to the fullest tank ONLY for the first half an hours' flight, ...
then back to the other tank for the next half an hours' flight, and so
on & so on ... and then BOTH tanks back on for landing - (just in case
you need full power / go around )
This means that if "something happens" to the flow rate of one tank (for
whatever reason) - you KNOW that the other side WILL flow - because it
WAS running fine a half an hour ago !)
IE: Here's a "both taps open" scenario ....
Your happily flying along with BOTH valves open ..... and unbeknownst to
you "something" has happened to one of the tanks - call it "tank A" and
you either aren't watching your fuel gauges, OR, they are not indicating
correctly .... or, you just don't notice the lack of change in the tank
level for whatever reason ...
Anyway , ... "Tank A" runs out of fuel - worked up a vacuum in it due
to a blockage in the vent system, dead bug jammed in the feed line, lack
of fossilised fuel deposits - whatever .... BUT, ... the engine still
runs OK - because "tank B" is still feeding it ! ....
BUT - when "tank B" runs out / gets used up / has a separate problem &
the engine starts to splutter through fuel starvation and STOPS ...
You think "WHATTHE$#@& !?!?!?!?!?" - WHY ?!?
a) In your PANIC, you don't know which tank is the problem tank if they
were both open
b) Even if the gauge is telling you "Tank A" has fuel IN IT ... it still
isn't going to give it to you !
c) You now have a FORCED LANDING situation on your hands !
BUT ...
However - If you were running a different tank every half an hour - and
then IF one tank developed a problem - you could switch to the other
tank an KNOW that it IS going to give you what was in it !
That's why we alternate the tank feeds
Hope this helps
Rick "Biggus" Harper
541R
PS : Please excuse my "odd" spelling .... we use English here in
Australia
----- Original Message -----
From: Alvin and Glenys Adams
To: rebel
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 8:57 AM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Fuel Tanks
I read the comments on the fuel system with great interest.Not fond
off the fuel system on the rebel as i have created a bad habit off not
wanting to carry around uncessary pounds off fuel,would rather carry
items that i need.What would be the practical reason to shut off either
off your fuel valves ever while flying.
This is agreat site.
regards: alvin rebel 776 40 Hrs 1000hrs on PA-11
-----------------------------------------------------------------
List archives located at: https://mail.dcsol.com/login
username "rebel" password "builder"
Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------
List archives located at: https://mail.dcsol.com/login
username "rebel" password "builder"
Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------
List archives located at: https://mail.dcsol.com/login
username "rebel" password "builder"
Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------