The Murphy Builders Site

Now that I've finally started on the fuselage I wish I'd paid a bit more
attention to all those comments here on the forum. never the less I did a
search on pulleys (my manual has no mention of any and I have none in my
parts list) and also wraps. So now I have a few questions i'm hoping
someone can answer.
Pulleys
...smaller? larger?) and what size is the groove? Can these be made? out
of ? or ? How high or low should they be in relation to the top edge of the
bulkhead. Do the cables run on top of the floor or between the floor and
the lower skin? If between, how and where do they come through the
bulkheads? If on top won't this interfere with luggage etc. or do they get
covered later with something?
Are there any other pulleys required for the elevators? Should these be
installed now or left until everything is basically complete?
...where? how many? what size? etc.
What's the best way to mount these? Wraps
There has been mention of several changed or additional wraps. In the tail
cone my manual has 4 - 1 1/4" strips to layout, cut and install against and
inside the tail skid bulkhead 49 flanges. Followed by a bent washer and a
hole through the bottom to hold the skid bolt. I think the extra wrap
discussed by Wayne and others goes from in front of this bolt and angles
back and up on both side until it ends where Fus-31 (the horizontal
bulkhead ) meets ST-27 (fin spar). I suspect this should be left wide
enough at the top to tie into both Fus-31 and St-27. Make from .032
material. Now having said all that, I have a couple of pieces left over
fus-84 and Fus-88 both labeled as tail spring anchor fittings but no
mention of them in my manual??? Do these get used somewhere later? Do I
have the right idea for the additional wrap?
I know there a more wraps up front but I'll leave that until I get closer
to doing the front cage. My poor little brain is straining as it is. Your
comments/thought appreciated! --
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page http://webhome.idirect.com/~wrayt/

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-----Original Message-----
From: Wray Thompson <wrayt@idirect.com (wrayt@idirect.com)>
To: rebelmail <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com (murphy-rebel@dcsol.com)>
Date: Thursday, April 13, 2000 8:52 AM
Subject: pulleys,wraps etc.


Now that I've finally started on the fuselage I wish I'd paid a bit more attention to all those comments here on the forum. never the less I did a search on pulleys (my manual has no mention of any and I have none in my parts list) and also wraps. So now I have a few questions i'm hoping someone can answer.
Pulleys
From conversations between Joel and Jim I gather there should be a set of pulleys installed on the backside and in the middle of the lower arms of bulkhead 'D'. What size should these be in diameter (Tony Bingelas recommends a min. of 2 1/2 " ...smaller? larger?) and what size is the groove? Can these be made? out of ? or ?MAM WAS SUPPLYING -3A'S (APPROX 2") FOR THIS AND A SET OF BRACKETS ON NEWER KITS! BUILDERS HAVE MADE PULLEYS OUT OF DELRIN ETC. OR JUST BUY SOME PULLEYS TO FIT 1/8" CABLE AND MAKE UP SOME BRACKETS TO TIE IN TO BULKHEAD AND LOWER SKIN. How high or low should they be in relation to the top edge of the bulkhead. Do the cables run on top of the floor or between the floor and the lower skin? If between, how and where do they come through the bulkheads? If on top won't this interfere with luggage etc. or do they get covered later with something? CABLES RUN ALONG THE TOP OF THE FLOOR IN CABLE GUIDES SUPPLIED WITH THE KIT. GET COVERED BY .020 COVER THAT SHOULD BE IN YOUR KIT!
Are there any other pulleys required for the elevators? Should these be installed now or left until everything is basically complete? I FOUND A PULLEY BETWEEN THE SEATS TO BRING THE TOP CABLE DOWN TO THE FLOOR OFF OF THE UPPER CONTROL COLLUM HORN IS NICE. I HAVE BEEN INSTALLING A DOUBLE ONE HERE FOR BOTH CABLES, BUT A SINGLE FOR THE TOP CABLE WILL DO. THIS WILL BE DONE WHEN YOU HAVE THE FLOOR INSTALLED AND ARE DOING FINAL RIGGING ON YOUR ELEVATOR CABLES.
Pulleys are also mentioned for the rudder cables ...where? how many? what size? etc.
What's the best way to mount these? NEED A PULLEY AROUND 2' DIAMETER AT THE FUSELAGE BEND FROM CABIN TO CONE TO PASS INSPECTION. ANY CHANGE IN DIRECTION OF MORE THAN 3 TO 5 DEGREES REQUIRES A PULLEY TO PASS INSPECTION
Wraps
There has been mention of several changed or additional wraps. In the tail cone my manual has 4 - 1 1/4" strips to layout, cut and install against and inside the tail skid bulkhead 49 flanges. Followed by a bent washer and a hole through the bottom to hold the skid bolt. I think the extra wrap discussed by Wayne and others goes from in front of this bolt ABOUT 3 " IN FRONT and angles back and up on both side until it ends where Fus-31 (the horizontal bulkhead ) meets ST-27 (fin spar) YES. I suspect this should be left wide enough at the top to tie into both Fus-31 and St-27.AT LEAST OVERLAP THE TAIL POST, BUT OVERLAPPING THE FUS 31 RIVET ROW WOULD HELP ALSO. ALSO YOU SHOULD EXTEND THE TAIL CONE SIDES ABOUT 10 INCHES INTO THE BACK. PART IS AVAILABLE FROM MAM OR BEND ONE UP FROM SOME .032 Make from .032 material.YES Now having said all that, I have a couple of pieces left over fus-84 and Fus-88 both labeled as tail spring anchor fittings but no mention of them in my manual??? WRAY SOUNDS LIKE YOU HAVE THE NEWER TAIL SPRING ANCHORS. IF YOU DO AND YOUR BULKHEAD "49" IS THE NEWER HEAVY ONE YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO THE 1 -1/4" STRAP, PAIN IN THE ASS THING AT THE ANCHOR BOLT. YOU USE THE FUS 84 AND 88'S THE SAME AS THE NEWER MOTOR MOUNT FITTINGS AND THEY RIVET TO THE BULKHEAD .Do these get used somewhere later? Do I have the right idea for the additional wrap?
I know there a more wraps up front but I'll leave that until I get closer to doing the front cage. My poor little brain is straining as it is.
Your comments/thought appreciated!
--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page http://webhome.idirect.com/~wrayt/

-----Original Message-----
From: Wayne G. O'Shea [mailto:oifa@irishfield.on.ca]
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2000 2:10 PM
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List
Subject: Re: pulleys,wraps etc.


Wray Messages in your text!! HOPE THEY HELP, Wayne

-----Original Message-----
From: Wray Thompson <wrayt@idirect.com (wrayt@idirect.com)>
To: rebelmail <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com (murphy-rebel@dcsol.com)>
Date: Thursday, April 13, 2000 8:52 AM
Subject: pulleys,wraps etc.


Now that I've finally started on the fuselage I wish I'd paid a bit more attention to all those comments here on the forum. never the less I did a search on pulleys (my manual has no mention of any and I have none in my parts list) and also wraps. So now I have a few questions i'm hoping someone can answer.
Pulleys
From conversations between Joel and Jim I gather there should be a set of pulleys installed on the backside and in the middle of the lower arms of bulkhead 'D'. What size should these be in diameter (Tony Bingelas recommends a min. of 2 1/2 " ...smaller? larger?) and what size is the groove? Can these be made? out of ? or ?MAM WAS SUPPLYING -3A'S (APPROX 2") FOR THIS AND A SET OF BRACKETS ON NEWER KITS! BUILDERS HAVE MADE PULLEYS OUT OF DELRIN ETC. OR JUST BUY SOME PULLEYS TO FIT 1/8" CABLE AND MAKE UP SOME BRACKETS TO TIE IN TO BULKHEAD AND LOWER SKIN. How high or low should they be in relation to the top edge of the bulkhead. Do the cables run on top of the floor or between the floor and the lower skin? If between, how and where do they come through the bulkheads? If on top won't this interfere with luggage etc. or do they get covered later with something? CABLES RUN ALONG THE TOP OF THE FLOOR IN CABLE GUIDES SUPPLIED WITH THE KIT. GET COVERED BY .020 COVER THAT SHOULD BE IN YOUR KIT!
Are there any other pulleys required for the elevators? Should these be installed now or left until everything is basically complete? I FOUND A PULLEY BETWEEN THE SEATS TO BRING THE TOP CABLE DOWN TO THE FLOOR OFF OF THE UPPER CONTROL COLLUM HORN IS NICE. I HAVE BEEN INSTALLING A DOUBLE ONE HERE FOR BOTH CABLES, BUT A SINGLE FOR THE TOP CABLE WILL DO. THIS WILL BE DONE WHEN YOU HAVE THE FLOOR INSTALLED AND ARE DOING FINAL RIGGING ON YOUR ELEVATOR CABLES.
Pulleys are also mentioned for the rudder cables ...where? how many? what size? etc.
What's the best way to mount these? NEED A PULLEY AROUND 2' DIAMETER AT THE FUSELAGE BEND FROM CABIN TO CONE TO PASS INSPECTION. ANY CHANGE IN DIRECTION OF MORE THAN 3 TO 5 DEGREES REQUIRES A PULLEY TO PASS INSPECTION
Wraps
There has been mention of several changed or additional wraps. In the tail cone my manual has 4 - 1 1/4" strips to layout, cut and install against and inside the tail skid bulkhead 49 flanges. Followed by a bent washer and a hole through the bottom to hold the skid bolt. I think the extra wrap discussed by Wayne and others goes from in front of this bolt ABOUT 3 " IN FRONT and angles back and up on both side until it ends where Fus-31 (the horizontal bulkhead ) meets ST-27 (fin spar) YES. I suspect this should be left wide enough at the top to tie into both Fus-31 and St-27.AT LEAST OVERLAP THE TAIL POST, BUT OVERLAPPING THE FUS 31 RIVET ROW WOULD HELP ALSO. ALSO YOU SHOULD EXTEND THE TAIL CONE SIDES ABOUT 10 INCHES INTO THE BACK. PART IS AVAILABLE FROM MAM OR BEND ONE UP FROM SOME .032 Make from .032 material.YES Now having said all that, I have a couple of pieces left over fus-84 and Fus-88 both labeled as tail spring anchor fittings but no mention of them in my manual??? WRAY SOUNDS LIKE YOU HAVE THE NEWER TAIL SPRING ANCHORS. IF YOU DO AND YOUR BULKHEAD "49" IS THE NEWER HEAVY ONE YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO THE 1 -1/4" STRAP, PAIN IN THE ASS THING AT THE ANCHOR BOLT. YOU USE THE FUS 84 AND 88'S THE SAME AS THE NEWER MOTOR MOUNT FITTINGS AND THEY RIVET TO THE BULKHEAD .Do these get used somewhere later? Do I have the right idea for the additional wrap?
I know there a more wraps up front but I'll leave that until I get closer to doing the front cage. My poor little brain is straining as it is.
Your comments/thought appreciated!
--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page http://webhome.idirect.com/~wrayt/

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-----Original Message-----
From: Wray Thompson <wrayt@idirect.com (wrayt@idirect.com)>
To: (Murphy Rebel Builders List) <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com (murphy-rebel@dcsol.com)>
Date: Friday, April 14, 2000 4:24 PM
Subject: Re: pulleys,wraps etc.


Great input guys ...thanks very much! I fired a note off to MAM asking for the pulleys and brackets for the elevator cables ...hope they come through. I HAD TO PAY FOR MINE BACK IN 1994/5, MAYBE YOU WILL BE LUCKY AND GET YOURS FOR FREE! Think I shouldn't have riveted the bottom centre of bulkhead 'D' last night ..betcha the pulley brackets use the same holes? YOU MIGHT HAVE TO REMOVE THE RIVETS AT THE OVERLAP ON THE WIDE FACE FOR PULLEY INSTALLATION I do have a lathe so I should be able to manufacture the remainder of the pulleys ...is it cost effective and where would one obtain a large enough piece of Delrin? TRY A LOCAL MACHINE SHOP FOR A PIECE OF 2 " DIAMETER DELRIN "ROD" STOCK, ASK THE PRICE AND DETERMINE IF JUST BUYING MIGHT BE CHEAPER.(THE DELRIN SHOULDN'T COST MUCH COMPARED TO THE PULLEYS, BUT IS YOUR TIME WORTH ANYTHING??)
Additional question for Wayne you said ALSO YOU SHOULD EXTEND THE TAIL CONE SIDES ABOUT 10 INCHES INTO THE BACK. Not sure where we're talking here ..do you mean extend the big side pieces (Fus-22)YES beyond the one piece bulkhead (fus-36)YES or the wraps (fus-29)NO that go from bulkhead E back to fus-36 NO or are we talking the wraps (FUS-30)NO that go from Fus-36 back to the fin post?NO or?NO ...sorry for being thick. YOU DIDN'T LOOK A BIT OVER WEIGHT LAST TIME I SAW YOU!! MAM SELLS THIS EXTENSION (PART OF NEWER KITS I BELIEVE) OR YOU CAN MAKE IT YOURSELF OUT OF .025 OR .032 STOCK. MAKE A CARDBOARD PATTERN TO FIT INSIDE FUS22, INCLUDING FLANGES, THAT OVERLAPS FORWARD ABOUT 6" TO 8" OF THE EXISTING FUS22. MAKE AS LONG AS POSSIBLE UNTIL THE EXISTING ANGLES MAKE THE PIECE TAPER TO ABOUT 1'" WIDE AT END. TRANSFER TO ALUMINUM AND D,D,C,C,R. THATS DRILL, DEBUR, CHROMATE, CLECO AND RIVET!
After reading some more of the forum I was wondering if it would be better to replace the tab on the horizontal Fus-31 to the Fin post with a heavier angle piece that overlaps more of both the fus-31 and the fin post ..say enough to put about 6 rivets in each? WRAY THE FLANGE AGAINST THE FIN POST CAN'T BE ANY BIGGER. IT HITS THE BOTTOM OF THE FINS LOWER "RIB" NOW. I HAVE FOUND MINE IS FINE SO FAR WITH THE RV1613 RIVETS IN PLACE OF THE 1410'S. MAKE SURE THE RELEIF CUTOUTS AT THE FLANGE BEND ARE ABSOLUTELY BURR FREE. HOWARDS HAD STARTED TO CRACK SO I PUT A DOUBLER FROM THE TAIL SPRING ATTACH BULKHEAD TO THE POST, OVERLAPPING THE EXISTING FLANGE. THE CHOICE IS YOURS, EASY THING TO REPAIR LATER IF IT HAPPENS TO CRACK OR KILL THE BIRD NOW!

--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page http://webhome.idirect.com/~wrayt/
*-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------* The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft. Archives located at: http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm *-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------*

Great input guys ...thanks very much! I fired a note off to MAM
asking for the pulleys and brackets for the elevator cables ...hope
they come through. Think I shouldn't have riveted the bottom centre
of bulkhead 'D' last night ..betcha the pulley brackets use the same
holes? I do have a lathe so I should be able to manufacture the
remainder of the pulleys ...is it cost effective and where would one
obtain a large enough piece of Delrin?

Additional question for Wayne you said ALSO YOU SHOULD EXTEND THE
TAIL CONE SIDES ABOUT 10 INCHES INTO THE BACK. Not sure where we're
talking here ..do you mean extend the big side pieces (Fus-22) beyond
the one piece bulkhead (fus-36) or the wraps (fus-29) that go from
bulkhead E back to fus-36 or are we talking the wraps (FUS-30) that
go from Fus-36 back to the fin post? or? ...sorry for being so
thick.

After reading some more of the forum I was wondering if it would be
better to replace the tab on the horizontal Fus-31 to the Fin post
with a heavier angle piece that overlaps more of both the fus-31 and
the fin post ..say enough to put about 6 rivets in each?


--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page
http://webhome.idirect.com/~wrayt/

*-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion between builders
and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft. Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------*

Now that I've finally started on the fuselage I
wish I'd paid a bit more attention to all those
comments here on the forum. never the less I did a
search on pulleys (my manual has no mention of any
and I have none in my parts list) and also wraps.
So now I have a few questions i'm hoping someone
can answer.
Pulleys

From conversations between Joel and Jim I gather

there should be a set of pulleys installed on the
backside and in the middle of the lower arms of
bulkhead 'D'. What size should these be in
diameter (Tony Bingelas recommends a min. of 2 1/2
" ...smaller? larger?) and what size is the
groove? Can these be made? out of ? or ? How high
or low should they be in relation to the top edge
of the bulkhead. Do the cables run on top of the
floor or between the floor and the lower skin? If
between, how and where do they come through the
bulkheads? If on top won't this interfere with
luggage etc. or do they get covered later with
something?
Are there any other pulleys required for the
elevators? Should these be installed now or left
until everything is basically complete?
Pulleys are also mentioned for the rudder cables
...where? how many? what size? etc.
What's the best way to mount these?

Wraps
There has been mention of several changed or
additional wraps. In the tail cone my manual has 4
- 1 1/4" strips to layout, cut and install against
and inside the tail skid bulkhead 49 flanges.
Followed by a bent washer and a hole through the
bottom to hold the skid bolt. I think the extra
wrap discussed by Wayne and others goes from in
front of this bolt and angles back and up on both
side until it ends where Fus-31 (the horizontal
bulkhead ) meets ST-27 (fin spar). I suspect this
should be left wide enough at the top to tie into
both Fus-31 and St-27. Make from .032 material.
Now having said all that, I have a couple of
pieces left over fus-84 and Fus-88 both labeled as
tail spring anchor fittings but no mention of them
in my manual??? Do these get used somewhere later?
Do I have the right idea for the additional wrap?
I know there a more wraps up front but I'll leave
that until I get closer to doing the front cage.
My poor little brain is straining as it is.

Your comments/thought appreciated!

--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page
http://webhome.idirect.com/~wrayt/

<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
Now that I've finally started on the fuselage I wish I'd paid a bit more
attention to all those comments here on the forum. never the less I did
a search on pulleys (my manual has no mention of any and I have none in
my parts list) and also wraps. So now I have a few questions i'm hoping
someone can answer.
<br><b>Pulleys</b>
<br>From conversations between Joel and Jim I gather there should be a
set of pulleys installed on the backside and in the middle of the lower
arms of bulkhead 'D'. What&nbsp; size should these be in diameter (Tony
Bingelas recommends a min. of 2 1/2 "&nbsp; ...smaller? larger?) and what
size is the groove? Can these be made? out of ? or ? How high or low should
they be in relation to the top edge of the bulkhead. Do the cables run
on top of the floor or between the floor and the lower skin? If between,
how and where do they come through the bulkheads? If on top won't this
interfere with luggage etc. or do they get covered later with something?
<br>Are there any other pulleys required for the elevators? Should these
be installed now or left until everything is basically complete?
<br>&nbsp;Pulleys are also mentioned for the rudder cables&nbsp; ...where?
how many? what size? etc.
<br>What's the best way to mount these?
<p><b>Wraps</b>
<br>There has been mention of several changed or additional wraps. In the
tail cone my manual has 4 - 1 1/4" strips to layout, cut and install against
and inside the tail skid bulkhead 49 flanges. Followed by a bent washer
and a hole through the bottom to hold the skid bolt. I think the extra
wrap discussed by Wayne and others goes from in front of this bolt and
angles back and up on both side until it ends where Fus-31 (the horizontal
bulkhead ) meets ST-27 (fin spar). I suspect this should be left wide enough
at the top to tie into both Fus-31 and St-27. Make from .032 material.
Now having said all that, I have a couple of pieces left over fus-84 and
Fus-88 both labeled as tail spring anchor fittings but no mention of them
in my manual??? Do these get used somewhere later? Do I have the right
idea for the additional wrap?
<br>I know there a more wraps up front but I'll leave that until I get
closer to doing the front cage. My poor little brain is straining as it
is.
<p>Your comments/thought appreciated!
<p>--
<br>Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page <A

<br>&nbsp;</html>

Hi Wray.
I'm not sure how far along you are with your fuselage. What I did was
rivet the top and bottom panels only, leaving the side panels clecoed.
This way I was able to remove one side panel at a time for installing
the floor channels. The floor channels are quite a tedious job, and I
found it easier to do while standing on the floor rather than humped
over in the fuselage.
Regards
Dale #220

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Good tip Dale ...that's exactly what I've been doing ..just about
got all of them fitted and drilled. I found that you should put some
corner wraps on though before working on the channels on the wall as
the that area can shift quite a bit until the wraps are on ...then it
really firms up.

Dale Kilbey wrote:

Hi Wray.
I'm not sure how far along you are with your fuselage. What I did
was
rivet the top and bottom panels only, leaving the side panels
clecoed.
This way I was able to remove one side panel at a time for
installing
the floor channels. The floor channels are quite a tedious job, and
I
found it easier to do while standing on the floor rather than humped

over in the fuselage.
Regards
Dale #220

--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page
http://webhome.idirect.com/~wrayt/

*-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion between builders
and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft. Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------*