The Murphy Builders Site

Hello all of you builders:
Can anyone tell me why the measurements for the seat rail location is so
different ? the (man) shows a distance of 6"1/8 then 10" 5/8 co pilots
side
and 1" difference on the pilots side. But when I located my rails and
seats
they seam to be a different measurment than what the (man) says?
Also I saw an email about high back seats, is this a good thing to upgrade
to?
Thanks a lot builder!
Dave T. here in the winter land of Michigan
Rebel #009

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Hello all of you builders:
Can anyone tell me why the measurements for the seat rail location is so
different ? the (man) shows a distance of 6"1/8 then 10" 5/8 co pilots side
and 1" difference on the pilots side. But when I located my rails and seats
they seam to be a different measurment than what the (man) says?
Also I saw an email about high back seats, is this a good thing to upgrade
to?
Thanks a lot builder!
Dave T. here in the winter land of Michigan
Rebel #009

Hi Dave !

If you have the original seat backs that came with #009,
YES ! Upgrade to the new seat backs - the higher back is no
big deal, BUT the new seat backs have a much stronger structure,
with additional bracing. This is definitely a safety issue,
and "a Good Thing (tm)" to do !

Hi Dave !

If you have the original seat backs that came with #009,
YES ! Upgrade to the new seat backs - the higher back is no
big deal, BUT the new seat backs have a much stronger structure,
with additional bracing. This is definitely a safety issue,
and "a Good Thing (tm)" to do !

From: Ron Shannon <rshannon@cruzcom.com>
Reply-To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Seat rail location
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2006 22:40:48 -0800

Hi Dave,

FWIW, I'm one who ordered the new backs and am very glad I did. As Bob
points out, they have a stronger brace design (longer angle/reach) --
and to my eyes, they look better.

In addition, after reading oodles of stuff in the archives about seat
strength concerns and problems, pros and cons, I decided to pass on
making the aluminum seat and back panels, and drilling all those holes
in the frames to rivet them. Instead, I had Oregon Aero (OA) make some
traditional, strong canvas slings for both the seats and backs as part
of the upholstery job they were doing. They turned out super, and of
course, required no holes in the frames. (OA's work is expensive, though
worth it IMHO, but anyone could do canvas slings with their own seat
builds.)

Contrary to rumor, the canvas slings were strictly a personal safety
preference. Laziness had nothing to do with my decision to pass on all
those holes & rivets. That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it. ;-)

Ron
254R
http://n254mr.com


Bob Patterson wrote:

Hi Dave !

If you have the original seat backs that came with #009,
YES ! Upgrade to the new seat backs - the higher back is no
big deal, BUT the new seat backs have a much stronger structure,
with additional bracing. This is definitely a safety issue,
and "a Good Thing (tm)" to do !

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Hello all of you builders:
Can anyone tell me why the measurements for the seat rail location is so
different ? the (man) shows a distance of 6"1/8 then 10" 5/8 co pilots side
and 1" difference on the pilots side. But when I located my rails and seats
they seam to be a different measurment than what the (man) says?
Also I saw an email about high back seats, is this a good thing to upgrade
to?
Thanks a lot builder!
Dave T. here in the winter land of Michigan
Rebel #009

Ron,
I remember reading about the RV-10 seats that OR Aero designed. They are
supposedly the safest seats ever tested on the crash tester, and they used
some kind of high-tech fabric that has no give. Apparently in a crash with
a high rate of descent which would otherwise be survivable, there are often
fatal spinal injuries. This is actually made worse by the poor design of a
lot of seats. In other words you would be better sitting on the floor. The
problem is that the seat pan stretches and rebounds during the impact and
magnifies the force into your spine. Even aluminum does this I think. They
were able to reduce that with the special fabric. I was thinking of asking
them to make some seat slings from that material to fit my seats.
Do you mind saying what they charged to make canvas slings? And the rest of
the upholstery? Did you have them make the covers too?
Thanks.
Jesse

From: Ron Shannon <rshannon@cruzcom.com>
Reply-To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Seat rail location
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2006 22:40:48 -0800

Hi Dave,

FWIW, I'm one who ordered the new backs and am very glad I did. As Bob
points out, they have a stronger brace design (longer angle/reach) --
and to my eyes, they look better.

In addition, after reading oodles of stuff in the archives about seat
strength concerns and problems, pros and cons, I decided to pass on
making the aluminum seat and back panels, and drilling all those holes
in the frames to rivet them. Instead, I had Oregon Aero (OA) make some
traditional, strong canvas slings for both the seats and backs as part
of the upholstery job they were doing. They turned out super, and of
course, required no holes in the frames. (OA's work is expensive, though
worth it IMHO, but anyone could do canvas slings with their own seat
builds.)

Contrary to rumor, the canvas slings were strictly a personal safety
preference. Laziness had nothing to do with my decision to pass on all
those holes & rivets. That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it. ;-)

Ron
254R
http://n254mr.com


Bob Patterson wrote:

Hi Dave !

If you have the original seat backs that came with #009,
YES ! Upgrade to the new seat backs - the higher back is no
big deal, BUT the new seat backs have a much stronger structure,
with additional bracing. This is definitely a safety issue,
and "a Good Thing (tm)" to do !

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From: Ron Shannon <rshannon@cruzcom.com>
Reply-To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Seat rail location
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2006 22:03:55 -0800

Jesse,

Yes, I read the same things about Oregon Aero's research and engineering
philosophy. (Unsolicited advertisement from happy customer follows.)

After pondering what I could make or buy elsewhere, against OA's good
reputation and the safety value of what they're known to do, I persuaded
myself their seats would be worth every penny, and had them do the whole
enchilada from my bare frames up to completed cover fabric. The details:

Regarding fabric choices, Dave Esterline at OA asked if I wanted to look
at the blues, browns, or greys. I said yes! :-) A few days later I got
several dozen fabric swatches. Dave told me to pick a fabric, ship my
frames to them along with instructions on how high I want to sit, and
anything else I want.

So I shipped my completed frames, all bolted together with seat back
stop bolts and all, folded down, of course. I told them I wanted my
posterior to rest (!) about 1.5" - 2" above the top of the bottom seat
frames. (I had checked in the plane with a piece of plywood and phone
books, as they'd suggested). I included a photo of another Rebel seat
they did. I said "make mine kind of like those" but with some heavy duty
canvas-type slings for both seat and back foundation, and my priorities
are safety first, then comfort. Other than that, I didn't specify
anything -- just left it up to them.

They had the frames about 3-4 weeks, though part of that time they were
trying to confirm I wanted seat back pockets, but I was out of touch
hiking in the Cascades.

The total for two high back seats was $1540 USD. The detail invoice is
an hour away in the hangar right now, but from memory, that included
approx. $50 for return shipping, about $60 for a premium cover fabric
choice, $80 for seat back pockets --- and the slings were about $150 or
so. Big bucks, but they look fantastic, the fabric is first class,
they're very comfortable (though I haven't spent hours in them yet) and
they do feel -- safe!

I'll try to snap a few photos of mine. If you want more info, contact:

David Esterline
Customer Service, Seat Department
Oregon Aero, Inc.
34020 Skyway Drive
Scappoose, OR 97056
Tel: 503-543-7399 or 800-888-6910
Fax: 503-543-3573
Email: davide@oregonaero.com


Ron
254R
http://n254mr.com


Jesse Jenks wrote:

Ron,
I remember reading about the RV-10 seats that OR Aero designed. They are
supposedly the safest seats ever tested on the crash tester, and they

used

some kind of high-tech fabric that has no give. Apparently in a crash

with

a high rate of descent which would otherwise be survivable, there are

often

fatal spinal injuries. This is actually made worse by the poor design of

a

lot of seats. In other words you would be better sitting on the floor.

The

problem is that the seat pan stretches and rebounds during the impact

and

magnifies the force into your spine. Even aluminum does this I think.

They

were able to reduce that with the special fabric. I was thinking of

asking

them to make some seat slings from that material to fit my seats.
Do you mind saying what they charged to make canvas slings? And the rest

of

the upholstery? Did you have them make the covers too?
Thanks.
Jesse

From: Ron Shannon <rshannon@cruzcom.com>
Reply-To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Seat rail location
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2006 22:40:48 -0800

Hi Dave,

FWIW, I'm one who ordered the new backs and am very glad I did. As Bob
points out, they have a stronger brace design (longer angle/reach) --
and to my eyes, they look better.

In addition, after reading oodles of stuff in the archives about seat
strength concerns and problems, pros and cons, I decided to pass on
making the aluminum seat and back panels, and drilling all those holes
in the frames to rivet them. Instead, I had Oregon Aero (OA) make some
traditional, strong canvas slings for both the seats and backs as part
of the upholstery job they were doing. They turned out super, and of
course, required no holes in the frames. (OA's work is expensive,

though

worth it IMHO, but anyone could do canvas slings with their own seat
builds.)

Contrary to rumor, the canvas slings were strictly a personal safety
preference. Laziness had nothing to do with my decision to pass on all
those holes & rivets. That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it. ;-)

Ron
254R
http://n254mr.com


Bob Patterson wrote: -----------------------------------------------------------------
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Spaces
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