The Murphy Builders Site

Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Don't know what engine you're planning for the SR, Wayne, but the factory
Lycoming O-540, 250 hp, showed a high of about 18 US gph on climbout, so
the standard lines should be more than adequate ....

....bobp

---------------------------------orig.----------------------------------------
At 09:06 PM 3/8/00 -0500, you wrote:

Hello Frank,

Got your mail off the archives with reference to your gascolator to carb

fuel line! If you are running a Lycoming, acceptable minimum size should be
3/8"(you will find 1/2" on a Cessna). A 912 Rotax would work find with the
1/4" one you have! The next thing you should buy is a builders manual from
the RAAC Headquarters (1-800-387-1028) or find someone that will lend you
one! (Sorry but I lend nothing anymore, as it appears I may have been taken
for an engine mount I lent someone to use to make a jig! I hope not, but 3+
years is a long time!) This reference manual will tell you everything you
need to do to pass your final inspection, placards etc. Note that you also
need "firesleeve" over your fuel line and some inspectors want it over your
oil cooler lines also! The main thing with the fuel line is that you
ACTUALLY do a fuel flow test, with minimum fuel in the tanks and the
aircraft in a nose high attitude! You remove the line at the carb and must
keep it at the same height as the inlet. Also, the inlet screen (from the
carb inlet) should be on the end of the fuel line. You must get a minimum of
150% of the full power consumption requirement for the engine, flowing out
of your fuel line (on a gravity feed system). Anyone on the list do a fuel
flow on their SR2500 with 3/8 factory lines, finger strainers, etc???(same
size as supplied for rebel) Will it supply your 360HP M14P???? My 340HP
Supercharged Lycomings on the UTVA's burn 52 U.S. Gallons per hour at full
power!!!(per lyco's engine manual) This would require a full flow test
result of 78 G.P.H. if gravity feed, but with a pump you only need (I
believe)125%(or 115%) of consumption, so would need 65 G.P.H. On the last
Rebel with both tanks turned on I got 42 U.S G.P.H. I guess with a pump you
could suck some more out of the tanks. Someone let me know your experience
with the SR fuel flow before my Buddy's is to far along!! We may want to
change the fuel outlets on the wing tanks to take a larger finger screen.

Don't forget the Rebel Builders meeting at Brampton Sunday March 12th - 1PM!

Frank you may be one of the few that didn't get restored to the list, when

the list was lost into cyberspace. Go to the website and resubscribe!

Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=text/html;charset=iso-8859-1 http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META content='"MSHTML 4.72.3612.1706"' name=GENERATOR>
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<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT size=3>Hello Frank,</FONT></FONT><FONT
size=3></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT size=3></FONT></FONT><FONT
size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 face="" size=3>Got your mail off the archives with
reference to your gascolator to carb fuel line! If you are running a
Lycoming,  acceptable minimum size should be 3/8"(you will find
1/2" on a Cessna). A 912 Rotax would work find with the 1/4" one you
have! The next thing you should buy is a builders manual from the RAAC
Headquarters (1-800-387-1028) or find someone that will lend you one!

(Sorry but

I lend nothing anymore, as it appears I may have been taken for an engine

mount

I lent someone to use to make a jig! I hope not, but 3+ years is a long time!)
This reference manual will tell you everything you need to do to pass your

final

inspection, placards etc. Note that you also need "firesleeve" over
your fuel line and some inspectors want it over your oil cooler lines also!

The

main thing with the fuel line is that you ACTUALLY do a fuel flow test, with
minimum fuel in the tanks and the aircraft in a nose high attitude! You remove
the line at the carb and must keep it at the same height as the inlet.

Also, the

inlet screen (from the carb inlet) should be on the end of the fuel line. You
must get a minimum of 150% of the full power consumption requirement for the
engine, flowing out of your fuel line (on a gravity feed system).

<STRONG>Anyone

on the list do a fuel flow on their SR2500 with 3/8 factory lines, finger
strainers, etc???(same size as supplied for rebel) Will it supply your 360HP
M14P???? My 340HP Supercharged Lycomings on the UTVA's burn 52 U.S. Gallons

per

hour at full power!!!(per lyco's engine manual)</STRONG> This would require a
full flow test result of 78 G.P.H. if gravity feed, but with a pump you only
need (I believe)125%(or 115%) of consumption, so would need 65 G.P.H. On the
last Rebel with <STRONG>both </STRONG>tanks turned on I got 42 U.S G.P.H. I
guess with a pump you could suck some more out of the tanks.

<STRONG>Someone let

me know your experience with the SR fuel flow before my Buddy's is to far
along!! We may want to change the fuel outlets on the wing tanks to take a
larger finger screen.</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 face="" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Don't forget the Rebel Builders meeting at Brampton Sunday March
12th - 1PM!</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Frank you may be one of the few that didn't get restored to the list,

when

the list was lost into cyberspace. Go to the website and resubscribe!</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Blue skies,</DIV>
<DIV>Wayne G. O'Shea</DIV>
<DIV><A href="http://www.irishfield.on.ca">www.irishfield.on.ca</A></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML>

*----------------------------------------------------*
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between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*

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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your following message has been delivered to the 147 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 17:27:47 on 9 Mar 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bob,

Won't be specific as to type, but probably looking at 315HP for take off!!!!
(SKY ROCKETS IN FLIGHT!!)

9.5 pounds per horsepower is a nice number!!!!!!!!! Compares to a Rebel
loaded at 1425lbs/150 hp = 9.5!
This produces about 1900 feet per minute in a Rebel! Would be a nice climb
rate at gross with the SR2500! Especially on a short lake with amphibious
floats underneath!

I don't dis-believe what you read on the SR's flow meter, but 18 GPH seems a
little low! Full bore on 250 HP should use more than that. I burn 18
(measured) U.S. G.P.H. at 60 percent power in the UTVA. 60% of 340HP is
about 204 H.P., so 250 H.P should use about 22 G.P.H. and then a few GPH
more, for the extra enrichment at full throttle for cooling!

See ya Sunday, (I'm pretty sure now!, but still not 100% positive!)

Blue skies,
Wayne

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Cc: Frank <farndt@xcelco.on.ca>
Date: Thursday, March 09, 2000 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

Don't know what engine you're planning for the SR, Wayne, but the

factory

Lycoming O-540, 250 hp, showed a high of about 18 US gph on climbout, so
the standard lines should be more than adequate ....

....bobp

---------------------------------orig.-------------------------------------

---

At 09:06 PM 3/8/00 -0500, you wrote:
Hello Frank,

Got your mail off the archives with reference to your gascolator to carb
fuel line! If you are running a Lycoming, acceptable minimum size should

be

3/8"(you will find 1/2" on a Cessna). A 912 Rotax would work find with the
1/4" one you have! The next thing you should buy is a builders manual from
the RAAC Headquarters (1-800-387-1028) or find someone that will lend you
one! (Sorry but I lend nothing anymore, as it appears I may have been taken
for an engine mount I lent someone to use to make a jig! I hope not, but 3+
years is a long time!) This reference manual will tell you everything you
need to do to pass your final inspection, placards etc. Note that you also
need "firesleeve" over your fuel line and some inspectors want it over your
oil cooler lines also! The main thing with the fuel line is that you
ACTUALLY do a fuel flow test, with minimum fuel in the tanks and the
aircraft in a nose high attitude! You remove the line at the carb and must
keep it at the same height as the inlet. Also, the inlet screen (from the
carb inlet) should be on the end of the fuel line. You must get a minimum

of

150% of the full power consumption requirement for the engine, flowing out
of your fuel line (on a gravity feed system). Anyone on the list do a fuel
flow on their SR2500 with 3/8 factory lines, finger strainers, etc???(same
size as supplied for rebel) Will it supply your 360HP M14P???? My 340HP
Supercharged Lycomings on the UTVA's burn 52 U.S. Gallons per hour at full
power!!!(per lyco's engine manual) This would require a full flow test
result of 78 G.P.H. if gravity feed, but with a pump you only need (I
believe)125%(or 115%) of consumption, so would need 65 G.P.H. On the last
Rebel with both tanks turned on I got 42 U.S G.P.H. I guess with a pump you
could suck some more out of the tanks. Someone let me know your experience
with the SR fuel flow before my Buddy's is to far along!! We may want to
change the fuel outlets on the wing tanks to take a larger finger screen.
Don't forget the Rebel Builders meeting at Brampton Sunday March 12th -

1PM!

Frank you may be one of the few that didn't get restored to the list, when
the list was lost into cyberspace. Go to the website and resubscribe!
Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=text/html;charset=iso-8859-1 http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META content='"MSHTML 4.72.3612.1706"' name=GENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT size=3>Hello Frank,</FONT></FONT><FONT
size=3></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT size=3></FONT></FONT><FONT
size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 face="" size=3>Got your mail off the archives

with

reference to your gascolator to carb fuel line! If you are running a
Lycoming,  acceptable minimum size should be 3/8"(you will find
1/2" on a Cessna). A 912 Rotax would work find with the 1/4" one

you

have! The next thing you should buy is a builders manual from the RAAC
Headquarters (1-800-387-1028) or find someone that will lend you one!
(Sorry but
I lend nothing anymore, as it appears I may have been taken for an engine
mount
I lent someone to use to make a jig! I hope not, but 3+ years is a long

time!)

This reference manual will tell you everything you need to do to pass your
final
inspection, placards etc. Note that you also need "firesleeve"

over

your fuel line and some inspectors want it over your oil cooler lines

also!

The
main thing with the fuel line is that you ACTUALLY do a fuel flow test,

with

minimum fuel in the tanks and the aircraft in a nose high attitude! You

remove

the line at the carb and must keep it at the same height as the inlet.
Also, the
inlet screen (from the carb inlet) should be on the end of the fuel line.

You

must get a minimum of 150% of the full power consumption requirement for

the

engine, flowing out of your fuel line (on a gravity feed system).
<STRONG>Anyone
on the list do a fuel flow on their SR2500 with 3/8 factory lines, finger
strainers, etc???(same size as supplied for rebel) Will it supply your

360HP

M14P???? My 340HP Supercharged Lycomings on the UTVA's burn 52 U.S.

Gallons

per
hour at full power!!!(per lyco's engine manual)</STRONG> This would

require a

full flow test result of 78 G.P.H. if gravity feed, but with a pump you

only

need (I believe)125%(or 115%) of consumption, so would need 65 G.P.H. On

the

last Rebel with <STRONG>both </STRONG>tanks turned on I got 42 U.S G.P.H.

I

guess with a pump you could suck some more out of the tanks.
<STRONG>Someone let
me know your experience with the SR fuel flow before my Buddy's is to far
along!! We may want to change the fuel outlets on the wing tanks to take a
larger finger screen.</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 face="" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Don't forget the Rebel Builders meeting at Brampton Sunday

March

12th - 1PM!</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Frank you may be one of the few that didn't get restored to the list,
when
the list was lost into cyberspace. Go to the website and

resubscribe!</DIV>

<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Blue skies,</DIV>
<DIV>Wayne G. O'Shea</DIV>
<DIV><A href="http://www.irishfield.on.ca">www.irishfield.on.ca</A></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML>

*----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*

*----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*

-----------------------------------------------------------------
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Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
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-----------------------------------------------------------------

Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Hmmmmm! Not one of those "Colorado bargains" by any chance ??? :-)

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------------
At 05:21 PM 3/9/00 -0500, you wrote:

Bob,

Won't be specific as to type, but probably looking at 315HP for take off!!!!
(SKY ROCKETS IN FLIGHT!!)

9.5 pounds per horsepower is a nice number!!!!!!!!! Compares to a Rebel
loaded at 1425lbs/150 hp = 9.5!
This produces about 1900 feet per minute in a Rebel! Would be a nice climb
rate at gross with the SR2500! Especially on a short lake with amphibious
floats underneath!

I don't dis-believe what you read on the SR's flow meter, but 18 GPH seems a
little low! Full bore on 250 HP should use more than that. I burn 18
(measured) U.S. G.P.H. at 60 percent power in the UTVA. 60% of 340HP is
about 204 H.P., so 250 H.P should use about 22 G.P.H. and then a few GPH
more, for the extra enrichment at full throttle for cooling!

See ya Sunday, (I'm pretty sure now!, but still not 100% positive!)

Blue skies,
Wayne

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Cc: Frank <farndt@xcelco.on.ca>
Date: Thursday, March 09, 2000 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

Don't know what engine you're planning for the SR, Wayne, but the
factory
Lycoming O-540, 250 hp, showed a high of about 18 US gph on climbout, so
the standard lines should be more than adequate ....

....bobp

---------------------------------orig.-------------------------------------
---
At 09:06 PM 3/8/00 -0500, you wrote:
Hello Frank,

Got your mail off the archives with reference to your gascolator to carb
fuel line! If you are running a Lycoming, acceptable minimum size should
be
3/8"(you will find 1/2" on a Cessna). A 912 Rotax would work find with the
1/4" one you have! The next thing you should buy is a builders manual from
the RAAC Headquarters (1-800-387-1028) or find someone that will lend you
one! (Sorry but I lend nothing anymore, as it appears I may have been taken
for an engine mount I lent someone to use to make a jig! I hope not, but 3+
years is a long time!) This reference manual will tell you everything you
need to do to pass your final inspection, placards etc. Note that you also
need "firesleeve" over your fuel line and some inspectors want it over your
oil cooler lines also! The main thing with the fuel line is that you
ACTUALLY do a fuel flow test, with minimum fuel in the tanks and the
aircraft in a nose high attitude! You remove the line at the carb and must
keep it at the same height as the inlet. Also, the inlet screen (from the
carb inlet) should be on the end of the fuel line. You must get a minimum
of
150% of the full power consumption requirement for the engine, flowing out
of your fuel line (on a gravity feed system). Anyone on the list do a fuel
flow on their SR2500 with 3/8 factory lines, finger strainers, etc???(same
size as supplied for rebel) Will it supply your 360HP M14P???? My 340HP
Supercharged Lycomings on the UTVA's burn 52 U.S. Gallons per hour at full
power!!!(per lyco's engine manual) This would require a full flow test
result of 78 G.P.H. if gravity feed, but with a pump you only need (I
believe)125%(or 115%) of consumption, so would need 65 G.P.H. On the last
Rebel with both tanks turned on I got 42 U.S G.P.H. I guess with a pump you
could suck some more out of the tanks. Someone let me know your experience
with the SR fuel flow before my Buddy's is to far along!! We may want to
change the fuel outlets on the wing tanks to take a larger finger screen.
Don't forget the Rebel Builders meeting at Brampton Sunday March 12th -
1PM!
Frank you may be one of the few that didn't get restored to the list, when
the list was lost into cyberspace. Go to the website and resubscribe!
Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=text/html;charset=iso-8859-1 http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META content='"MSHTML 4.72.3612.1706"' name=GENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT size=3>Hello Frank,</FONT></FONT><FONT
size=3></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT size=3></FONT></FONT><FONT
size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 face="" size=3>Got your mail off the archives
with
reference to your gascolator to carb fuel line! If you are running a
Lycoming,  acceptable minimum size should be 3/8"(you will find
1/2" on a Cessna). A 912 Rotax would work find with the 1/4" one
you
have! The next thing you should buy is a builders manual from the RAAC
Headquarters (1-800-387-1028) or find someone that will lend you one!
(Sorry but
I lend nothing anymore, as it appears I may have been taken for an engine
mount
I lent someone to use to make a jig! I hope not, but 3+ years is a long
time!)
This reference manual will tell you everything you need to do to pass your
final
inspection, placards etc. Note that you also need "firesleeve"
over
your fuel line and some inspectors want it over your oil cooler lines
also!
The
main thing with the fuel line is that you ACTUALLY do a fuel flow test,
with
minimum fuel in the tanks and the aircraft in a nose high attitude! You
remove
the line at the carb and must keep it at the same height as the inlet.
Also, the
inlet screen (from the carb inlet) should be on the end of the fuel line.
You
must get a minimum of 150% of the full power consumption requirement for
the
engine, flowing out of your fuel line (on a gravity feed system).
<STRONG>Anyone
on the list do a fuel flow on their SR2500 with 3/8 factory lines, finger
strainers, etc???(same size as supplied for rebel) Will it supply your
360HP
M14P???? My 340HP Supercharged Lycomings on the UTVA's burn 52 U.S.
Gallons
per
hour at full power!!!(per lyco's engine manual)</STRONG> This would
require a
full flow test result of 78 G.P.H. if gravity feed, but with a pump you
only
need (I believe)125%(or 115%) of consumption, so would need 65 G.P.H. On
the
last Rebel with <STRONG>both </STRONG>tanks turned on I got 42 U.S G.P.H.
I
guess with a pump you could suck some more out of the tanks.
<STRONG>Someone let
me know your experience with the SR fuel flow before my Buddy's is to far
along!! We may want to change the fuel outlets on the wing tanks to take a
larger finger screen.</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 face="" size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Don't forget the Rebel Builders meeting at Brampton Sunday
March
12th - 1PM!</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Frank you may be one of the few that didn't get restored to the list,
when
the list was lost into cyberspace. Go to the website and
resubscribe!</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Blue skies,</DIV>
<DIV>Wayne G. O'Shea</DIV>
<DIV><A href="http://www.irishfield.on.ca">www.irishfield.on.ca</A></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML>

*----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*
*----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*

*----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*

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-----------------------------------------------------------------

Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your following message has been delivered to the 146 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 17:02:52 on 10 Mar 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

No!!!!!!! What is a "Colorado bargain"??
Has someone been ripped off!!!
Anything that is a bargain, never is!!!!!
Thats why my "for sale" Rebels are always a little higher priced than some
of the others that come available!
Nothing Borrowed, Nothing Used!

99.9% sure I will be there Sunday! Probably driving down. Anything in
particular you want me to talk about, other than the Fabric (good and bad),
Silicon spray, Clip nut usage, parts I have available, Fuselage 44" square
bulkhead jig and strengthening hints, OR did you want me to just WING it!

Wayne

P.S. For builders coming to the meeting, cash only, I'm not bringing the
VISA m/c! Silicon $10/can, Bringing a few thousand of each size of Clip nuts
that are $1 each for 8/32 and 10/32, 6/32 are $1.25. Inferior style from A/C
Spruce list at $2 and $3 each (deals made for high volume) Rebels need about
50 for tail feather tip installation. SR's need 120 for the 4 main
inspection covers per wing (15/cover x 4 x 2 wings). (the Rebel now has 4 of
these covers also = 60 needed) Can also use for one wing tip only! MAM
expects you to rivet all in place! Whats the point of having an inspection
hole or elevator tip that is riveted in place?? Also will be bringing
"solid" one lug anchor nuts ($1 each) that took me ten wings to realize, but
they are perfect for the aileron hinge bolts. This way no access hole is
required/adjustment possible now, so don't have to live with those rubbing
flaperons! Also bringing my black nylon wear washers for the rudder/elevator
spar to hinge gap. MAM doesn't seem to be flogging the quantity I sold them,
so I will go back to selling at $5 per dozen. These keep the S.S. rivets
from wearing into the attach hinge. I may also bring some other items I feel
would be of value to the group.

Thanks for feeding my family in advance!!!!! See you Sunday!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Friday, March 10, 2000 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

Hmmmmm! Not one of those "Colorado bargains" by any chance ??? :-)

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------------
At 05:21 PM 3/9/00 -0500, you wrote:
Bob,

Won't be specific as to type, but probably looking at 315HP for take

off!!!!

(SKY ROCKETS IN FLIGHT!!)

9.5 pounds per horsepower is a nice number!!!!!!!!! Compares to a Rebel
loaded at 1425lbs/150 hp = 9.5!
This produces about 1900 feet per minute in a Rebel! Would be a nice climb
rate at gross with the SR2500! Especially on a short lake with amphibious
floats underneath!

I don't dis-believe what you read on the SR's flow meter, but 18 GPH seems

a

little low! Full bore on 250 HP should use more than that. I burn 18
(measured) U.S. G.P.H. at 60 percent power in the UTVA. 60% of 340HP is
about 204 H.P., so 250 H.P should use about 22 G.P.H. and then a few GPH
more, for the extra enrichment at full throttle for cooling!

See ya Sunday, (I'm pretty sure now!, but still not 100% positive!)

Blue skies,
Wayne

*----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*

-----------------------------------------------------------------
List archives located at: https://mail.dcsol.com/login
username "rebel" password "builder"
Unsubscribe: rebel-builders-unsubscribe@dcsol.com
List administrator: mike.davis@dcsol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Sounds like lots of topics - that should do it !!

Driving down sounds like a good idea, considering the weather .....

Also, we can go out for pizza & beer after !! :-) :-)

.....bobp

----------------------------orig.-----------------------------------------
At 04:56 PM 3/10/00 -0500, you wrote:

No!!!!!!! What is a "Colorado bargain"??
Has someone been ripped off!!!
Anything that is a bargain, never is!!!!!
Thats why my "for sale" Rebels are always a little higher priced than some
of the others that come available!
Nothing Borrowed, Nothing Used!

99.9% sure I will be there Sunday! Probably driving down. Anything in
particular you want me to talk about, other than the Fabric (good and bad),
Silicon spray, Clip nut usage, parts I have available, Fuselage 44" square
bulkhead jig and strengthening hints, OR did you want me to just WING it!

Wayne

P.S. For builders coming to the meeting, cash only, I'm not bringing the
VISA m/c! Silicon $10/can, Bringing a few thousand of each size of Clip nuts
that are $1 each for 8/32 and 10/32, 6/32 are $1.25. Inferior style from A/C
Spruce list at $2 and $3 each (deals made for high volume) Rebels need about
50 for tail feather tip installation. SR's need 120 for the 4 main
inspection covers per wing (15/cover x 4 x 2 wings). (the Rebel now has 4 of
these covers also = 60 needed) Can also use for one wing tip only! MAM
expects you to rivet all in place! Whats the point of having an inspection
hole or elevator tip that is riveted in place?? Also will be bringing
"solid" one lug anchor nuts ($1 each) that took me ten wings to realize, but
they are perfect for the aileron hinge bolts. This way no access hole is
required/adjustment possible now, so don't have to live with those rubbing
flaperons! Also bringing my black nylon wear washers for the rudder/elevator
spar to hinge gap. MAM doesn't seem to be flogging the quantity I sold them,
so I will go back to selling at $5 per dozen. These keep the S.S. rivets
from wearing into the attach hinge. I may also bring some other items I feel
would be of value to the group.

Thanks for feeding my family in advance!!!!! See you Sunday!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Friday, March 10, 2000 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

Hmmmmm! Not one of those "Colorado bargains" by any chance ??? :-)

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------------
At 05:21 PM 3/9/00 -0500, you wrote:
Bob,

Won't be specific as to type, but probably looking at 315HP for take
off!!!!
(SKY ROCKETS IN FLIGHT!!)

9.5 pounds per horsepower is a nice number!!!!!!!!! Compares to a Rebel
loaded at 1425lbs/150 hp = 9.5!
This produces about 1900 feet per minute in a Rebel! Would be a nice climb
rate at gross with the SR2500! Especially on a short lake with amphibious
floats underneath!

I don't dis-believe what you read on the SR's flow meter, but 18 GPH seems
a
little low! Full bore on 250 HP should use more than that. I burn 18
(measured) U.S. G.P.H. at 60 percent power in the UTVA. 60% of 340HP is
about 204 H.P., so 250 H.P should use about 22 G.P.H. and then a few GPH
more, for the extra enrichment at full throttle for cooling!

See ya Sunday, (I'm pretty sure now!, but still not 100% positive!)

Blue skies,
Wayne
*----------------------------------------------------*
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between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
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*----------------------------------------------------*

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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Wayne

You touched on a few somewhat cryptic topics to discuss at the Brampton meeting,
what are the chances of you jotting down a few notes for those of us who can't
make Bob's get together. You caught my attention with references to nut plates
for inspection covers (OK, fairly self explanitory, but what size?) 44"
bulkheads, strengthening, aileron hinge bolt one-lug anchor nuts and plastic
spacers to keep flap/ailerons from rubbing (I am talking about the Elite here, I
believe it is much like the SR).

I am sure your extensive experience building Murphy's Rebel family would save
some of us some grief from these notes.

Bob, how about point form notes/minutes of important topics from the meeting so
that the larger comunity can attend by proxy? Just a thought from the boonies.

Thanks

Dave R.
Elite 583

Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

No!!!!!!! What is a "Colorado bargain"??
Has someone been ripped off!!!
Anything that is a bargain, never is!!!!!
Thats why my "for sale" Rebels are always a little higher priced than some
of the others that come available!
Nothing Borrowed, Nothing Used!

99.9% sure I will be there Sunday! Probably driving down. Anything in
particular you want me to talk about, other than the Fabric (good and bad),
Silicon spray, Clip nut usage, parts I have available, Fuselage 44" square
bulkhead jig and strengthening hints, OR did you want me to just WING it!

Wayne

P.S. For builders coming to the meeting, cash only, I'm not bringing the
VISA m/c! Silicon $10/can, Bringing a few thousand of each size of Clip nuts
that are $1 each for 8/32 and 10/32, 6/32 are $1.25. Inferior style from A/C
Spruce list at $2 and $3 each (deals made for high volume) Rebels need about
50 for tail feather tip installation. SR's need 120 for the 4 main
inspection covers per wing (15/cover x 4 x 2 wings). (the Rebel now has 4 of
these covers also = 60 needed) Can also use for one wing tip only! MAM
expects you to rivet all in place! Whats the point of having an inspection
hole or elevator tip that is riveted in place?? Also will be bringing
"solid" one lug anchor nuts ($1 each) that took me ten wings to realize, but
they are perfect for the aileron hinge bolts. This way no access hole is
required/adjustment possible now, so don't have to live with those rubbing
flaperons! Also bringing my black nylon wear washers for the rudder/elevator
spar to hinge gap. MAM doesn't seem to be flogging the quantity I sold them,
so I will go back to selling at $5 per dozen. These keep the S.S. rivets
from wearing into the attach hinge. I may also bring some other items I feel
would be of value to the group.

Thanks for feeding my family in advance!!!!! See you Sunday!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Friday, March 10, 2000 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

Hmmmmm! Not one of those "Colorado bargains" by any chance ??? :-)

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------------
At 05:21 PM 3/9/00 -0500, you wrote:
Bob,

Won't be specific as to type, but probably looking at 315HP for take
off!!!!
(SKY ROCKETS IN FLIGHT!!)

9.5 pounds per horsepower is a nice number!!!!!!!!! Compares to a Rebel
loaded at 1425lbs/150 hp = 9.5!
This produces about 1900 feet per minute in a Rebel! Would be a nice climb
rate at gross with the SR2500! Especially on a short lake with amphibious
floats underneath!

I don't dis-believe what you read on the SR's flow meter, but 18 GPH seems
a
little low! Full bore on 250 HP should use more than that. I burn 18
(measured) U.S. G.P.H. at 60 percent power in the UTVA. 60% of 340HP is
about 204 H.P., so 250 H.P should use about 22 G.P.H. and then a few GPH
more, for the extra enrichment at full throttle for cooling!

See ya Sunday, (I'm pretty sure now!, but still not 100% positive!)

Blue skies,
Wayne
*----------------------------------------------------*
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between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*

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between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Bob/Wayne

Well, we'll hope for the best on the notes, for sure it would be nice to come & join
you but that just isn't in the cards so we will take what we can get. You are
really fortunate to have such a big group of Rebelers to trade info among.

OK, on the "pogs" (huh?) do you mean this is a plastic washer that acts as a thrust
bearing to keep the two mating halves of the hinges from wearing and galling when
they move? (aluminum on aluminum is bad practise because this has a bad wear/galling
problem) Is this specific to the Rebel? Something like this is certainly needed in
the ELITE rudder and would be useful in the elevator too, I don't recall seeing it
on the factory demo C-GBZB. Perhaps it is up to the builder (since we are
homebuilders after all) to add these refinements. What are the dimensions of these
pieces Wayne has?

Looking forward to your notes ;>)

Dave R.

--
David A. Ricker P. Eng.
3 Tamarac Drive
Fall River, Nova Scotia
Canada, B2T 1E8
ricker@dbis.ns.ca
Ph. 902-860-0256

Bob Patterson wrote:

Dave,

We've tried taking notes in the past - also audio taping, etc .....
The problem is that everyone is so busy participating that the notes are
pretty much useless, and so many people chime in with suggestions at the
same time that transcribing is very difficult .... :-(

Several of the things Wayne mentions have been covered in the past, and
some <WERE> part of the kits at one time - the plastic "pogs" come to mind.
These are disks of wear-resistant plastic that are placed between the
control surface & its support (originally first used on the bottom of
the rudder, to prevent wearing off the rivets !!). I believe these are
still included, and are available from the factory (of course, I've been
wrong before ! ;-) ) If not, we can find a source - right, Wayne ?! ;-)

Wayne has recently obtained a HUGE supply of aircraft hardware, so I'm
sure he can supply all kinds of nut plates - you might check his web site.

Between us, we'll <try> to put <something> together ...... Possibly
a list of useful parts & their applications on Wayne's site ???

......bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------------
At 11:12 PM 3/10/00 -0800, you wrote:
Wayne

You touched on a few somewhat cryptic topics to discuss at the Brampton
meeting,
what are the chances of you jotting down a few notes for those of us who can't
make Bob's get together. You caught my attention with references to nut plates
for inspection covers (OK, fairly self explanitory, but what size?) 44"
bulkheads, strengthening, aileron hinge bolt one-lug anchor nuts and plastic
spacers to keep flap/ailerons from rubbing (I am talking about the Elite
here, I
believe it is much like the SR).

I am sure your extensive experience building Murphy's Rebel family would save
some of us some grief from these notes.

Bob, how about point form notes/minutes of important topics from the meeting so
that the larger comunity can attend by proxy? Just a thought from the boonies.

Thanks

Dave R.
Elite 583

Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

No!!!!!!! What is a "Colorado bargain"??
Has someone been ripped off!!!
Anything that is a bargain, never is!!!!!
Thats why my "for sale" Rebels are always a little higher priced than some
of the others that come available!
Nothing Borrowed, Nothing Used!

99.9% sure I will be there Sunday! Probably driving down. Anything in
particular you want me to talk about, other than the Fabric (good and bad),
Silicon spray, Clip nut usage, parts I have available, Fuselage 44" square
bulkhead jig and strengthening hints, OR did you want me to just WING it!

Wayne

P.S. For builders coming to the meeting, cash only, I'm not bringing the
VISA m/c! Silicon $10/can, Bringing a few thousand of each size of Clip nuts
that are $1 each for 8/32 and 10/32, 6/32 are $1.25. Inferior style from A/C
Spruce list at $2 and $3 each (deals made for high volume) Rebels need about
50 for tail feather tip installation. SR's need 120 for the 4 main
inspection covers per wing (15/cover x 4 x 2 wings). (the Rebel now has 4 of
these covers also = 60 needed) Can also use for one wing tip only! MAM
expects you to rivet all in place! Whats the point of having an inspection
hole or elevator tip that is riveted in place?? Also will be bringing
"solid" one lug anchor nuts ($1 each) that took me ten wings to realize, but
they are perfect for the aileron hinge bolts. This way no access hole is
required/adjustment possible now, so don't have to live with those rubbing
flaperons! Also bringing my black nylon wear washers for the rudder/elevator
spar to hinge gap. MAM doesn't seem to be flogging the quantity I sold them,
so I will go back to selling at $5 per dozen. These keep the S.S. rivets
from wearing into the attach hinge. I may also bring some other items I feel
would be of value to the group.

Thanks for feeding my family in advance!!!!! See you Sunday!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Friday, March 10, 2000 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow
off!!!! a *----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
http://www.dcsol.com/murphy-rebel/lists/default.htm
*----------------------------------------------------*
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between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
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*----------------------------------------------------*

*----------------------------------------------------*
The Murphy Rebel Builders List is for the discussion
between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
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*----------------------------------------------------*

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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Dave,

We've tried taking notes in the past - also audio taping, etc .....
The problem is that everyone is so busy participating that the notes are
pretty much useless, and so many people chime in with suggestions at the
same time that transcribing is very difficult .... :-(

Several of the things Wayne mentions have been covered in the past, and
some <WERE> part of the kits at one time - the plastic "pogs" come to mind.
These are disks of wear-resistant plastic that are placed between the
control surface & its support (originally first used on the bottom of
the rudder, to prevent wearing off the rivets !!). I believe these are
still included, and are available from the factory (of course, I've been
wrong before ! ;-) ) If not, we can find a source - right, Wayne ?! ;-)

Wayne has recently obtained a HUGE supply of aircraft hardware, so I'm
sure he can supply all kinds of nut plates - you might check his web site.

Between us, we'll <try> to put <something> together ...... Possibly
a list of useful parts & their applications on Wayne's site ???

......bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------------
At 11:12 PM 3/10/00 -0800, you wrote:

Wayne

You touched on a few somewhat cryptic topics to discuss at the Brampton

meeting,

what are the chances of you jotting down a few notes for those of us who can't
make Bob's get together. You caught my attention with references to nut plates
for inspection covers (OK, fairly self explanitory, but what size?) 44"
bulkheads, strengthening, aileron hinge bolt one-lug anchor nuts and plastic
spacers to keep flap/ailerons from rubbing (I am talking about the Elite

here, I

believe it is much like the SR).

I am sure your extensive experience building Murphy's Rebel family would save
some of us some grief from these notes.

Bob, how about point form notes/minutes of important topics from the meeting so
that the larger comunity can attend by proxy? Just a thought from the boonies.

Thanks

Dave R.
Elite 583

Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

No!!!!!!! What is a "Colorado bargain"??
Has someone been ripped off!!!
Anything that is a bargain, never is!!!!!
Thats why my "for sale" Rebels are always a little higher priced than some
of the others that come available!
Nothing Borrowed, Nothing Used!

99.9% sure I will be there Sunday! Probably driving down. Anything in
particular you want me to talk about, other than the Fabric (good and bad),
Silicon spray, Clip nut usage, parts I have available, Fuselage 44" square
bulkhead jig and strengthening hints, OR did you want me to just WING it!

Wayne

P.S. For builders coming to the meeting, cash only, I'm not bringing the
VISA m/c! Silicon $10/can, Bringing a few thousand of each size of Clip nuts
that are $1 each for 8/32 and 10/32, 6/32 are $1.25. Inferior style from A/C
Spruce list at $2 and $3 each (deals made for high volume) Rebels need about
50 for tail feather tip installation. SR's need 120 for the 4 main
inspection covers per wing (15/cover x 4 x 2 wings). (the Rebel now has 4 of
these covers also = 60 needed) Can also use for one wing tip only! MAM
expects you to rivet all in place! Whats the point of having an inspection
hole or elevator tip that is riveted in place?? Also will be bringing
"solid" one lug anchor nuts ($1 each) that took me ten wings to realize, but
they are perfect for the aileron hinge bolts. This way no access hole is
required/adjustment possible now, so don't have to live with those rubbing
flaperons! Also bringing my black nylon wear washers for the rudder/elevator
spar to hinge gap. MAM doesn't seem to be flogging the quantity I sold them,
so I will go back to selling at $5 per dozen. These keep the S.S. rivets
from wearing into the attach hinge. I may also bring some other items I feel
would be of value to the group.

Thanks for feeding my family in advance!!!!! See you Sunday!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Friday, March 10, 2000 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

Hmmmmm! Not one of those "Colorado bargains" by any chance ??? :-)

.....bobp

--------------------------------orig.--------------------------------------
At 05:21 PM 3/9/00 -0500, you wrote:
off!!!!
a
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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

I will let you know the results of my fuel system test. I'm planning to do
it next week. My SR has an IO540, 300+ HP and I'm about to close the door
posts where the fuel lines are. I'm using 3/8 " lines, engine mounted fuel
pump, electric high pressure boost pump, and Andair gascolator and my
calculations say I should be ok but I'm nervous until I run the test.
Al Paxhia, SR026

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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Sounds like you should be in GREAT shape !

....bobp

------------------------------orig.-----------------------------------
At 07:03 PM 3/11/00 -0800, you wrote:

I will let you know the results of my fuel system test. I'm planning to do
it next week. My SR has an IO540, 300+ HP and I'm about to close the door
posts where the fuel lines are. I'm using 3/8 " lines, engine mounted fuel
pump, electric high pressure boost pump, and Andair gascolator and my
calculations say I should be ok but I'm nervous until I run the test.
Al Paxhia, SR026

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between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
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*----------------------------------------------------*

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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your following message has been delivered to the 146 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 22:48:52 on 11 Mar 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks in advance Alan, for the results! We have our fingers crossed!

Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

-----Original Message-----
From: Alan & Deborah Paxhia <paxhia@gte.net>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Saturday, March 11, 2000 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

I will let you know the results of my fuel system test. I'm planning to do
it next week. My SR has an IO540, 300+ HP and I'm about to close the door
posts where the fuel lines are. I'm using 3/8 " lines, engine mounted fuel
pump, electric high pressure boost pump, and Andair gascolator and my
calculations say I should be ok but I'm nervous until I run the test.
Al Paxhia, SR026

*----------------------------------------------------*
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between builders and owners of Murphy Rebel aircraft.
Archives located at:
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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

Hello All,
I ran the fuel test simulating the fuel system in the SR and I
am happy with the result. Just for the test I made a few changes of note.
Copper tube was used in place of aluminum, the copper has a thinner wall
that increases the flow by less than 1%, the test simulated high nose
attitude,
no engine pump was used (only the elect boost pump), and auto gas was used.

Test #1 12 v battery only, 30 sec: 46.8 gal/hr
Test #2 12 v battery, charging from alternator 500rpm, 60 sec: 57.6 gal/hr
Test #3 12v battery only, 60 sec: 50.64 gal/hr
Test #4 12v battery, charging from alt 1500rpm, 60 sec: 58.1 gal/hr
Al Paxhia SR026

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Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:45 pm**

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your following message has been delivered to the 148 members of
the list murphy-rebel@dcsol.com at 23:13:23 on 15 Mar 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Alan,
Thanks for sharing your results. They look like they should work okay for
300 HP, but anyone using a bigger engine should use caution. Like I said
before my 340 HP Supercharged Lycomings use 52 U.S/Hr at full power per the
lycoming graphs. 60 % power uses about 20. The fuel flow jumps conciderably
at full throttle due to the added enrichment to keep things cool.

You say you ran a simulated test. I presume you had a finger strainer,all
the same fittings and valves as the aircrafts installation. Also if this
test was made "off" the aircraft, don't forget to do it on the real thing to
make sure a moth (or similar) hasn't spun a cocoon inside one of your pipes.
I see lots of builders that leave their fuel lines uncapped over the time
span it takes them to build their airplane. They are an inviting home for
insects! Then come time for final inspection, in the rush to get ready, they
"fudge" their fuel flow test just to present the numbers to the inspector
and never actually do the test before flying the aircraft! My lifes worth
more than that and I hope all of the builders on this list are of the same
mind set!

Blue skies,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

-----Original Message-----
From: Alan & Deborah Paxhia <paxhia@gte.net>
To: Murphy Rebel Builders List <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Wednesday, March 15, 2000 9:13 PM
Subject: Re: Fuel Line/Fuel Flow

Hello All,
I ran the fuel test simulating the fuel system in the SR and I
am happy with the result. Just for the test I made a few changes of note.
Copper tube was used in place of aluminum, the copper has a thinner wall
that increases the flow by less than 1%, the test simulated high nose
attitude,
no engine pump was used (only the elect boost pump), and auto gas was used.

Test #1 12 v battery only, 30 sec: 46.8 gal/hr
Test #2 12 v battery, charging from alternator 500rpm, 60 sec: 57.6 gal/hr
Test #3 12v battery only, 60 sec: 50.64 gal/hr
Test #4 12v battery, charging from alt 1500rpm, 60 sec: 58.1 gal/hr
Al Paxhia SR026

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