The Murphy Builders Site

Mike:
Greetings from Granada, Nicaragua. The Twin Com has brought us this far,
though our mode C has been flaky. On to Panama City tomorrow.

You have to fit your carburetor and air intake system before you know how
well the cowl is going to fit. You may have to make substantial changes to
the cowl to accommodate these items. (What fliter box are you using by the
way - the MAM one is too small for the O360?). In any case, the cowl will
project well below the lower fuselage contour. On mine, it departs the
fuselage about half way round the lower corner wraps. You are going to
have to make a roughly semi-circular opening to get adequate exit area.
The placement of the gascolator comes after you locate the exhaust. Try
not to have it close to the latter. Once you have cut the exit area, you
should have no problem accessing the gascolator drain. If you take the
advice of those who have gone before you (which you probably won

Hi Mike !

You've got it ! The larger that opening at the bottom is, the
cooler your engine will run. Be sure that the bottom rear of the cowl is
AT LEAST a couple of inches AFT of the firewall to give good airflow.

It is possible to add a pipe to the bottom of the gascolator and
fasten it to the belly to move the drain aft, and make it easily
accessible. My quick-drain pipe for the oil also runs down & back onto
the belly, so I can drain oil easily, without removing cowling.
A quick drain fitting for the oil is the first thing I add to every
new airplane - get a good one, there's nothing more annoying than
bending the arms on the cheap ones !

You might want to look at the Van's air box assembly - it looks
sharp, and might be a good choice. Ralph has it on his Elite, and
it has a great setup for alternate air ! (Might require a bit of
extra work on the cowl ....)

.....bobp

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Saturday 15 April 2006 10:27 pm, Mike Betti wrote:

I been mocking up my firewall and during the process I set my fiberglass
cowl in place. Although it is still in it's one piece as recieved from MAM,
it seems to follow the contour of the firewall at the top and sides, but
not at the bottom. The bottom of the fuselage is flat and the cowl is
round, is this how it will end up for air flow exit? And if so, is this
where I need to access my gascolator for draining? So then does that mean I
should let the drain cock hang just below the firewall bottom edge?
??????????
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

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While I agree that a larger and well shaped cowl exit helps, it was
enlarging my inlets that helped the most and finally solved my cooling
problems on floats.

Walter

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Bob
Patterson
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 4:03 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl


Hi Mike !

You've got it ! The larger that opening at the bottom is, the
cooler your engine will run. Be sure that the bottom rear of the cowl is
AT LEAST a couple of inches AFT of the firewall to give good airflow.

It is possible to add a pipe to the bottom of the gascolator and
fasten it to the belly to move the drain aft, and make it easily
accessible. My quick-drain pipe for the oil also runs down & back onto
the belly, so I can drain oil easily, without removing cowling.
A quick drain fitting for the oil is the first thing I add to every
new airplane - get a good one, there's nothing more annoying than
bending the arms on the cheap ones !

You might want to look at the Van's air box assembly - it looks
sharp, and might be a good choice. Ralph has it on his Elite, and
it has a great setup for alternate air ! (Might require a bit of
extra work on the cowl ....)

.....bobp

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Saturday 15 April 2006 10:27 pm, Mike Betti wrote:

I been mocking up my firewall and during the process I set my fiberglass
cowl in place. Although it is still in it's one piece as recieved from

MAM,

it seems to follow the contour of the firewall at the top and sides, but
not at the bottom. The bottom of the fuselage is flat and the cowl is
round, is this how it will end up for air flow exit? And if so, is this
where I need to access my gascolator for draining? So then does that mean

I

should let the drain cock hang just below the firewall bottom edge?
??????????
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

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Thanks Bob and Al,
I was ready to mount that gascolator today but will wait now. I have an
airbox from a C172, not sure if it will work but it was a freebee. I was
torn in several directions on the mounting of the oil cooler, but after
looking a Al's pic on the site, it makes the best sense with the engine
mount being in the way and all. Going to assemble the engine in the next
couple weeks and hope to hang it next month.
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <beep@sympatico.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl

Hi Mike !

You've got it ! The larger that opening at the bottom is, the
cooler your engine will run. Be sure that the bottom rear of the cowl is
AT LEAST a couple of inches AFT of the firewall to give good airflow.

It is possible to add a pipe to the bottom of the gascolator and
fasten it to the belly to move the drain aft, and make it easily
accessible. My quick-drain pipe for the oil also runs down & back onto
the belly, so I can drain oil easily, without removing cowling.
A quick drain fitting for the oil is the first thing I add to every
new airplane - get a good one, there's nothing more annoying than
bending the arms on the cheap ones !

You might want to look at the Van's air box assembly - it looks
sharp, and might be a good choice. Ralph has it on his Elite, and
it has a great setup for alternate air ! (Might require a bit of
extra work on the cowl ....)

.....bobp

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Saturday 15 April 2006 10:27 pm, Mike Betti wrote:

I been mocking up my firewall and during the process I set my fiberglass
cowl in place. Although it is still in it's one piece as recieved from
MAM,
it seems to follow the contour of the firewall at the top and sides, but
not at the bottom. The bottom of the fuselage is flat and the cowl is
round, is this how it will end up for air flow exit? And if so, is this
where I need to access my gascolator for draining? So then does that mean
I
should let the drain cock hang just below the firewall bottom edge?
??????????
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

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Mike:

Be sure you are getting enough air with the 172 carb box. Sean White
reported that the O360 smokes because it is too rich with the MAM airbox.
I used the VANS one.

Al

Thanks Bob and Al,
I was ready to mount that gascolator today but will wait now. I have an
airbox from a C172, not sure if it will work but it was a freebee. I was
torn in several directions on the mounting of the oil cooler, but after
looking a Al's pic on the site, it makes the best sense with the engine
mount being in the way and all. Going to assemble the engine in the next
couple weeks and hope to hang it next month.
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <beep@sympatico.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl

Hi Mike !

You've got it ! The larger that opening at the bottom is, the
cooler your engine will run. Be sure that the bottom rear of the cowl

is

AT LEAST a couple of inches AFT of the firewall to give good airflow.

It is possible to add a pipe to the bottom of the gascolator and
fasten it to the belly to move the drain aft, and make it easily
accessible. My quick-drain pipe for the oil also runs down & back onto
the belly, so I can drain oil easily, without removing cowling.
A quick drain fitting for the oil is the first thing I add to every
new airplane - get a good one, there's nothing more annoying than
bending the arms on the cheap ones !

You might want to look at the Van's air box assembly - it looks
sharp, and might be a good choice. Ralph has it on his Elite, and
it has a great setup for alternate air ! (Might require a bit of
extra work on the cowl ....)

.....bobp

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Saturday 15 April 2006 10:27 pm, Mike Betti wrote:

I been mocking up my firewall and during the process I set my

fiberglass

cowl in place. Although it is still in it's one piece as recieved from
MAM,
it seems to follow the contour of the firewall at the top and sides,

but

not at the bottom. The bottom of the fuselage is flat and the cowl is
round, is this how it will end up for air flow exit? And if so, is this
where I need to access my gascolator for draining? So then does that

mean

I
should let the drain cock hang just below the firewall bottom edge?
??????????
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

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Thanks Al,
I just stopped over a buddy of mines tonight, he builds RV's for a living,
anyway he gave me an extra Vans airbox he had, so I will use it instead.
Mike Betti

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Hepburn" <ahepburn@renc.igs.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 7:35 AM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl

Mike:

Be sure you are getting enough air with the 172 carb box. Sean White
reported that the O360 smokes because it is too rich with the MAM airbox.
I used the VANS one.

Al

Thanks Bob and Al,
I was ready to mount that gascolator today but will wait now. I have an
airbox from a C172, not sure if it will work but it was a freebee. I was
torn in several directions on the mounting of the oil cooler, but after
looking a Al's pic on the site, it makes the best sense with the engine
mount being in the way and all. Going to assemble the engine in the next
couple weeks and hope to hang it next month.
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Patterson" <beep@sympatico.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl

Hi Mike !

You've got it ! The larger that opening at the bottom is, the
cooler your engine will run. Be sure that the bottom rear of the cowl

is

AT LEAST a couple of inches AFT of the firewall to give good airflow.

It is possible to add a pipe to the bottom of the gascolator and
fasten it to the belly to move the drain aft, and make it easily
accessible. My quick-drain pipe for the oil also runs down & back onto
the belly, so I can drain oil easily, without removing cowling.
A quick drain fitting for the oil is the first thing I add to every
new airplane - get a good one, there's nothing more annoying than
bending the arms on the cheap ones !

You might want to look at the Van's air box assembly - it looks
sharp, and might be a good choice. Ralph has it on his Elite, and
it has a great setup for alternate air ! (Might require a bit of
extra work on the cowl ....)

.....bobp

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Saturday 15 April 2006 10:27 pm, Mike Betti wrote:

fiberglass

but

mean

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Be very careful with any gascolator modification. I bought a Murphy
Renegade Spirit built by someone else a few years ago and crashed it on my
way back home with my new purchase. I ran out of gas over the mountains in
eastern Australia because of a leak via an ill advised modification to the
gascolator to extend the drain past the cowl. I paid my $2000 deductible
and the repair cost $15,000 Ozzy dollars. I was lucky to escape without
injury.

Mike
044SR

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Bob
Patterson
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 3:03 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl


Hi Mike !

You've got it ! The larger that opening at the bottom is, the
cooler your engine will run. Be sure that the bottom rear of the cowl is
AT LEAST a couple of inches AFT of the firewall to give good airflow.

It is possible to add a pipe to the bottom of the gascolator and
fasten it to the belly to move the drain aft, and make it easily
accessible. My quick-drain pipe for the oil also runs down & back onto
the belly, so I can drain oil easily, without removing cowling.
A quick drain fitting for the oil is the first thing I add to every
new airplane - get a good one, there's nothing more annoying than
bending the arms on the cheap ones !

You might want to look at the Van's air box assembly - it looks
sharp, and might be a good choice. Ralph has it on his Elite, and
it has a great setup for alternate air ! (Might require a bit of
extra work on the cowl ....)

.....bobp

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Saturday 15 April 2006 10:27 pm, Mike Betti wrote:

I been mocking up my firewall and during the process I set my fiberglass
cowl in place. Although it is still in it's one piece as recieved from

MAM,

it seems to follow the contour of the firewall at the top and sides, but
not at the bottom. The bottom of the fuselage is flat and the cowl is
round, is this how it will end up for air flow exit? And if so, is this
where I need to access my gascolator for draining? So then does that mean

I

should let the drain cock hang just below the firewall bottom edge?
??????????
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

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Mike:

The bottom edge of my cowl has a semi elliptical cutout that comes
forward to about the rear of the Vans carb. air box. It leaves the
fuselage about half way round the lower corner wrap. I put a lip on it
to help promote outgoing airflow, and to stiffen it up. The two exhaust
pipes stick out below the cowl, and you can access the gascolator
through the cutout. I believe the mount sets the engine thrust line at
0/0, though the asymmetry of the engine itself has to be allowed for.
The carb is not centered, and of course the left side exhaust stacks are
aft of the right side ones. The carb is the trickier one, as you don't
have a lot of room to play with unless you carve off the entire Murphy
intake and stick on an RV one (like Ralph Baker was in the process of
doing when I saw his). However, you can make the Murphy one work with
relatively minor mods if you're careful.

I used Camloc fasteners to join top and bottom. If you do, set it up so
there isn't one right over the front of the #1 rocker cover. I didn't,
and just filled that one in. Also, the cowl is very tight at the front
top of the #1 cylinder. I had to re-contour mine to eliminate contact.

I cut an oil filler access door with a small jigsaw blade. If you're
careful, you can use the cutout section as the door.

Al







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Al,
You mention here about cutting the exit area in the lower cowl. If I get
what you're saying, when you look up at the bottom of your cowl can you see
up at the stuff bolted to the firewall now? Is the cowl X" in front of the
firewall at the bottom?
Also, is your engine hanging on a slight twist? My mount is level but the
dynofocals are on a twist.
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Hepburn" <ahepburn@renc.igs.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 7:46 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl


[quote]Mike:
Greetings from Granada, Nicaragua. The Twin Com has brought us this far,
though our mode C has been flaky. On to Panama City tomorrow.

You have to fit your carburetor and air intake system before you know how
well the cowl is going to fit. You may have to make substantial changes
to
the cowl to accommodate these items. (What fliter box are you using by
the
way - the MAM one is too small for the O360?). In any case, the cowl will
project well below the lower fuselage contour. On mine, it departs the
fuselage about half way round the lower corner wraps. You are going to
have to make a roughly semi-circular opening to get adequate exit area.
The placement of the gascolator comes after you locate the exhaust. Try
not to have it close to the latter. Once you have cut the exit area, you
should have no problem accessing the gascolator drain. If you take the
advice of those who have gone before you (which you probably won

Hi Mike !

DO NOT cut a hole in the bottom of your cowling !!! What will happen is
the air will flow along the outside bottom of the cowl, then swirl UP into
the rear of the cowl, stopping the warm air from exiting smoothly !!!
(Voice of sad experience !! :-( )

You DO want to get the air out - one good solution is to put stand-offs
at the rear bottom of the cowl, to lower it about an inch below the bottom
of the fuselage. Be sure that the rear of the cowl is at least an inch or 2
BEHIND the firewall. Some have improved the exit airflow by adding a rounded
lip to the bottom of the firewall....

......bobp

-------------------------------orig.-------------------------
On Monday 15 May 2006 12:35 am, Mike Betti wrote:

Al,
You mention here about cutting the exit area in the lower cowl. If I get
what you're saying, when you look up at the bottom of your cowl can you see
up at the stuff bolted to the firewall now? Is the cowl X" in front of the
firewall at the bottom?
Also, is your engine hanging on a slight twist? My mount is level but the
dynofocals are on a twist.
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Hepburn" <ahepburn@renc.igs.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 7:46 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Cowl

Mike:
Greetings from Granada, Nicaragua. The Twin Com has brought us this far,
though our mode C has been flaky. On to Panama City tomorrow.

You have to fit your carburetor and air intake system before you know how
well the cowl is going to fit. You may have to make substantial changes
to
the cowl to accommodate these items. (What fliter box are you using by
the
way - the MAM one is too small for the O360?). In any case, the cowl will
project well below the lower fuselage contour. On mine, it departs the
fuselage about half way round the lower corner wraps. You are going to
have to make a roughly semi-circular opening to get adequate exit area.
The placement of the gascolator comes after you locate the exhaust. Try
not to have it close to the latter. Once you have cut the exit area, you
should have no problem accessing the gascolator drain. If you take the
advice of those who have gone before you (which you probably won�t, since
it�s a lot of work), you will enlarge the intake area by about 50%,
either by raising it at the top, or dropping it at the bottom.

Regards, Al

I been mocking up my firewall and during the process I set my fiberglass

cowl in place. Although it is still in it's one piece as recieved from
MAM,
it seems to follow the contour of the firewall at the top and sides, but
not at the bottom. The bottom of the fuselage is flat and the cowl is
round, is this how it will end up for air flow exit? And if so, is this
where I need to access my gascolator for draining? So then does that mean
I
should let the drain cock hang just below the firewall bottom edge?

??????????
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

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Ok thanks Bob and Al for the advice,
One of the problems I have to deal with is my engine is not plumb so the
airbox is offset in the bottom of the cowl now. What I mean, it is twisted
several degrees, I haven't measured it though. I blame the mount since the
attachment to the firewall is level.
One more question, Al, MAMs exhaust has mufflers with it. I thought your
plane is with out, did you buy the system through them?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E


----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Hepburn" <ahepburn@renc.igs.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 8:53 PM
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] Cowl

Mike:

The bottom edge of my cowl has a semi elliptical cutout that comes
forward to about the rear of the Vans carb. air box. It leaves the
fuselage about half way round the lower corner wrap. I put a lip on it
to help promote outgoing airflow, and to stiffen it up. The two exhaust
pipes stick out below the cowl, and you can access the gascolator
through the cutout. I believe the mount sets the engine thrust line at
0/0, though the asymmetry of the engine itself has to be allowed for.
The carb is not centered, and of course the left side exhaust stacks are
aft of the right side ones. The carb is the trickier one, as you don't
have a lot of room to play with unless you carve off the entire Murphy
intake and stick on an RV one (like Ralph Baker was in the process of
doing when I saw his). However, you can make the Murphy one work with
relatively minor mods if you're careful.

I used Camloc fasteners to join top and bottom. If you do, set it up so
there isn't one right over the front of the #1 rocker cover. I didn't,
and just filled that one in. Also, the cowl is very tight at the front
top of the #1 cylinder. I had to re-contour mine to eliminate contact.

I cut an oil filler access door with a small jigsaw blade. If you're
careful, you can use the cutout section as the door.

Al







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Mike:

The exhaust system I have what was advertised at the time as the
standard Murphy exhaust system - made by Forsling. It does not have
mufflers, but it does have cabin heat muffs that wrap around the
straight through pipes at the exit end. The trouble is, these muffs
tend to stick down below the floor of the cabin, and almost below the
line of the cowl. The system that Jack Wiebe bought has true mufflers
and does not stick out as far. I just left the cabin heat muffs off, so
at this point, I have no heat in the airplane, which isn't bad, as I
don't plan any winter flying on floats.

Also, I'm surprised at these reports of twisted mounts etc. The carb.
on my O360 is not on the centerline, which means the carb air box has to
be offset if you want the cowl air inlet to be centered. That took
quite a bit of cut and try on mine. I think I made three carb. air box
plates before I got it right.

Al





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Mike:

I used the kit base plate first time around, screwed that up, and made
another couple before I got it right. The trouble, as I recollect, was
that I didn't complete the cowl inlet before I did the carb air box.
There's very little space to play with, by the time you mount the carb
heat door, and any adjustment of one affects the other.

Al






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Ok thanks Al

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Hepburn" <ahepburn@renc.igs.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 7:06 PM
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] Cowl

Mike:

I used the kit base plate first time around, screwed that up, and made
another couple before I got it right. The trouble, as I recollect, was
that I didn't complete the cowl inlet before I did the carb air box.
There's very little space to play with, by the time you mount the carb
heat door, and any adjustment of one affects the other.

Al






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At 08:15 AM 5/17/2006 -0400, you wrote:

Mike:

The exhaust system I have what was advertised at the time as the
standard Murphy exhaust system - made by Forsling. It does not have
mufflers, but it does have cabin heat muffs that wrap around the
straight through pipes at the exit end. The trouble is, these muffs
tend to stick down below the floor of the cabin, and almost below the
line of the cowl. The system that Jack Wiebe bought has true mufflers
and does not stick out as far. I just left the cabin heat muffs off, so
at this point, I have no heat in the airplane, which isn't bad, as I
don't plan any winter flying on floats.

Also, I'm surprised at these reports of twisted mounts etc. The carb.
on my O360 is not on the centerline, which means the carb air box has to
be offset if you want the cowl air inlet to be centered. That took
quite a bit of cut and try on mine. I think I made three carb. air box
plates before I got it right.

Al

I borrowed Jack Weibe's motor mount jig to build my mount. It has a few
degrees angle to the right and maybe some down angle as well. Is this the
twist you're reffering to? If so it's there on purpose to counteract the P
factor.




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