The Murphy Builders Site

Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives
but so far no luck !!
When building the wings, manual says to make the torque tubes go
from 20 degrees to 40 degrees.
Once installed all I can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral
What is up ???? And what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives but so far
no luck !! When building the wings, manual says to make the torque
tubes go from 20 degrees to 40 degrees.
Once installed all I can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral
What is up ???? And what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives
but so far no luck !!
When building the wings, manual says to make the torque tubes go
from 20 degrees to 40 degrees.
Once installed all I can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral
What is up ???? And what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives but so far
no luck !! When building the wings, manual says to make the torque
tubes go from 20 degrees to 40 degrees.
Once installed all I can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral
What is up ???? And what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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Still can't see what the 40 is all about
Once ailerons are set neutral with flaps and control tube centered a swing
of 20 and 20 is all I have


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Alan
Hepburn
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


I see where you're at now. They're calling for 20 up and 40 down on the
aileron, not the torque tube. The ailerons have to droop, so the down
movement has to be more than up, contrary to what you'd expect if
differential aileron were being used to counter adverse yaw.

Al
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:12 PM
Subject: Elite aileron settings

Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives but so far
no luck !! When building the wings, manual says to make the torque
tubes go from 20 degrees to 40 degrees.
Once installed all I can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral
What is up ???? And what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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Keith:

At this stage, you perhaps don't have the ailerons completed to confirm
their travel, but you can make up an aileron rib and aileron horn and attach
it to the hinge temporarily, then build and attach the aileron pushrod to
the torque tube horn and the aileron horn. This allows you to test the
overall movement of the aileron itself, which should be around 20* up and
40* down. If this explanation is inadequate, I can download a pic of this
temporary hookup.

As I recollect, the dimensions given for the slot in the lower wing skin may
not be accurate, but the above hookup will allow you to verify what it
actually has to be.

BTW, when you do get things figured out, make an 0.020" doubler to surround
the slot in the lower wing skin where the horn emerges.

Al


----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:55 PM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings

Still can't see what the 40 is all about
Once ailerons are set neutral with flaps and control tube centered a swing
of 20 and 20 is all I have


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Alan
Hepburn
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


I see where you're at now. They're calling for 20 up and 40 down on the
aileron, not the torque tube. The ailerons have to droop, so the down
movement has to be more than up, contrary to what you'd expect if
differential aileron were being used to counter adverse yaw.

Al
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:12 PM
Subject: Elite aileron settings

Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives but so far
no luck !! When building the wings, manual says to make the torque
tubes go from 20 degrees to 40 degrees.
Once installed all I can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral
What is up ???? And what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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Still can't see what the 40 is all about
Once ailerons are set neutral with flaps and control tube centered a
swing of 20 and 20 is all I have


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Alan Hepburn
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


I see where you're at now. They're calling for 20 up and 40 down on
the aileron, not the torque tube. The ailerons have to droop, so the
down movement has to be more than up, contrary to what you'd expect if
differential aileron were being used to counter adverse yaw.

Al
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:12 PM
Subject: Elite aileron settings

Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives but so
far no luck !! When building the wings, manual says to make the
torque tubes go from 20 degrees to 40 degrees. Once installed all I
can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral What is up ???? And
what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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No, every thing is completed and all is mounted on the airplane
Would appreciate pics
Have already done the doublers, thanks

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Alan
Hepburn
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 7:44 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


Keith:

At this stage, you perhaps don't have the ailerons completed to confirm
their travel, but you can make up an aileron rib and aileron horn and
attach
it to the hinge temporarily, then build and attach the aileron pushrod to
the torque tube horn and the aileron horn. This allows you to test the
overall movement of the aileron itself, which should be around 20* up and
40* down. If this explanation is inadequate, I can download a pic of this
temporary hookup.

As I recollect, the dimensions given for the slot in the lower wing skin
may
not be accurate, but the above hookup will allow you to verify what it
actually has to be.

BTW, when you do get things figured out, make an 0.020" doubler to
surround
the slot in the lower wing skin where the horn emerges.

Al


----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:55 PM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings

Still can't see what the 40 is all about
Once ailerons are set neutral with flaps and control tube centered a
swing of 20 and 20 is all I have


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Alan Hepburn
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


I see where you're at now. They're calling for 20 up and 40 down on
the aileron, not the torque tube. The ailerons have to droop, so the
down movement has to be more than up, contrary to what you'd expect if
differential aileron were being used to counter adverse yaw.

Al
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:12 PM
Subject: Elite aileron settings

Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives but so
far no luck !! When building the wings, manual says to make the
torque tubes go from 20 degrees to 40 degrees. Once installed all I
can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral What is up ???? And
what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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No, every thing is completed and all is mounted on the airplane Would
appreciate pics Have already done the doublers, thanks

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Alan Hepburn
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 7:44 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


Keith:

At this stage, you perhaps don't have the ailerons completed to
confirm their travel, but you can make up an aileron rib and aileron
horn and attach it to the hinge temporarily, then build and attach the
aileron pushrod to the torque tube horn and the aileron horn. This
allows you to test the overall movement of the aileron itself, which
should be around 20* up and
40* down. If this explanation is inadequate, I can download a pic of
this temporary hookup.

As I recollect, the dimensions given for the slot in the lower wing
skin
may
not be accurate, but the above hookup will allow you to verify what it
actually has to be.

BTW, when you do get things figured out, make an 0.020" doubler to
surround
the slot in the lower wing skin where the horn emerges.

Al


----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:55 PM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings

Still can't see what the 40 is all about
Once ailerons are set neutral with flaps and control tube centered a
swing of 20 and 20 is all I have


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Alan Hepburn
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


I see where you're at now. They're calling for 20 up and 40 down on
the aileron, not the torque tube. The ailerons have to droop, so the
down movement has to be more than up, contrary to what you'd expect
if differential aileron were being used to counter adverse yaw.

Al
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:12 PM
Subject: Elite aileron settings

Have been trying to find the answer to this in the archives but so
far no luck !! When building the wings, manual says to make the
torque tubes go from 20 degrees to 40 degrees. Once installed all I
can get is 20 degrees either side of neutral What is up ???? And
what have I missed

Thanks in advance

Keith B. Oliver
ELITE N654ME (reserved)
Farmingdale, Maine





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That's about what I have
The problem is after everything is all mounted to the fuselage, then all
I can get is 20 and 20 thru the linkage
As yet I don't see why the need for the 40 setup initially
I obviously have missed something or at least have misunderstood

THANKS


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Mike Betti
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:05 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


I recently mounted my wings and tonight mounted the flap and aileron to
one wing. I made up the contol tube that connects from the wing to the
aileron horn. The manual says 7-5/8" center to center for this rod
assembly. I found

that it needs to be 6-5/8" to get full travel. I was able to get 20 up
and 40 down with my slot being at least 3.5" long. I still don't have the
connection at the root made so I don't know if the fuselage controls will
actually move them that much. Maybe tomorrow I will know that answer.
Mike Betti 771E

I recently mounted my wings and tonight mounted the flap and aileron to

wing. I made up the contol tube that connects from the wing to the aileron
horn. The manual says 7-5/8" center to center for this rod assembly. I

that it needs to be 6-5/8" to get full travel. I was able to get 20 up and
40 down with my slot being at least 3.5" long. I still don't have the
connection at the root made so I don't know if the fuselage controls will
actually move them that much. Maybe tomorrow I will know that answer.
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:13 AM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings

No, every thing is completed and all is mounted on the airplane
Would appreciate pics
Have already done the doublers, thanks

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of

Hepburn
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 7:44 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


Keith:

At this stage, you perhaps don't have the ailerons completed to confirm
their travel, but you can make up an aileron rib and aileron horn and
attach
it to the hinge temporarily, then build and attach the aileron pushrod

the torque tube horn and the aileron horn. This allows you to test the
overall movement of the aileron itself, which should be around 20* up

40* down. If this explanation is inadequate, I can download a pic of

temporary hookup.

As I recollect, the dimensions given for the slot in the lower wing skin
may
not be accurate, but the above hookup will allow you to verify what it
actually has to be.

BTW, when you do get things figured out, make an 0.020" doubler to
surround
the slot in the lower wing skin where the horn emerges.

Al


----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:55 PM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings

Still can't see what the 40 is all about
Once ailerons are set neutral with flaps and control tube centered a
swing of 20 and 20 is all I have


-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Alan Hepburn
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:36 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


I see where you're at now. They're calling for 20 up and 40 down on
the aileron, not the torque tube. The ailerons have to droop, so the
down movement has to be more than up, contrary to what you'd expect if
differential aileron were being used to counter adverse yaw.

Al
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:12 PM
Subject: Elite aileron settings




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Number sounds familiar! (6 5/8"). I always make that link out of 1/2"
plywood on initial set up for testing throws and then make the push pull
tube to suit. I'll check my template hanging on the pattern "rack"
tomorrow.

Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Betti" <mbetti@up.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:04 PM
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings

I recently mounted my wings and tonight mounted the flap and aileron to

one

wing. I made up the contol tube that connects from the wing to the
aileron
horn. The manual says 7-5/8" center to center for this rod assembly. I

found

that it needs to be 6-5/8" to get full travel. I was able to get 20 up
and
40 down with my slot being at least 3.5" long. I still don't have the
connection at the root made so I don't know if the fuselage controls will
actually move them that much. Maybe tomorrow I will know that answer.
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:13 AM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings

No, every thing is completed and all is mounted on the airplane
Would appreciate pics
Have already done the doublers, thanks

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of

Alan

Hepburn
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 7:44 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings


Keith:

At this stage, you perhaps don't have the ailerons completed to confirm
their travel, but you can make up an aileron rib and aileron horn and
attach
it to the hinge temporarily, then build and attach the aileron pushrod

to

the torque tube horn and the aileron horn. This allows you to test the
overall movement of the aileron itself, which should be around 20* up

and

40* down. If this explanation is inadequate, I can download a pic of

this

temporary hookup.

As I recollect, the dimensions given for the slot in the lower wing
skin
may
not be accurate, but the above hookup will allow you to verify what it
actually has to be.

BTW, when you do get things figured out, make an 0.020" doubler to
surround
the slot in the lower wing skin where the horn emerges.

Al


----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:55 PM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings




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I rigged one side today and I get the following:
Full stick with out stops R/L, 12 degrees up
Full stick with out stops opposite, 12 degrees down
With full flaps (30 degrees) at nuetral stick, 15 degrees down
With full flaps, stick moved full R/L, 5 degrees down
With full flaps, stick moved full opposite, 30 degrees down
I am using a good carpenters level with a moveable dial vial. I think it
is
with in a degree or 2.
I also notice quite a bit of slack in flap cable when using ailerons,
about
1/8". Also when grabing flap and checking tightness, there seems to be
quite
a bit of flex in the root rib. The flaps and ailerons are lined up in
nuetral.
Mike Betti
771E

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 11:38 PM
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings

Number sounds familiar! (6 5/8"). I always make that link out of 1/2"
plywood on initial set up for testing throws and then make the push pull
tube to suit. I'll check my template hanging on the pattern "rack"
tomorrow.

Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Betti" <mbetti@up.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:04 PM
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings

I recently mounted my wings and tonight mounted the flap and aileron to

one

wing. I made up the contol tube that connects from the wing to the
aileron
horn. The manual says 7-5/8" center to center for this rod assembly. I

found

that it needs to be 6-5/8" to get full travel. I was able to get 20 up
and
40 down with my slot being at least 3.5" long. I still don't have the
connection at the root made so I don't know if the fuselage controls
will
actually move them that much. Maybe tomorrow I will know that answer.
Mike Betti
771E
----- Original Message -----
From: "KEITH OLIVER" <kb_oliver@verizon.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:13 AM
Subject: RE: Elite aileron settings

Alan

to

and

this

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On the Elite is the flap lined up with the fairing/roof or does it follow
the contour of the wing? Does the aileron line up with the flap.
Thanks,
Mike Betti

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Betti" <mbetti@up.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2006 10:10 AM
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings

I rigged one side today and I get the following:
Full stick with out stops R/L, 12 degrees up
Full stick with out stops opposite, 12 degrees down
With full flaps (30 degrees) at nuetral stick, 15 degrees down
With full flaps, stick moved full R/L, 5 degrees down
With full flaps, stick moved full opposite, 30 degrees down
I am using a good carpenters level with a moveable dial vial. I think
it is
with in a degree or 2.
I also notice quite a bit of slack in flap cable when using ailerons,
about
1/8". Also when grabing flap and checking tightness, there seems to be
quite
a bit of flex in the root rib. The flaps and ailerons are lined up in
nuetral.
Mike Betti
771E

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 11:38 PM
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings

Number sounds familiar! (6 5/8"). I always make that link out of 1/2"
plywood on initial set up for testing throws and then make the push
pull tube to suit. I'll check my template hanging on the pattern
"rack" tomorrow.

Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Betti" <mbetti@up.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:04 PM
Subject: Re: Elite aileron settings
one
found
Alan
to
and
this
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