The Murphy Builders Site

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and length of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Dear Ralph,

On my Elite, I enlarged the cutout on the rounded leading edge on the left
side of the center hinge and ran the cable on the left outside of the stab
attach bracket. Keeps it away from the horn and cable, and the whole thing
is covered up by the fairing anyway. Also gives my fingers a little more
space to install the bolt.

I remember thinking about Superman and his laser vision when I drilled the
exit holes for the rudder cables. Mine are just above the rivet line for
the FUS-422 tail cone skin and 8-1/4" aft of the FUS-415A stab mounting
bulkhead. This kept the cables just under the bulkhead and it worked out
just fine. I think it helps to wait to install the aft cable guides in
order to fine tune the setup.

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph Knight" <knightmr@telusplanet.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 7:43 PM
Subject: Elite cable routing

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Hi Jeffrey
Thanks for the information, it will really help. Did you run the trim cable
through loom or some thing else or did you just run the cable as is? And did
you just let it drop into the fuse or did you rout it through the stab
first? I like the idea of more space to install the bolt as it is a stretch
to install.
I'll use your measurements as a basis for the rudder cables holes.
Thanks again
Ralph Knight

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 8:11 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing

Dear Ralph,

On my Elite, I enlarged the cutout on the rounded leading edge on the left
side of the center hinge and ran the cable on the left outside of the stab
attach bracket. Keeps it away from the horn and cable, and the whole thing
is covered up by the fairing anyway. Also gives my fingers a little more
space to install the bolt.

I remember thinking about Superman and his laser vision when I drilled the
exit holes for the rudder cables. Mine are just above the rivet line for
the FUS-422 tail cone skin and 8-1/4" aft of the FUS-415A stab mounting
bulkhead. This kept the cables just under the bulkhead and it worked out
just fine. I think it helps to wait to install the aft cable guides in
order to fine tune the setup.

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph Knight" <knightmr@telusplanet.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 7:43 PM
Subject: Elite cable routing

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Ralph,

Some time ago I put together some text and photos for Terry Dazey (building
Rebel #662) on how I installed the elevator and rudder cables on my Rebel. I
don't know if it will help you, but if you would like to read it I posted it to
my website this evening. The URL is:

http://tincantimes.dcsol.com (then click on construction photos, then on the
link to the rudder cable installation.

Or if you'd like to go directly to the page, try this URL:

http://tincantimes.dcsol.com/Rebel%20Co ... ting_2.htm

I find the text hard to read & understand with regard to the method I used to
locate the hole for the rudder cables to pass through the tailcone skin. It was
difficult (for me) to explain in a written narrative. Even now when I re-read
it, it is difficult for me to comprehend my instructions without going back
over it several times. I think I spent several weeks trying to figure it all
out and then convince myself that my measurements should be close, and that I
was not going to screw it up. And in the end it came out exactly right, and the
way I had intended.

Anyway, I hope it might be of some help to you.

Roger Hoffman #687R
Eugene, OR USA!




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Ralph:

I took my cable inside the stab itself, through a couple of grommets in the
ribs as I recollect, then out through a grommeted hole in the skin just
outboard of the horm area, but still inside the fuselage fairing. You have
to leave a string in there to fish the cable through before you close up the
elevator, though.

One thing I did that I strongly recommend is to put a DB-9 connector on the
bulkhead just ahead of the stab. so you can remove the thing without cutting
any wires.

Al





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Hi Roger,
Thank you for the info, I printed it up and will go over it the shop. You
did an amazing job in documenting the process and I am sure it will help me
greatly.
Thanks
Ralph

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of
rognal@dcsol.com
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 9:24 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Elite cable routing

Ralph,

Some time ago I put together some text and photos for Terry Dazey (building
Rebel #662) on how I installed the elevator and rudder cables on my Rebel. I
don't know if it will help you, but if you would like to read it I posted it
to
my website this evening. The URL is:

http://tincantimes.dcsol.com (then click on construction photos, then on the
link to the rudder cable installation.

Or if you'd like to go directly to the page, try this URL:

http://tincantimes.dcsol.com/Rebel%20Co ... ting_2.htm

I find the text hard to read & understand with regard to the method I used
to
locate the hole for the rudder cables to pass through the tailcone skin. It
was
difficult (for me) to explain in a written narrative. Even now when I
re-read
it, it is difficult for me to comprehend my instructions without going back
over it several times. I think I spent several weeks trying to figure it all
out and then convince myself that my measurements should be close, and that
I
was not going to screw it up. And in the end it came out exactly right, and
the
way I had intended.

Anyway, I hope it might be of some help to you.

Roger Hoffman #687R
Eugene, OR USA!




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Hi Al
The connector is a really good idea, I'll incorporate that for sure.
Thanks for the additional info.
Ralph

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Alan
Hepburn
Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 8:30 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing

Ralph:

I took my cable inside the stab itself, through a couple of grommets in the
ribs as I recollect, then out through a grommeted hole in the skin just
outboard of the horm area, but still inside the fuselage fairing. You have
to leave a string in there to fish the cable through before you close up the
elevator, though.

One thing I did that I strongly recommend is to put a DB-9 connector on the
bulkhead just ahead of the stab. so you can remove the thing without cutting
any wires.

Al





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Ralph,
How did you make out cutting the slot for the rudder cables with Jeffreys
advice? I'm getting ready to do the same and it looks like a crap shoot to
me. Also, to the other builders, where do I mount the rudder cable guides?
At the bulkheads? Just above the corner wraps?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the
stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I
have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Mike and Ralph,

Plan to document the exact location of my rudder cable cutouts tomorrow ...
stand by.

Bob 612e

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Mike Betti
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 5:51 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing


Ralph,
How did you make out cutting the slot for the rudder cables with Jeffreys
advice? I'm getting ready to do the same and it looks like a crap shoot to
me. Also, to the other builders, where do I mount the rudder cable guides?
At the bulkheads? Just above the corner wraps?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the
stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I
have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Ok thanks, I can wait a few days, I don't have any of the guides on yet
anyhow.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Andrews" <robert@montanasky.us>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 8:19 PM
Subject: RE: Elite cable routing

Mike and Ralph,

Plan to document the exact location of my rudder cable cutouts tomorrow
...
stand by.

Bob 612e

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Mike Betti
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 5:51 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing


Ralph,
How did you make out cutting the slot for the rudder cables with Jeffreys
advice? I'm getting ready to do the same and it looks like a crap shoot to
me. Also, to the other builders, where do I mount the rudder cable guides?
At the bulkheads? Just above the corner wraps?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the
stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it
into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed
with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a
hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I
have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and
length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Mike, Ralph,

Uploaded a few pics into "E-Rudder" showing where the boot is w/r to the
side skin. The inside view picture shows the cut-out notch w/r/t the boot
rivets. 612e flew for 40+ hrs and I've found nothing in the logs to
indicate there is any problems associated with the rudder or rudder cables.
Hope this helps.

Mike - think I blew a pic into section 101 by mistake ... sorry.

Cheers, Bob 612e

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Mike Betti
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 5:51 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing


Ralph,
How did you make out cutting the slot for the rudder cables with Jeffreys
advice? I'm getting ready to do the same and it looks like a crap shoot to
me. Also, to the other builders, where do I mount the rudder cable guides?
At the bulkheads? Just above the corner wraps?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the
stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I
have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Mike:

As you will have observed, you need a lot more fairleads for the rudder
cables than called for in the instructions, because the cables pass through
the rear bulkhead and the front stab support bulkhead. I measured as best I
could for these locations (used a CAD program, as I recollect), and for the
holes in the fuselage sides, but still got the latter wrong. I used some
cable exit fairings (aluminum, from ACS, I believe) to cover the slots in
the fuselage, but I found I needed another fairlead there as the is quite a
bit of lateral movement in the cable that close to the rudder horn. I wound
up with a lot more fairleads than I'd have liked, and a lot more friction.
The fairleads through the bulkheads were made from spare Delrin rudder pedal
supports, of which I seemed to have many in my kit.

My inspector accepted a fairlead at the rear of the cabin (as suggested by
Murphy), where the cable changes course by about 10 degrees, but I plan to
replace that with a pulley, just to cut down on the friction.

Al





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Once again thanks Bob, those pictures should help.
Mike Betti
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Andrews" <robert@montanasky.us>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 10:31 AM
Subject: RE: Elite cable routing

Mike, Ralph,

Uploaded a few pics into "E-Rudder" showing where the boot is w/r to the
side skin. The inside view picture shows the cut-out notch w/r/t the boot
rivets. 612e flew for 40+ hrs and I've found nothing in the logs to
indicate there is any problems associated with the rudder or rudder
cables.
Hope this helps.

Mike - think I blew a pic into section 101 by mistake ... sorry.

Cheers, Bob 612e

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Mike Betti
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 5:51 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing


Ralph,
How did you make out cutting the slot for the rudder cables with Jeffreys
advice? I'm getting ready to do the same and it looks like a crap shoot to
me. Also, to the other builders, where do I mount the rudder cable guides?
At the bulkheads? Just above the corner wraps?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the
stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it
into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed
with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a
hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I
have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and
length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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Thanks Al,
Did you look at the pics from Bob Andrews? Is it ok to guide a cable through
the slot as shown? or maybe necessary.
Mike Betti

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Hepburn" <ahepburn@renc.igs.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 1:40 PM
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing

Mike:

As you will have observed, you need a lot more fairleads for the rudder
cables than called for in the instructions, because the cables pass
through
the rear bulkhead and the front stab support bulkhead. I measured as best
I
could for these locations (used a CAD program, as I recollect), and for
the
holes in the fuselage sides, but still got the latter wrong. I used some
cable exit fairings (aluminum, from ACS, I believe) to cover the slots in
the fuselage, but I found I needed another fairlead there as the is quite
a
bit of lateral movement in the cable that close to the rudder horn. I
wound
up with a lot more fairleads than I'd have liked, and a lot more friction.
The fairleads through the bulkheads were made from spare Delrin rudder
pedal
supports, of which I seemed to have many in my kit.

My inspector accepted a fairlead at the rear of the cabin (as suggested by
Murphy), where the cable changes course by about 10 degrees, but I plan to
replace that with a pulley, just to cut down on the friction.

Al





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Mike,
I used Jeffrey's as a good starting point for cutting the slot. My first
attempt was on the right side and I started out with a number 30 hole at
Jeffrey's 8 1/4 inches and then used a small wire attached to the rudder
horn and started enlarging and elongating the hole into a slot that angled
downward towards the front. Using the actual aircraft cable through the
slot angled down to clear just below the forward stab mounting bulkhead and
continuing down ward through the first bulkhead and the along the side to
just aft of the door opening.

I kept moving the rudder and then enlarged the slot to provide clearance for
the cable. I found that being this close to the rudder control required a
longer slot than I had imagined (this was on Friday)

Sunday night I found Bob's new pictures and this project got a light bulb
moment. (Thanks for the Pictures Bob it sure helped) A fairlead through
the fuselage greatly reduces the length of the slot that is required. The
slot on the left side is now approximately half the length of the right side
one (Still close to the 8 1/4" measurement). I purchased some delron type
material and fabricated 3 different fairleads: One to take the cable out of
the slot in the fuselage, one to go through the bulkhead and one to attach
to the side of the first rib after that I will be able to run the MAM
supplied fairleads to the front. I also found a couple of pulleys from a
172 that I had scrapped so I'll make brackets for the pulleys and use them
to make the larger direction change. The cable makes a fairly straight line
from back to front and I don't anticipate a lot of friction.

This was a very painful process with a lot of procrastination and a lot of
time spent but I think it will work fine and a couple of cable exit fairings
will cover the one longer than required slot.
Regards
Ralph
657E

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Mike
Betti
Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 6:51 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Elite cable routing

Ralph,
How did you make out cutting the slot for the rudder cables with Jeffreys
advice? I'm getting ready to do the same and it looks like a crap shoot to
me. Also, to the other builders, where do I mount the rudder cable guides?
At the bulkheads? Just above the corner wraps?
Thanks,
Mike Betti
771E

I have come across two cable issues on my Elite; the first one involves
routing the elevator trim wiring cable from the elevator through the
stab.
My first try was to run it inside the rounded portion of the skin inside
of
a nylon tube and exit beside the center hinges and then just drop it into
the fuse. This didn't work well as the nylon tubing got all crushed with
the action of the hinges. My next thought is to drill and grommet a hole
out of the front of the enclosure for the servo and then cut an upright
slot
into the rounded leading edge and find an oblong grommet to protect the
cable and then drill a matching round hole with a grommet into the
trailing
edge of the stab (I am not wild about this idea because of cutting the
slot
into the rounded leading edge and what it may do to the air flow). I
have
really hit a road block on this one; maybe I am missing the obvious.

My second cable problem involves the exit point in the fuselage for the
rudder cables. Does anyone have measurements for the position and length
of
these openings or a good method for determining their locations? I am
afraid to start cutting this opening as I don't want to make it too long
or
have it in the wrong place and then have to do a patch job.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks

Ralph Knight E657







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