The Murphy Builders Site

hi all

I have uploaded a wiring schematic based upon aero electric and eaa bingelis
books, perhaps some people could look at and comment upon, I would like to
expand it and add more stuff to create an overall electrical guide for those
of use that are electrically handicapped
also I might add if anyone wants to make wiring diagrams I can do this
pretty quick since have all the symbols and then give them AutoCAD,
microstaion or pdf back
i notice it size is to big, was meant to be c size drawing, will recreat for
a b size, hopefully smaller file size

mike#007



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Couple of thoughts after a quick look:

A 40 amp CB on a 40 amp alternator may well pop sooner or later after a
hard start. 50 amps might be a better choice and it should be as close
to the starter contactor as possible since it is protecting the wire to
the alternator from high battery current should a short occur in the
wire or in the alternator. I used 8awg for that alternator feed wire.
Some folks use 6awg. 4awg is perhaps overkill for a 40amp alternator and
possibly a little more difficult to mount and terminate. I notice you
have not shown any overvoltage protection. Not sure if that is by choice
or just not shown yet.

I would not bother with any 20 awg wire such as on your loadmeter. Why
stock an extra size? 22awg is fine as we are only talking about
milliamps of current. I'd probably use smaller than 6 amp fuses for the
loadmeter regardless. Perhaps even 26awg fuselinks for simplicity and
space saving.

As shown you don't have the option of putting on both the landing light
and the taxi light simultaneously which is OK I guess. To be real picky
I think 16awg in the landing light circuit is not normally fused for 15
amps. I think 12 amp is the preferred limit for 16awg. I used 16awg to
lessen the voltage drop in a few places but I fused it to 10amps pretty
much everywhere. A 10amp CB is slow acting and should handle this
application just fine.

Your 22awg starter engaged light should be protected as well. I would
use an inch or two of 26awg off the starter contactor for a fusible link
for things like that. Easier to install and locate than a fuse, not to
mention more reliable and cheaper. The $6. fuselink kit from B&C is good
for probably six or eight fuselinks.

Same for the voltmeter and also the other end of the voltmeter should
probably go to ground ;)

Ken

Jones, Michael wrote:

hi all

I have uploaded a wiring schematic based upon aero electric and eaa bingelis
books, perhaps some people could look at and comment upon, I would like to
expand it and add more stuff to create an overall electrical guide for those
of use that are electrically handicapped
also I might add if anyone wants to make wiring diagrams I can do this
pretty quick since have all the symbols and then give them AutoCAD,
microstaion or pdf back
i notice it size is to big, was meant to be c size drawing, will recreat for
a b size, hopefully smaller file size

mike#007

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hi ken

thanks bunch for info
will make changes & have mike Davis remove old files and replace with new
one
the alternator has no ov protection show because it is from Niagara air
parts and is supposed to be built in, should i still show an external one, i
don't know, what you think

mike

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of Ken
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 9:11 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: wiring schematic


Couple of thoughts after a quick look:

A 40 amp CB on a 40 amp alternator may well pop sooner or later after a
hard start. 50 amps might be a better choice and it should be as close
to the starter contactor as possible since it is protecting the wire to
the alternator from high battery current should a short occur in the
wire or in the alternator. I used 8awg for that alternator feed wire.
Some folks use 6awg. 4awg is perhaps overkill for a 40amp alternator and
possibly a little more difficult to mount and terminate. I notice you
have not shown any overvoltage protection. Not sure if that is by choice
or just not shown yet.

I would not bother with any 20 awg wire such as on your loadmeter. Why
stock an extra size? 22awg is fine as we are only talking about
milliamps of current. I'd probably use smaller than 6 amp fuses for the
loadmeter regardless. Perhaps even 26awg fuselinks for simplicity and
space saving.

As shown you don't have the option of putting on both the landing light
and the taxi light simultaneously which is OK I guess. To be real picky
I think 16awg in the landing light circuit is not normally fused for 15
amps. I think 12 amp is the preferred limit for 16awg. I used 16awg to
lessen the voltage drop in a few places but I fused it to 10amps pretty
much everywhere. A 10amp CB is slow acting and should handle this
application just fine.

Your 22awg starter engaged light should be protected as well. I would
use an inch or two of 26awg off the starter contactor for a fusible link
for things like that. Easier to install and locate than a fuse, not to
mention more reliable and cheaper. The $6. fuselink kit from B&C is good
for probably six or eight fuselinks.

Same for the voltmeter and also the other end of the voltmeter should
probably go to ground ;)

Ken

Jones, Michael wrote:

hi all

I have uploaded a wiring schematic based upon aero electric and eaa

bingelis

books, perhaps some people could look at and comment upon, I would like to
expand it and add more stuff to create an overall electrical guide for

those

of use that are electrically handicapped
also I might add if anyone wants to make wiring diagrams I can do this
pretty quick since have all the symbols and then give them AutoCAD,
microstaion or pdf back
i notice it size is to big, was meant to be c size drawing, will recreat

for

a b size, hopefully smaller file size

mike#007

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HATCH immediately via mailto:MailAdmin@hatch.ca.



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To my knowledge no there is no reliable overvoltage protection inside
any of these automove alternators with internal voltage regulators. They
still occasionally start charging full on out of control. While that is
rare, it is a problem if you have expensive avionics or essential engine
electronics installed as the voltage will rise rapidly.

It has been reported that some alternators (including the one from
Niagra) will shutoff if you remove voltage from the IGN terminal on a
good day. You would still need some simple external overvoltage
protection to do that though. But will that still shut it off on a bad
day after the electronics have failed/ shorted and the alternator is
running away out of control and charging full out? Bob mentioned a way
of measuring the current on the IGN terminal and making an educated
guess but it is still only a guess. Once the regulator has failed then
you simply can't be certain that removing voltage from the IGN terminal
will still shut it down. In most cases it will not AFAIK. So some folks
put a contactor in the feedline to disconnect the alternator if an
overvoltage occurs. I did that not because of expensive avionics but
because if I fry my engine computers the Subaru will stop turning the
fan and when the fan stops - the pilot starts sweating. Your call.

Most certified machines have no overvoltage protection but because they
use alternators with external voltage regulator it is fairly easy to add
ov protection to that type of alternator as no contactor is required if
you can for certain shut off the field current.

Ken.

Jones, Michael wrote:

hi ken

thanks bunch for info
will make changes & have mike Davis remove old files and replace with new
one
the alternator has no ov protection show because it is from Niagara air
parts and is supposed to be built in, should i still show an external one, i
don't know, what you think

mike

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HI KEN

i agree with what you are saying, ignore the new dwg i send you, perhaps i
should get b&c alt with b&c controller to solve the whole problem, or
aeroelectric show ov protection with another contactor on fig z-24, we shall
see, the first option seem simplest

mike

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of Ken
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 10:08 PM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: wiring schematic


To my knowledge no there is no reliable overvoltage protection inside
any of these automove alternators with internal voltage regulators. They
still occasionally start charging full on out of control. While that is
rare, it is a problem if you have expensive avionics or essential engine
electronics installed as the voltage will rise rapidly.

It has been reported that some alternators (including the one from
Niagra) will shutoff if you remove voltage from the IGN terminal on a
good day. You would still need some simple external overvoltage
protection to do that though. But will that still shut it off on a bad
day after the electronics have failed/ shorted and the alternator is
running away out of control and charging full out? Bob mentioned a way
of measuring the current on the IGN terminal and making an educated
guess but it is still only a guess. Once the regulator has failed then
you simply can't be certain that removing voltage from the IGN terminal
will still shut it down. In most cases it will not AFAIK. So some folks
put a contactor in the feedline to disconnect the alternator if an
overvoltage occurs. I did that not because of expensive avionics but
because if I fry my engine computers the Subaru will stop turning the
fan and when the fan stops - the pilot starts sweating. Your call.

Most certified machines have no overvoltage protection but because they
use alternators with external voltage regulator it is fairly easy to add
ov protection to that type of alternator as no contactor is required if
you can for certain shut off the field current.

Ken.

Jones, Michael wrote:

hi ken

thanks bunch for info
will make changes & have mike Davis remove old files and replace with new
one
the alternator has no ov protection show because it is from Niagara air
parts and is supposed to be built in, should i still show an external one,

i

don't know, what you think

mike

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HATCH immediately via mailto:MailAdmin@hatch.ca.



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