The Murphy Builders Site

Although I know there are a lot of Lycoming savvy folks out there I
imagine there are also plenty of auto engine savvy people on the
builder's list. I am struggling with the learning curve while building
my Chevy V8 for my Super Rebel and am having a great time! I've had a
hundred questions that I've worked through one at a time. Now I have
another question that perhaps someone can help me with. I have
completed the engine all the way to the point where I am doing the
initial adjustment to the rocker/lifters. I completed the procedure,
finding TDC on the compression stroke for each piston in turn and
tightening the rockers until the push rod doesn't turn, then adding one
turn on the rocker nut to center the lifter. But I noticed something
while doing this. After turning the engine over a few times by hand
following the adjustment, many lifters required further adjustment. I
also noticed that some lifters were sort of springy while others
weren't. I could push down on the rocker above the push rod on some
lifters and feel springyness. Yet on some lifters they were solid as a
rock (valve spring not compressed). I'm wondering what's happening.
Some lifters full of oil while others are not? I am also aware that the
final adjustment is often done with the engine running, pretty much by
the sound of the rocker against the push rod. Any suggestions? Thanks.

Mike Kimball
SR #044



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Mike
You are correct about soft lifters due to unequal (or
no) oil pressure. Wayne offers one of the things we
did prior to lifter installation but that really only
made sure that all of the machined surfaces were lubed
but never guaranteed that the lifter would fill
itself. Now days they have assembly lube for that of
which I'm sure you used on both the camshaft and
lifters. The best way to be relatively sure of equal
pressure in each of the lifters is to remove the
distributer and fashion a shaft ( old screw driver
works best), attach same to your corded drill motor
and insert that down the dist. hole and engage the oil
pump drive gear just as the dist would, (make sure
you've determined that you are rotating correctly) and
then prime the entire system, (making sure that you've
plugged all of the externally accessible oil ports,
else wise you will make a mess). If you have already
connected your oil pressure gage, watch for the
pressure to build and then plateau, you should now
have most of the air expelled from the lifters. It
really wouldn't hurt to repeat the procedure between
each set of rockers for each cylinder you adjust. And
again you are correct that the best way to adjust is
when engine is idling (easy to say when working on a
car) and not standing behind a spinning prop, but you
could do this before installing the prop. The other
thing to remember is that factory specs (at least they
used to be) was for one full "slow turn" while idling
of each rocker adjustment after the lifter stopped
clattering. This is impossible to do unless you take
each one down just past zero clearance (no clatter)
and then go back and readjust each one to your desired
setting. The other thing you should consider is
purchasing some small metal spring steel clips ( from
your local speed shop) to attach to all of the rocker
arms on the bank you are working on (leaving the valve
cover on opposite side during said procedure), this
will help keep most of the oil shooting up through the
push-rod and through the rocker on the head and not
all over you. Sounds like a awesome combination,

Good Luck
Doug Simons

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on 3/22/04 1:14 PM, Mike Kimball at mkimball@gci.net wrote:

Although I know there are a lot of Lycoming savvy folks out there I
imagine there are also plenty of auto engine savvy people on the
builder's list. I am struggling with the learning curve while building
my Chevy V8 for my Super Rebel and am having a great time! I've had a
hundred questions that I've worked through one at a time. Now I have
another question that perhaps someone can help me with. I have
completed the engine all the way to the point where I am doing the
initial adjustment to the rocker/lifters. I completed the procedure,
finding TDC on the compression stroke for each piston in turn and
tightening the rockers until the push rod doesn't turn, then adding one
turn on the rocker nut to center the lifter. But I noticed something
while doing this. After turning the engine over a few times by hand
following the adjustment, many lifters required further adjustment. I
also noticed that some lifters were sort of springy while others
weren't. I could push down on the rocker above the push rod on some
lifters and feel springyness. Yet on some lifters they were solid as a
rock (valve spring not compressed). I'm wondering what's happening.
Some lifters full of oil while others are not? I am also aware that the
final adjustment is often done with the engine running, pretty much by
the sound of the rocker against the push rod. Any suggestions? Thanks.

Mike Kimball
SR #044



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I haven't worked on auto engine lifters for a while, but I believe the rule
of thumb was to have 2 threads showing above the top of the nut as an
initial setting.



Allen
R151



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Mike, in the days when I played with hopped up street engines... that ran
Hydraulic lifters...we always put the lifter assembly in a can of oil and
then using a drill press pumped them in and out as many times as we could
until they were as firm as we could get them ...before putting in an engine.
If you haven't done this then yes you are going to get soft lifters until
the engine has been run (or cranked for pre-lubing at least) and the oil
pressure has come up.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Kimball" <mkimball@gci.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 3:14 PM
Subject: Lifter Adjustment

Although I know there are a lot of Lycoming savvy folks out there I
imagine there are also plenty of auto engine savvy people on the
builder's list. I am struggling with the learning curve while building
my Chevy V8 for my Super Rebel and am having a great time! I've had a
hundred questions that I've worked through one at a time. Now I have
another question that perhaps someone can help me with. I have
completed the engine all the way to the point where I am doing the
initial adjustment to the rocker/lifters. I completed the procedure,
finding TDC on the compression stroke for each piston in turn and
tightening the rockers until the push rod doesn't turn, then adding one
turn on the rocker nut to center the lifter. But I noticed something
while doing this. After turning the engine over a few times by hand
following the adjustment, many lifters required further adjustment. I
also noticed that some lifters were sort of springy while others
weren't. I could push down on the rocker above the push rod on some
lifters and feel springyness. Yet on some lifters they were solid as a
rock (valve spring not compressed). I'm wondering what's happening.
Some lifters full of oil while others are not? I am also aware that the
final adjustment is often done with the engine running, pretty much by
the sound of the rocker against the push rod. Any suggestions? Thanks.

Mike Kimball
SR #044

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Giday, Mike. I built up a Corvair with a gearbox for my Christavia a few years ago
and the technique was about the same as yours. On startup, it may rattle a bit and then
the lifters will fill up and shut up. They won't do it all at the same time and that is
probably what you are feeling now. Ooops, but wait a minute. My experience was
with new, unfilled lifters. Are your lifters new or used ? If they are used, some may have
some oil in them. The procedure would then be different methinks.

Dave Stroud, Ottawa, Canada
Christavia C-FDWS
Fairchild 51 early construction
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Kimball" <mkimball@gci.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 3:14 PM
Subject: Lifter Adjustment

Although I know there are a lot of Lycoming savvy folks out there I
imagine there are also plenty of auto engine savvy people on the
builder's list. I am struggling with the learning curve while building
my Chevy V8 for my Super Rebel and am having a great time! I've had a
hundred questions that I've worked through one at a time. Now I have
another question that perhaps someone can help me with. I have
completed the engine all the way to the point where I am doing the
initial adjustment to the rocker/lifters. I completed the procedure,
finding TDC on the compression stroke for each piston in turn and
tightening the rockers until the push rod doesn't turn, then adding one
turn on the rocker nut to center the lifter. But I noticed something
while doing this. After turning the engine over a few times by hand
following the adjustment, many lifters required further adjustment. I
also noticed that some lifters were sort of springy while others
weren't. I could push down on the rocker above the push rod on some
lifters and feel springyness. Yet on some lifters they were solid as a
rock (valve spring not compressed). I'm wondering what's happening.
Some lifters full of oil while others are not? I am also aware that the
final adjustment is often done with the engine running, pretty much by
the sound of the rocker against the push rod. Any suggestions? Thanks.

Mike Kimball
SR #044



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Brian
Good point, did that happen with a automotive style V8
or a horizontally opposed aircraft engine and what
kind of problems did he experience? Big rpm range
difference. Additionally I assumed Mike would have a
PSRU on his Chevy V8 and this should help. Spinning
the engine over with the starter will move oil through
the system but an initial prime before doing so can
save a bearing.
Doug

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Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html


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On Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:37:34 -0800 (PST), you wrote:


BIG SNIP

........................................................................

............And

again you are correct that the best way to adjust is
when engine is idling (easy to say when working on a
car) and not standing behind a spinning prop, but you
could do this before installing the prop.

MORE SNIP

Hey guys,

No authority here at all, but co-incidentally in a discussion the
other day I was told that a local guy ran his engine sans prop right
after hanging it, and a very light throttle touch caused a significant
engine overspeed. He has had many engine troubles ever since. With
no prop or flywheel, there is nothing to retard engine RPM
acceleration. So take what I'm saying with at least a grain of salt,
but be aware. The starter cranking with the mags shut off and plugs
out sounds like the simplest to me.

I have not seen much from him here lately, but Bob Johnson, from St.
Catharines, showed me a simple manual pre-lube pump he bolted on to
the Lycoming in his Rebel, using a mini-greasegun to pump in oil,
ostensibly to pre-lube the cams as I recall. Maybe somebody else can
suggest what and how he did it? Or Hey Bob...wake up!!

Take care.

Brian Lawson,
Bothwell, Ontario.


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Bob is awake. I have a lot of problems with my home computer crashing when
typing "e" mail and have now transfered this site to my work. The
"pre-oiler" I put on my H2AD O320 is not a "bolt-on" anything but mearly a
high pressure hydraulic quick connect fitting T-ed into the oil gallery
where the oil pressure fitting attaches. I plug in a manual hand pump( a
machinery way lubricator) and pump in about a 1/4 of a liter of fresh oil.
This will actually produce about 18 to 20 psi reading on my oil pressure
gauge. I know this does not directly lub the lobes of the cam, but it does
flood all the oil galleries and produce instant oil pressure upon start up.
This manual pump normaly remains on the ground so therfore does not add any
extra weight to the aircraft. If anyone would like additional information
just ask. Thanks - Bob Johnson Rebel "652" -Flying. (ps - a few weeks ago a
gentleman from Buffalo contacted this site but I was unable to respond due
to above problem. If you make yourself know again, I would extend an
invitation to go flying in my Rebel. I am based in St.Catharines.)




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