The Murphy Builders Site

Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions of
8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do you
think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace? It
seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts that
the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the four-door
cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

Once you bolt it all together, ie channels between it and the nose bowl etc,
it will be fine but you do need that 1/8" thick (or similar) brace I showed
in my pictures from this "stand off" aft & up to the bottom of the cabin
outer floor..... or when you open the lower cowl doors everything will move
out of alignment.

If you can get the hinges onto that 1/2" angle use it, if not you'll have
to make something else up. I'm thinking the big thing is you really should
have at least 3/4" for enough edge distane for an anchor nut etc for
attaching through the nose bowl lip, but you might be able to get away with
1/2" material that is that thick without it cracking on you.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeffrey Steenson" <jsteenson1@comcast.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 1:28 PM
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions

of

8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do

you

think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace? It
seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts

that

the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the

four-door

cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

Jeffrey

The standoff should be OK but I added an L piece of 5/8x5/8 to the brace
for the standoff which is bolted to the bottom of the standoff and bolted or
riveted to the floor.

The angles supplied for the four door cowl seemed to work fine for me. The
four doors are a good idea.Don't thank me thank the Mr. Wayne for the idea.

Good luckl
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 11:29 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions of
8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do you
think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace? It
seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts that
the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the four-door
cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

When you make the cowl, leave enough slack if you will to put some
protective tape (surgical tape ) on the inside of the cowl attached to the
cowl or nose bowl and around firewall to help stop wear.If you make the cowl
fit to tight the tape thickness will not allow you to get the hinge pins in.
Good luck
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 7:34 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

I R&D'd (read: Ripped off And Duplicated!) the four door idea from Toby
Riley/George Christie's Rebel so thank them!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Jeffrey

The standoff should be OK but I added an L piece of 5/8x5/8 to the brace
for the standoff which is bolted to the bottom of the standoff and bolted

or

riveted to the floor.

The angles supplied for the four door cowl seemed to work fine for me. The
four doors are a good idea.Don't thank me thank the Mr. Wayne for the

idea.

Good luckl
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 11:29 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions

of

8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do

you

think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace? It
seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts

that

the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the

four-door

cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

Wayne:

Right or wrong I took a file and burred the end of the hinge pin, then put
it in a drill and ran it through the hinge. This gave that little bit of
clearence needed after painting.You are right.

Thanks
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 7:57 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

You're right there Murray! I use weather stripping black foam on mine for
less chafe, but surgical tape, chafe tape, etc is a must here or the edge
that rests on the firewall especially will chew through your fuselage skin.

I also swapped out all 8 of my hinge wires for .063 stainless wires (after
construction was done). Being about 20thou undersize they are much easier to
install and remove without the hassles of the original pin size. After paint
it was a nightmare to get the original pins back in. These undersize pins
are available from any welding supply house as they are available as TIG
rods and come in about a 3 foot length. Sold by the pound a few dollars will
buy enough for the cowling. These are 1/16 diameter "rods".

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

When you make the cowl, leave enough slack if you will to put some
protective tape (surgical tape ) on the inside of the cowl attached to the
cowl or nose bowl and around firewall to help stop wear.If you make the

cowl

fit to tight the tape thickness will not allow you to get the hinge pins

in.

Good luck
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 7:34 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

I R&D'd (read: Ripped off And Duplicated!) the four door idea from Toby
Riley/George Christie's Rebel so thank them!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Jeffrey

The standoff should be OK but I added an L piece of 5/8x5/8 to the

brace

for the standoff which is bolted to the bottom of the standoff and

bolted

or
riveted to the floor.

The angles supplied for the four door cowl seemed to work fine for me.

The

four doors are a good idea.Don't thank me thank the Mr. Wayne for the
idea.
Good luckl
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 11:29 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions
of
8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do
you
think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace?

It

seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts
that
the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the
four-door
cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

I R&D'd (read: Ripped off And Duplicated!) the four door idea from Toby
Riley/George Christie's Rebel so thank them!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Jeffrey

The standoff should be OK but I added an L piece of 5/8x5/8 to the brace
for the standoff which is bolted to the bottom of the standoff and bolted

or

riveted to the floor.

The angles supplied for the four door cowl seemed to work fine for me. The
four doors are a good idea.Don't thank me thank the Mr. Wayne for the

idea.

Good luckl
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 11:29 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions

of

8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do

you

think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace? It
seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts

that

the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the

four-door

cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

You're right there Murray! I use weather stripping black foam on mine for
less chafe, but surgical tape, chafe tape, etc is a must here or the edge
that rests on the firewall especially will chew through your fuselage skin.

I also swapped out all 8 of my hinge wires for .063 stainless wires (after
construction was done). Being about 20thou undersize they are much easier to
install and remove without the hassles of the original pin size. After paint
it was a nightmare to get the original pins back in. These undersize pins
are available from any welding supply house as they are available as TIG
rods and come in about a 3 foot length. Sold by the pound a few dollars will
buy enough for the cowling. These are 1/16 diameter "rods".

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

When you make the cowl, leave enough slack if you will to put some
protective tape (surgical tape ) on the inside of the cowl attached to the
cowl or nose bowl and around firewall to help stop wear.If you make the

cowl

fit to tight the tape thickness will not allow you to get the hinge pins

in.

Good luck
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 7:34 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

I R&D'd (read: Ripped off And Duplicated!) the four door idea from Toby
Riley/George Christie's Rebel so thank them!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Jeffrey

The standoff should be OK but I added an L piece of 5/8x5/8 to the

brace

for the standoff which is bolted to the bottom of the standoff and

bolted

or
riveted to the floor.

The angles supplied for the four door cowl seemed to work fine for me.

The

four doors are a good idea.Don't thank me thank the Mr. Wayne for the
idea.
Good luckl
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 11:29 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions
of
8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do
you
think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace?

It

seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts
that
the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the
four-door
cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

Sounds like a good thing to do! As long as you can get them in and out easy
enough that you're not reluctant to pull one for a quick preflight look
that's all that matters! Mine where just too tight and I knew I wouldn't
bother more than once a year the way they were! Need to change some out on a
few other birds around here as well.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 10:39 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Wayne:

Right or wrong I took a file and burred the end of the hinge pin, then put
it in a drill and ran it through the hinge. This gave that little bit of
clearence needed after painting.You are right.

Thanks
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 7:57 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

You're right there Murray! I use weather stripping black foam on mine for
less chafe, but surgical tape, chafe tape, etc is a must here or the edge
that rests on the firewall especially will chew through your fuselage

skin.

I also swapped out all 8 of my hinge wires for .063 stainless wires (after
construction was done). Being about 20thou undersize they are much easier

to

install and remove without the hassles of the original pin size. After

paint

it was a nightmare to get the original pins back in. These undersize pins
are available from any welding supply house as they are available as TIG
rods and come in about a 3 foot length. Sold by the pound a few dollars

will

buy enough for the cowling. These are 1/16 diameter "rods".

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

When you make the cowl, leave enough slack if you will to put some
protective tape (surgical tape ) on the inside of the cowl attached to

the

cowl or nose bowl and around firewall to help stop wear.If you make the
cowl
fit to tight the tape thickness will not allow you to get the hinge pins
in.
Good luck
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 7:34 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

I R&D'd (read: Ripped off And Duplicated!) the four door idea from Toby
Riley/George Christie's Rebel so thank them!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Jeffrey

The standoff should be OK but I added an L piece of 5/8x5/8 to the
brace
for the standoff which is bolted to the bottom of the standoff and
bolted
or
riveted to the floor.

The angles supplied for the four door cowl seemed to work fine for me.
The
four doors are a good idea.Don't thank me thank the Mr. Wayne for the
idea.
Good luckl
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 11:29 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's

dimensions

of
8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes).

Do

you
think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace?
It
seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts
that
the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the
four-door
cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle,

or

should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

You might want to try the .078 stainless inside wire from a Bowden
cable (push-pull cable) for cowling hinge pins. Reasonably snug fit
without the binding you get with regular hinge pins. Idea came from
Chris Gil (on his Super Rebel, don't know where he was using the
hinges). Aircraft Spruce was selling the wire by itself, but I don't see
it in the current catalog.

Jim Callahan
Rebel #180R

Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

You're right there Murray! I use weather stripping black foam on mine for
less chafe, but surgical tape, chafe tape, etc is a must here or the edge
that rests on the firewall especially will chew through your fuselage skin.

I also swapped out all 8 of my hinge wires for .063 stainless wires (after
construction was done). Being about 20thou undersize they are much easier to
install and remove without the hassles of the original pin size. After paint
it was a nightmare to get the original pins back in. These undersize pins
are available from any welding supply house as they are available as TIG
rods and come in about a 3 foot length. Sold by the pound a few dollars will
buy enough for the cowling. These are 1/16 diameter "rods".

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

When you make the cowl, leave enough slack if you will to put some
protective tape (surgical tape ) on the inside of the cowl attached to the
cowl or nose bowl and around firewall to help stop wear.If you make the

cowl

fit to tight the tape thickness will not allow you to get the hinge pins

in.

Good luck
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Wayne G. O'Shea
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 7:34 PM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

I R&D'd (read: Ripped off And Duplicated!) the four door idea from Toby
Riley/George Christie's Rebel so thank them!

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Jeffrey

The standoff should be OK but I added an L piece of 5/8x5/8 to the

brace

for the standoff which is bolted to the bottom of the standoff and

bolted

or

riveted to the floor.

The angles supplied for the four door cowl seemed to work fine for me.

The

four doors are a good idea.Don't thank me thank the Mr. Wayne for the

idea.

Good luckl
Murray

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com]On Behalf Of
Jeffrey Steenson
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 11:29 AM
To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
Subject: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

Dear Wayne and Others,

I bent up a piece of .032 for the lower standoff (per Wayne's dimensions

of

8" tapering to 7" at a height of 3-5/8" with two lightening holes). Do

you

think I need to add any stiffeners to this other than the cowl brace?

It

seems a bit flimsy.

Also, MAM suppied angles of 1/2" .064. I note from some earlier posts

that

the lower longerons were 1" to accomodate the door hinges for the

four-door

cowl. In your experience, will it be okay to use the supplied angle, or
should I install a larger piece?

Much appreciate the help!

Jeffrey Steenson
E714

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Posted: **Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:07 am**

www.spaenaur.com sells it by the lb. in .090, .085, .080, .075 etc.
Full hard piano (music) wire series 302.

Don't know the price.

Ken

James Callahan wrote:

You might want to try the .078 stainless inside wire from a Bowden
cable (push-pull cable) for cowling hinge pins. Reasonably snug fit
without the binding you get with regular hinge pins. Idea came from
Chris Gil (on his Super Rebel, don't know where he was using the
hinges). Aircraft Spruce was selling the wire by itself, but I don't see
it in the current catalog.

Jim Callahan
Rebel #180R

Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

You're right there Murray! I use weather stripping black foam on mine for
less chafe, but surgical tape, chafe tape, etc is a must here or the edge
that rests on the firewall especially will chew through your fuselage skin.

I also swapped out all 8 of my hinge wires for .063 stainless wires (after
construction was done). Being about 20thou undersize they are much easier to
install and remove without the hassles of the original pin size. After paint
it was a nightmare to get the original pins back in. These undersize pins
are available from any welding supply house as they are available as TIG
rods and come in about a 3 foot length. Sold by the pound a few dollars will
buy enough for the cowling. These are 1/16 diameter "rods".

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Cherkas" <cherkas@shaw.ca>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2003 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: Cowl Brace - Nosebowl Cowl

When you make the cowl, leave enough slack if you will to put some
protective tape (surgical tape ) on the inside of the cowl attached to the
cowl or nose bowl and around firewall to help stop wear.If you make the
cowl fit to tight the tape thickness will not allow you to get the hinge pins

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