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Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Legeorgen
Ian,

I have to tape off my oil cooler in the "summer" on my 912 Kitfox to get oil temps that high. I would suspect your cooler is not getting enough air flow through it. Where is it located?

Bruce G 357R

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Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Ian Donaldson
G'day


My Rebel is fitted with a Rotax 912s and I am still flying off the necessary testing hours.

However what I have noticed, is that a few minutes of full throttle climb, soon sends the oil temperature soaring to 110 to 115 degrees Celsius. None of the other temperatures increase much at all.

I have the standard oil cooler as supplied by MAM together with their water radiator etc. The oil that I am using is Castrol GPS.

As we are in Winter here the ambient temperatures are about 15oC. but I fear to think what will happen in Summer when we get much hotter weather.

Does anyone have any suggestions as to why I would run so hot, and perhaps could you offer a cure?


Thanks and regards


Ian Donaldson

(Rebel 659 flying and loving it!)

Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Ian Donaldson
G'day Bruce

The oil cooler is located in the nose of the cowl immediately under the propellor which is where the factory recommend that it be placed.

Just perhaps it does not get enough airflow.

Surely I.I'm not the only one to have this problem?

Regards

Ian Donaldson




Ian,

I have to tape off my oil cooler in the "summer" on my 912 Kitfox to get oil temps that high. I would suspect your cooler is not getting enough air flow through it. Where is it located?

Bruce G 357R

Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Legeorgen
Ian,

This is the accepted location for 912 oil coolers, up front just under the prop (see the picture of "912S engine on a Kitfox" in the Rebel archives). It should be getting plenty of air. If all other CHT's and water temperatures are not raising, I would suspect your gage.

For a comparison; if I run my 912 at 5000 RPM for 10 minutes on a 100 degree F day, my oil temperatures might reach 225.

You mentioned you are using GPS oil. It should be the motor cycle brand with a gear additive. If you didn't pay $8.00 US a quart, it's not the right oil!

Bruce G 357R

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Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Bob Patterson
Hi Ian !

It <IS> pretty unusual - did you by chance run some air through
the oil cooler before installation, to check for blockage ?? (Some
have found junk blocking the tubes on coolers ...)

Is it possible that there's some air trapped in the cooler,
limiting it's efficiency ??? Temps can be high if there's <too much>
oil in the tank, too ...

What grade is the oil ??? We found that anything thinner
than 15-50 didn't lubricate properly, causing higher temps .....
(Tried 10-30 for Canadian winters - not a "Good Thing" !!!)

Of course, the first thing would be to verify the accuracy of
the gauge by dipping the probe in boiling water .... Generally, the
larger spread between markings on the dial, the easier it is to get
a good reading - I lean toward Frankenstein temps, rather than
Centipede .... ;-) :-)

Hope there was a helpful tip in there somewhere ....

.....bobp
PS
Of course, the temps will come down as the engine breaks in !
Glad you're having fun flying it !!!! :-)


-----------------------------------orig.-------------------------------
At 10:26 PM 7/30/02 +1000, you wrote:
G'day Bruce

The oil cooler is located in the nose of the cowl immediately under the
propellor which is where the factory recommend that it be placed.
Just perhaps it does not get enough airflow.

Surely I.I'm not the only one to have this problem?

Regards

Ian Donaldson





Ian,

I have to tape off my oil cooler in the "summer" on my 912 Kitfox to get
oil temps that high. I would suspect your cooler is not getting enough air
flow through it. Where is it located?
Bruce G 357R
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<DIV><FONT size=2>G'day Bruce</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>The oil cooler is located in the nose of the cowl
immediately
under the propellor which</FONT><FONT size=2> is where the factory recommend
that it be placed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Just perhaps it does not get enough airflow.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Surely I.I'm not the only one to have this
problem?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Regards</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Ian Donaldson</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2>Ian, <BR><BR>I
have to
tape off my oil cooler in the "summer" on my 912 Kitfox to get oil temps
that
high. I would suspect your cooler is not getting enough air flow through it.
Where is it located? <BR><BR>Bruce G 357R</FONT>
</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>


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Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Ian Donaldson
G'day Bruce

Thanks for your reply.

All the other temps are OK. Just maybe the gauge is wrong!

The oil is GPS with the gear additive. Here in Australia it's a little more than $8 per quart!

Over here we have been Metricated for a long time, and I will have to get a conversion chart to see just what 225F is in Celsius and in fact what is a quart!!

Regards

Ian
This is the accepted location for 912 oil coolers, up front just under the prop (see the picture of "912S engine on a Kitfox" in the Rebel archives). It should be getting plenty of air. If all other CHT's and water temperatures are not raising, I would suspect your gage.

For a comparison; if I run my 912 at 5000 RPM for 10 minutes on a 100 degree F day, my oil temperatures might reach 225.

You mentioned you are using GPS oil. It should be the motor cycle brand with a gear additive. If you didn't pay $8.00 US a quart, it's not the right oil!

Bruce G 357R

Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Ian Donaldson
G'day Bob


1. Nope! I never thought to see if the cooler is blocked. I just gave it
a shake and put it on! I will check that.

2. Air in the cooler? Never thought of that! Too much oil? I have just
filled it up to the mark on the dipstick. I didn't know that too much
oil could cause trouble. Will check that too.

3. I'm not sure what the viscosity of the oil is. I am using Castrol
GPS, but never thought to check the grade.
I thought that it came in only one grade. Will check that also.
4. I just assumed that the gauge would be OK. I am using VDO marked in
"Centipedes". The gauge has a wide spacing aroung the 100 mark, so it is
realtively easy to see the readings. I will also check the readings.

5. Yep. You surely gave me plenty of things to think about. I have noticed
that the temp does not rise a quickly as it did when the engine was brand
new. Just maybe all will sort itself out with time.


I sure am enjoying the Rebel. It's really is worth the trouble!

Regards


Ian Donaldson

Hi Ian !

It <IS> pretty unusual - did you by chance run some air through
the oil cooler before installation, to check for blockage ?? (Some
have found junk blocking the tubes on coolers ...)

Is it possible that there's some air trapped in the cooler,
limiting it's efficiency ??? Temps can be high if there's <too much>
oil in the tank, too ...

What grade is the oil ??? We found that anything thinner
than 15-50 didn't lubricate properly, causing higher temps .....
(Tried 10-30 for Canadian winters - not a "Good Thing" !!!)

Of course, the first thing would be to verify the accuracy of
the gauge by dipping the probe in boiling water .... Generally, the
larger spread between markings on the dial, the easier it is to get
a good reading - I lean toward Frankenstein temps, rather than
Centipede .... ;-) :-)

Hope there was a helpful tip in there somewhere ....

.....bobp
PS
Of course, the temps will come down as the engine breaks in !
Glad you're having fun flying it !!!! :-)



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Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Joel Jacobs
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Donaldson" <allsure@iprimus.com.au>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 9:38 AM
Subject: Re: Rebel oil cooler

All the other temps are OK. Just maybe the gauge is wrong!
I've heard that VDO makes two different temp sensors and if you have the
wrong guage/sensor combination it will read way high. Could you check you
calibration with some boiling water or something?


Joel







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Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Legeorgen
Ian,

Most dictionaries have conversion tables for converting.

Bruce G 357R

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Rebel oil cooler

Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Ian Donaldson
G'day Joel


Thanks for your interest.

I did not know about the VDO senders. I will check with the supplier
tomorrow.

I spoke to the Castrol oil dealer and it seems that GPS oil can run 115oC
without any trouble,
That makes me a little happier, until I get the temps sorted.


Regards

Ian Donaldson
All the other temps are OK. Just maybe the gauge is wrong!
I've heard that VDO makes two different temp sensors and if you have the
wrong guage/sensor combination it will read way high. Could you check you
calibration with some boiling water or something?


Joel




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