The Murphy Builders Site

Hey gang,

For certain reasons, Wayne O'Shea said we could make up the 3 pieces
of firewall reinforcement here in Windsor. He suggested that it be
made of 1/16" stock. At the time, I thought he meant aluminum
(actually, I'm positive he did), so I picked up two pieces of cut-offs
to do the job. Tuesday, another fellow in our group said he thought
that as the firewall is made of stainless, that we should be making
our pieces of stainless instead. In the little part of the world
where we live, stainless is more "readily available" (read free) than
aluminum, and we have a stainless steel craftsman to boot.

What's the considered opinion? And if stainless, what thickness would
be best? Stainless re-rivetting and new rivetting no matter which?
A comment made is that we are not trying to build an ultralight, but
others suggested it shouldn't be a battleship either!

We've had numerous comments that "We can't back up and do EVERY little
fix or every thing that's now recommended.". What do other builders
on this group feel about that? I personally think that the
reinforcement mod is easy for us to do at this juncture, and have
fought to get it going. We borrowed an engine lift to pull it, and it
turns out the prop has a spacer that was not installed anyway, so that
was part of the job right there. We're also going to remove the fuel
pump while the engine is out, and make a plate to cover the opening in
the block. Any ideas as to best material, and thickness to do that?
Aluminum, brass, steel, stainless?

Thanks again. Have a good day. I'm off to the North American Model
Engineering Show in Detroit for 4 days now. Open to the public on
Saturday and Sunday if anyone wants more info, drop me an email.

Brian Lawson
Windsor, Ontario.
EAA Chapter 185, project Rebel 528.





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You're right Brian! I <MEANT> .063 ALUMINUM (with a good coat of epoxy
primer on the back side)! Stainless is more malleable than aluminum (read it
bends/deforms easier) and the firewall buckling problem wasn't as big a
problem when the firewall came mfg'd from .032 aluminum. Once the switch to
stainless (mind you only around .020 thick) the buckling started
immediately. It sounds like you have too many chiefs and not enough
followers on that project. If they make you go with stainless I would
suggest that it is about 50% thicker so about 90thou! And your right,
stainless is heavier than aluminum by a LONG shot and the rebel doesn't need
any extra weight up front!

FWIW I have done MANY firewall plate sets WITHOUT removing the engine or
disconnecting anything other than wires that may run through the upper plate
area, and that was before I had any fancy 90* angle drills etc!

All the other upgrades are easy changes to do on the "fly". You have to
convince these guys that it will be a heck of a lot easier to do them now,
than after they have bent the thing!!!

As for the fuel pump cover, seeing that the engine case is aluminum I'd
stick with that and about .125 thick!

Cheers,
Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Lawson" <lawsonb@mnsi.net>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 9:44 PM
Subject: Firewall reinforcement




Hey gang,

For certain reasons, Wayne O'Shea said we could make up the 3 pieces
of firewall reinforcement here in Windsor. He suggested that it be
made of 1/16" stock. At the time, I thought he meant aluminum
(actually, I'm positive he did), so I picked up two pieces of cut-offs
to do the job. Tuesday, another fellow in our group said he thought
that as the firewall is made of stainless, that we should be making
our pieces of stainless instead. In the little part of the world
where we live, stainless is more "readily available" (read free) than
aluminum, and we have a stainless steel craftsman to boot.

What's the considered opinion? And if stainless, what thickness would
be best? Stainless re-rivetting and new rivetting no matter which?
A comment made is that we are not trying to build an ultralight, but
others suggested it shouldn't be a battleship either!

We've had numerous comments that "We can't back up and do EVERY little
fix or every thing that's now recommended.". What do other builders
on this group feel about that? I personally think that the
reinforcement mod is easy for us to do at this juncture, and have
fought to get it going. We borrowed an engine lift to pull it, and it
turns out the prop has a spacer that was not installed anyway, so that
was part of the job right there. We're also going to remove the fuel
pump while the engine is out, and make a plate to cover the opening in
the block. Any ideas as to best material, and thickness to do that?
Aluminum, brass, steel, stainless?

Thanks again. Have a good day. I'm off to the North American Model
Engineering Show in Detroit for 4 days now. Open to the public on
Saturday and Sunday if anyone wants more info, drop me an email.

Brian Lawson
Windsor, Ontario.
EAA Chapter 185, project Rebel 528.



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Hi Brian !

You're right to get them to do the mods. now ! Both the
corner doublers AND the cross channel (as described in the factory
"Float Fix" bulletin) are absolutely necessary.

They can do them now, when it's easy, or do them later, after
they've bent the firewall !!!

.....bobp

-----------------------------------orig.---------------------------------
At 01:44 AM 4/26/02 GMT, you wrote:

Hey gang,

For certain reasons, Wayne O'Shea said we could make up the 3 pieces
of firewall reinforcement here in Windsor. He suggested that it be
made of 1/16" stock. At the time, I thought he meant aluminum
(actually, I'm positive he did), so I picked up two pieces of cut-offs
to do the job. Tuesday, another fellow in our group said he thought
that as the firewall is made of stainless, that we should be making
our pieces of stainless instead. In the little part of the world
where we live, stainless is more "readily available" (read free) than
aluminum, and we have a stainless steel craftsman to boot.

What's the considered opinion? And if stainless, what thickness would
be best? Stainless re-rivetting and new rivetting no matter which?
A comment made is that we are not trying to build an ultralight, but
others suggested it shouldn't be a battleship either!

We've had numerous comments that "We can't back up and do EVERY little
fix or every thing that's now recommended.". What do other builders
on this group feel about that? I personally think that the
reinforcement mod is easy for us to do at this juncture, and have
fought to get it going. We borrowed an engine lift to pull it, and it
turns out the prop has a spacer that was not installed anyway, so that
was part of the job right there. We're also going to remove the fuel
pump while the engine is out, and make a plate to cover the opening in
the block. Any ideas as to best material, and thickness to do that?
Aluminum, brass, steel, stainless?

Thanks again. Have a good day. I'm off to the North American Model
Engineering Show in Detroit for 4 days now. Open to the public on
Saturday and Sunday if anyone wants more info, drop me an email.

Brian Lawson
Windsor, Ontario.
EAA Chapter 185, project Rebel 528.



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Hello from Cold Lake:
I have made my firewall for my rebel from .040 stainless and am
incorporating the float fix. I am installing a Subaru 2.5 and staying on
wheels until I can afford floats. I am assuming that the factory MAM stainless
firewall would be thinner - maybe .020 or .025?? Should I put the firewall
reinforcing plates on as well? Thanks for your time.

Ken Mutch
Rebel 204



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Hi all,
Can anyone --Wayne if you're listening -- provide info on "Wayne's bullet
proof" firewall? I see the picture in the Files/R-Fuselage section. So it
looks like a large plate of 063 added to the whole bottom few inches of the
firewall. Was this determined needed to help carry engine mount loads with
float planes? Does anyone have any dimensions or other info wrt adding this?

I also see the recommendation to make the channel between upper motor
mounts out of .040. (maybe that's also a float service bulletin).
Anything else on the firewall?

Thanks,
-Ben /496R



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