The Murphy Builders Site

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From: "Joel Jacobs" <jj@netexp.net>
To: "Rebel Builders" <Murphy-Rebel@dcsol.com>
Subject: REBEL: fuel drain valves
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 13:02:15 -0400
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My manuel dosen't show them but I would like to put curtis style drain
valves in my wing tanks. I'd hate to put them in now and find out later
they interfere with the doors. Anyone else been there / done that?

Joel

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To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com> (Murphy Rebel)
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves
Message-Id: <E0zAJhy-0002EA-00@mail2.toronto.istar.net>
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 15:52:19 -0400

The newer manuals DO show the fuel drains - they go at the back,
bottom of the tank. The valves come with the kit. They DO often hit the
window edging, the solution being to file/grind a small notch it the
edging strip.

If you can get the <almost> flush type drains that require a push
up pin type of fuel checker to use, they are a MUCH nicer solution. We have
them on number 1 - they look like a large (1/2") nut on the outside, with a
hole in the center. Because they only stick down about 1/8", they are no
problem to the doors or windows.

A drain on each of the tanks is VERY important !! You WILL get
condensation sooner or later, and this is the only easy way to get rid of
it.

Condensation in partially filled tanks is a VERY good reason to
consider carefully how large you are going to make the tanks in your REBEL !
Depending on the engine choice and mission profile, you may want smaller
tanks than the factory-supplied 3 bays/side (nominally 44 gal., but usually
actually 48 to 50 gal. !). For example, several people using the Rotax 912
that burns 3 gal/hr. have opted for 1 rib bay on the left side, and 2 bays
on the right, giving about 24 gal. - still 8 hours of flying !! Why carry
an extra 300 lb. of fuel, just to have full tanks ??!!

Smart float pilots heading into the boonies know that it is MUCH
better to take along several cans of gas in the baggage area, to leave
on the dock, for the flight home. This way, they can fly into small lakes
with minimal fuel, with good performance, and still have the fuel to get
home at the end of the weekend. They wouldn't get out of those small lakes
if they carried say 80 gal. ful fuel !!

Folks who have put in 80 gal. or larger tanks HAVE had problems with
fuel flow - 10 gallons would have been enough fuel, BUT it isn't very deep
when it's spread out over 10 rib bays !! The fuel outlets uncover in slips
!!

Sorry, Joel - that sermon wasn't meant for you - it's just one of
my old standards !!

Off the soapbox and back to the airport for me !! Thanks for listening
!

.....bobp

------------------------------------orig.---------------------------
At 01:02 PM 8/21/98 -0400, you wrote:

My manuel dosen't show them but I would like to put curtis style drain
valves in my wing tanks. I'd hate to put them in now and find out later
they interfere with the doors. Anyone else been there / done that?

Joel

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To: murphy-rebel@dcsol.com
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Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves
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HI JOEL, I AGREE WITH BOBP. ON THE FUEL DRAINS. THE GREATEST ADVANTAGE OF
THE CESSNA TYPE FLUSH STYLE IS NO NOTCHING THE DOOR. ALONG WITH THAT, IF
YOU
END UP SWINGING PART, OR ALL, OF YOUR DOOR THEY WILL STILL MISS. GOOD LUCK
AND KEEP AT IT , IT IS WORTH IT. CURT MARTIN N97MR

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From: "Joel Jacobs" <jj@netexp.net>
To: "Murphy Rebel" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 1998 10:45:51 -0400
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-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Saturday, August 22, 1998 3:45 PM
Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves

The newer manuals DO show the fuel drains - they go at the back,
bottom of the tank. The valves come with the kit. They DO often hit the
window edging, the solution being to file/grind a small notch it the
edging strip.

Don't think I like that solution.

If you can get the <almost> flush type drains that require a push
up pin type of fuel checker to use, they are a MUCH nicer solution. We have
them on number 1 - they look like a large (1/2") nut on the outside, with a
hole in the center. Because they only stick down about 1/8", they are no
problem to the doors or windows.

Do you know what type of threads are on those type drains? The Curtis
drains I bought are 1/4" NPT. Maybe if I have a problem I could just swap
them out.

A drain on each of the tanks is VERY important !! You WILL get
condensation sooner or later, and this is the only easy way to get rid of

it.

Ya know, I would think so too, BUT my Luscombe has wing tanks and has no
drains on them??? Also it seems the gascolator could trap an awful lot of
water before any could get to the engine.

Condensation in partially filled tanks is a VERY good reason to
consider carefully how large you are going to make the tanks in your REBEL

!

Depending on the engine choice and mission profile, you may want smaller
tanks than the factory-supplied 3 bays/side (nominally 44 gal., but usually
actually 48 to 50 gal. !). For example, several people using the Rotax 912
that burns 3 gal/hr. have opted for 1 rib bay on the left side, and 2 bays
on the right, giving about 24 gal. - still 8 hours of flying !! Why carry
an extra 300 lb. of fuel, just to have full tanks ??!!

Good point Bob. It's a little late for me though - one wings finnished and
the other is ready to goop up and rivet together. I'll be using a Subaru
2.2L engine and expect to burn about 6 GPH.

Sorry, Joel - that sermon wasn't meant for you - it's just one of
my old standards !!

No problem Bob. I always enjoy reading your very informative posts.

Joel

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To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com> (Murphy Rebel)
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves
Message-Id: <E0zBQJw-0006FV-00@mail2.toronto.istar.net>
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 17:08:04 -0400


The notch is only about 1/4" deep, and is cut into the aluminum strip
that you rivet onto the outside of the square tube that forms the window
frame. It is hardly noticeable.

Sorry, I don't know the size or thread on the flush mount fittings,
but I'm sure someone out there can tell you ! Curtis or Bill ??

....bobp

-------------------------------orig.--------------------------------
At 10:45 AM 8/24/98 -0400, you wrote:

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Saturday, August 22, 1998 3:45 PM
Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves

The newer manuals DO show the fuel drains - they go at the back,
bottom of the tank. The valves come with the kit. They DO often hit the
window edging, the solution being to file/grind a small notch it the
edging strip.

Don't think I like that solution.

If you can get the <almost> flush type drains that require a push
up pin type of fuel checker to use, they are a MUCH nicer solution. We

have

them on number 1 - they look like a large (1/2") nut on the outside, with

a

hole in the center. Because they only stick down about 1/8", they are no
problem to the doors or windows.

Do you know what type of threads are on those type drains? The Curtis
drains I bought are 1/4" NPT. Maybe if I have a problem I could just swap
them out.

A drain on each of the tanks is VERY important !! You WILL get
condensation sooner or later, and this is the only easy way to get rid of

it.

Ya know, I would think so too, BUT my Luscombe has wing tanks and has no
drains on them??? Also it seems the gascolator could trap an awful lot of
water before any could get to the engine.

Condensation in partially filled tanks is a VERY good reason to
consider carefully how large you are going to make the tanks in your REBEL

!

Depending on the engine choice and mission profile, you may want smaller
tanks than the factory-supplied 3 bays/side (nominally 44 gal., but

usually

actually 48 to 50 gal. !). For example, several people using the Rotax 912
that burns 3 gal/hr. have opted for 1 rib bay on the left side, and 2 bays
on the right, giving about 24 gal. - still 8 hours of flying !! Why carry
an extra 300 lb. of fuel, just to have full tanks ??!!

Good point Bob. It's a little late for me though - one wings finnished and
the other is ready to goop up and rivet together. I'll be using a Subaru
2.2L engine and expect to burn about 6 GPH.

Sorry, Joel - that sermon wasn't meant for you - it's just one of
my old standards !!

No problem Bob. I always enjoy reading your very informative posts.

Joel

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Tue, 25 Aug 1998 19:46:16 -0400
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From: "Joel Jacobs" <jj@netexp.net>
To: "Murphy Rebel" <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 18:40:34 -0400
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-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Patterson <bob.patterson@canrem.com>
To: Murphy Rebel <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 25, 1998 5:01 PM
Subject: Re: REBEL: fuel drain valves

The notch is only about 1/4" deep, and is cut into the aluminum strip
that you rivet onto the outside of the square tube that forms the window
frame. It is hardly noticeable.

Oh, ok. For some reason I thought the square tube was being notched. I
think I'll go ahead and put them in. As far aft and inboard as possible,
right? Thanks.

Joel