The Murphy Builders Site

A follow-up question to my original post re: Wire Size (and thanks to all of
you who responded!)-

I would like to do as many of you have, that is to run the wing wiring
through tubing/conduit from the wing-tip, then down the wing strut. Some of
you have indicated you have used pvc pipe, flexible tubing, or aluminum
tubing for this purpose.

My question is, will plastic/synthetic products, ie; PVC pipe, polyurethane
tubing, vinyl tubing, etc., withstand the high temperatures that, I'm told,
can develop within the wing structure on hot days, parked on the flight
line?

I've read some of the comments pro/con in the archives, but haven't seen
this particular question addressed. I am inclined to use aluminum tubing
rather than anything else, but would appreciate any comments.

R. Hoffman #687R
Eugene, OR USA




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To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
From: Bob Patterson <apat@istar.ca>
Subject: Re: Wing Wiring


Hi Roger !

I guess the flexible tubing stands the heat about as well as
the flexible tubing used for fuel lines .....

I didn't want to use aluminum, to prevent the wires from
rubbing & shorting onto it, over years of vibration. Also, some
builders used rigid PVC, but found the flexible tubing MUCH easier
to install.

I guess time will tell - as always, do what YOU feel is best ! :-)

....bobp

--------------------------------orig.-------------------------------
At 01:22 PM 2/23/01 -0800, you wrote:

A follow-up question to my original post re: Wire Size (and thanks to all of
you who responded!)-

I would like to do as many of you have, that is to run the wing wiring
through tubing/conduit from the wing-tip, then down the wing strut. Some of
you have indicated you have used pvc pipe, flexible tubing, or aluminum
tubing for this purpose.

My question is, will plastic/synthetic products, ie; PVC pipe, polyurethane
tubing, vinyl tubing, etc., withstand the high temperatures that, I'm told,
can develop within the wing structure on hot days, parked on the flight
line?

I've read some of the comments pro/con in the archives, but haven't seen
this particular question addressed. I am inclined to use aluminum tubing
rather than anything else, but would appreciate any comments.

R. Hoffman #687R
Eugene, OR USA

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Guys,

I am getting close to the point of closing up a wing (after the dreaded tank
pressure test which is pending).

I have read in the archives that a number of builders have run pitot lines
and electrical lines down the struts and into the bottom of the cabin. I
have been trying to visualize this setup at the wing/strut junction and it
has occurred to me that if the wiring and tubing exited the wing behind the
strut it would make for a cleaner installation. If that is the case, I
feel the need to fabricate a conduit of some sort behind the main spar from
the tip to the middle of the wing.

I sure would appreciate any comments.

Cheers, rj

===========================================

R J Thomas
Lafayette, LA
rj.thomas@halliburton.com
(337) 849-4136

Super Rebel N140SR ( Under construction )






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RJ this is the way I have done mine
http://wrayt.tripod.com/wingwire.html ...but I'm not quite ready yet to
hook the completed wings to the Fus. so I'm just hoping this will all
work ok.

RJ Thomas wrote:

Guys,

I am getting close to the point of closing up a wing (after the dreaded tank
pressure test which is pending).

I have read in the archives that a number of builders have run pitot lines
and electrical lines down the struts and into the bottom of the cabin. I
have been trying to visualize this setup at the wing/strut junction and it
has occurred to me that if the wiring and tubing exited the wing behind the
strut it would make for a cleaner installation. If that is the case, I
feel the need to fabricate a conduit of some sort behind the main spar from
the tip to the middle of the wing.

I sure would appreciate any comments.

Cheers, rj

===========================================

R J Thomas
Lafayette, LA
rj.thomas@halliburton.com
(337) 849-4136

Super Rebel N140SR ( Under construction )

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--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page http://wrayt.tripod.com/
My ICQ number is 29764664



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Hi all,

Close to running wires for my SR right wing. I see
from past posts that most people install a conduit in
their wing and then run the wires down the wing strut.
Does anyone have any pics of where they installed the
conduit?

Digital pics please?

-Jason

=====
________________________________________________

Jason Beall
Super Rebel No. 131
Aberdeen, Scotland, UK
super_rebel131@yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com



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Jason, as you say <most> run conduit. I don't know if <most> run the wires
down the lift strut as that one is a personal call and to do it properly
will require disconnectable connections at both ends of the lift strut. I
will see if I can find a picture of the conduit through the SR wings I
built, and forward to you, so you can decide which way you want to proceed.

Wayne G. O'Shea
www.irishfield.on.ca

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Beall" <super_rebel131@yahoo.com>
To: <murphy-rebel@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 4:42 PM
Subject: wing wiring

Hi all,

Close to running wires for my SR right wing. I see
from past posts that most people install a conduit in
their wing and then run the wires down the wing strut.
Does anyone have any pics of where they installed the
conduit?

Digital pics please?

-Jason

=====
________________________________________________

Jason Beall
Super Rebel No. 131
Aberdeen, Scotland, UK
super_rebel131@yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com

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Try here http://wrayt.tripod.com/construction.html for construction pics
(mostly Rebel) or here for tips http://wrayt.tripod.com/hints.html

Jason Beall wrote:

Hi all,

Close to running wires for my SR right wing. I see
from past posts that most people install a conduit in
their wing and then run the wires down the wing strut.
Does anyone have any pics of where they installed the
conduit?

Digital pics please?

-Jason

=====
________________________________________________

Jason Beall
Super Rebel No. 131
Aberdeen, Scotland, UK
super_rebel131@yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com

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--
Wray Thompson ...Rebel 306 ...home page http://wrayt.tripod.com/
My ICQ number is 29764664



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I don't have a picture, but here is what I did. I ran a thin wall (it come in thick and thin in the US) PVC pipe down the leading edge. This required I drill a whole in the station 1 rib which is solid. The PVC is attached at station 1 using typical PVC plu
mming fastners with the threaded piece going through the whole in the Station 1 rib. I then ran a string end to end. This is easily blown through the PVC with compressed air. After I got the string to one end I wrapped it around something and blew it back,
again with compressed air. Now you tie the ends together around something and you have a poor man's pully which will allow you to pull wire through without loosing your string.

Hope this helps!


On Tue, 14 May 2002 13:42:07 -0700 (PDT) Jason Beall <super_rebel131@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hi all,

Close to running wires for my SR right wing. I see
from past posts that most people install a conduit in
their wing and then run the wires down the wing strut.
Does anyone have any pics of where they installed the
conduit?

Digital pics please?

-Jason

=====
________________________________________________

Jason Beall
Super Rebel No. 131
Aberdeen, Scotland, UK
super_rebel131@yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com

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We found that that a piece of white PVC pipe extended out near the wing
lights and back through the rib lightening holes to near the strut
attach point was light and supported the wires well with no chance of
grounds. The pipe was supported by Adel clamps at the ribs. It also
allows easy fishing of wires should future replacement be required. The
wires then come out the bottom of the wing in a grommeted hole (small as
possible) inside the strut fairing and into the strut down to the
fuselage entry. Don't forget disconnects so the struts can be removed.
Ralph Baker
Elite 624E
(Now in the Mad Cowling stage)


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Wayne
Looking back through past posts on this subject, I think you stated
preference for not running wires down thru the lift strut. I think you were
suggesting running through the leading edge section. Is that correct, and if
so, do you put a hole in the root rib "D" section for getting the wire run to
the fuselage? I also saw posts recommending flex tubing from auto parts --
that sounds better than pvc to me, not sure why.
Thanks,
-Ben/ 496R



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Ben
FWIW
It is difficult to pull an extra wire through that corrogated flex
tubing. Some of us found that very cheap translucent hardware store poly
tubing worked well. It is not quite as rigid as pvc and can be rolled
up. Also it seens to be easier to get those wires out of the fuselage
near the struts rather than up by the wing root. There doesn't seem to
be an elegant way to get the wires up to the wing root since apparently
we are not supposed to drill holes in the door posts.
Ken

bransom@dcsol.com wrote:

Wayne
Looking back through past posts on this subject, I think you stated
preference for not running wires down thru the lift strut. I think you were
suggesting running through the leading edge section. Is that correct, and if
so, do you put a hole in the root rib "D" section for getting the wire run to
the fuselage? I also saw posts recommending flex tubing from auto parts --
that sounds better than pvc to me, not sure why.
Thanks,
-Ben/ 496R

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Ben,
We are just about there on our Elite and plan on bringing the wing
wiring and pitot tube down the struts. Ther was no neat way I could see
to bring it down forward of the door. One extra grommeted hole will be
required in the wing inside the strut fairing so the fairing covers the
wire exit. At the bottom, inside the cabin, we will install quick
electrical disconnects and a small moisture collection bottle which will
also provide a place to disconnect the pitot tube. The cabin entry will
be via a grommeted hole in the access cover for the spring gear bolts.
(Elite) A bungee Rebel would most likely need a hole cut. Once again,
the entry will be inside the lower strut fairing for concealment.
Regards,
Rallph Baker



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Thanks Ken, Ralph,
I take it there is not a wire route that would, after getting through the
front root rib section, travel backward and down. I can't recall the route
of the fuel line from wing root but from a previous skim of MAM I thought it
traveled down behind the doors. I wondered if that was a route the wing
wiring (and pitot lines) could follow, instead of down the front door post,
or the lift strut. Unless I hear something from Wayne otherwise, I'll just
plan on lift strut as you suggest and close up the leading edge of my wing
with no wiring tube.
-Ben/ 496R

Ben,
We are just about there on our Elite and plan on bringing the wing
wiring and pitot tube down the struts. Ther was no neat way I could see
to bring it down forward of the door. One extra grommeted hole will be
required in the wing inside the strut fairing so the fairing covers the
wire exit. At the bottom, inside the cabin, we will install quick
electrical disconnects and a small moisture collection bottle which will
also provide a place to disconnect the pitot tube. The cabin entry will
be via a grommeted hole in the access cover for the spring gear bolts.
(Elite) A bungee Rebel would most likely need a hole cut. Once again,
the entry will be inside the lower strut fairing for concealment.
Regards,
Rallph Baker

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Sorry...been up in Temagami for the week getting things ready for winter.

I like to use a 1" x 5052 alum tube thru the leading edge ribs...held using
90" bracket tube clamps on every third rib. (1/2" to 5/8" is probably big
enough in reality). One hole drilled thru the root rib to bring it out. Make
sure you ring about 6 rivets around the hole to tie the double root rib
together well where you have drilled the hole.. You can get a few wires in
on each side thru the gap the windshield leaves at the carry thru post and
then hide them behind the headliner piece that covers the back of the
FUS-9s. This area generally gets a good 1/4" thick fill of sealer.....so
there's lots of room for a few wires. I also bring the 1/4" poly pitot line
in here as well. If you have lots of wires in the wing you can also bring
them in thru the fuselage root in the FUS-24 area..then down and around the
door, below it and then up to the panel. On my airplane I have a muliti
prong plug on the wing wires and a receptical in the fuselage root to plug
it in and then the wires run thru a tube under the door area (inside..not
flush on the floor).

I am ABSOLUTELY against running anything inside PVC pipe. Ever seen what it
does when it burns/smoulders away? You'd know why if you'd seen first hand
that one 4' x 4" piece of PVC smouldering in our plastic plant caused over
$250,000 in rust/corrosion damage to everything steel that the smoke
touched! Not to mention the fumes are deadly!

Cheers,
Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: <bransom@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2004 1:08 PM
Subject: wing wiring

Wayne
Looking back through past posts on this subject, I think you stated
preference for not running wires down thru the lift strut. I think you

were

suggesting running through the leading edge section. Is that correct, and

if

so, do you put a hole in the root rib "D" section for getting the wire run

to

the fuselage? I also saw posts recommending flex tubing from auto

parts --

that sounds better than pvc to me, not sure why.
Thanks,
-Ben/ 496R



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No reason for 5052 other than it is more readily available around here than
6061. Get as thin a wall as you can to keep the weight comparable to a
plastic tube and then with the alum you have the piece of mind that if a
wire lets go, in an overload, it will be a none event fire wise.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: <bransom@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 1:28 PM
Subject: Re: wing wiring

Wayne, thanks for the info on this. I put off closing the front section
thinking I might hear from you on this. Instead I worked on the fuel tank
stuff (and got the bulkheads prosealed in -- yeah!) over the wknd. So
anyway, I haven't closed the leading edge section yet and can still put in

a

wire tube. Any particular reason or importance you feel for using 5052
instead of 6061?(which I believe is cheaper and at a local surplus

supplier

for me)

Another follow-up question on the fuel cap thing: Have people put a

retainer

chain on the standard fuel cap? I can see benefitting from having a hand-
hold only to need to go for a swim anyway to find the cap after dropping

it.

(Or, even on wheels, I wouldn't be the first to leave the cap off.)
-Ben






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