The Murphy Builders Site

Thanks Wayne, for the details.

If I'm following your description correctly, your L/R drains are right at the
exterior angle change in the floor. Looking at photos of completed Rebels in
their three-point position, this would appear at first glance to no longer be
the lowest point, as the floor continues to angle downwards towards the tail
in this configuration. However, I can see how careful attention to the angle
at which you bring your lines in from the sides towards the center could
correct for this. I assume you must have also angled the lines from high to
low "within" the floor as well, such that the holes you drill into the channels
get progressively closer to the bottom floor skin as you get closer to the
center. Is this correct?

My personal mission would be to either 1) replicate your line routing to the
center of the aircraft then combine/drain and send a single line forward, or 2)
take each line separately underneath the door sill without any connectors
from the rear window all the way to the foot well, while maintaining an
adequate angle to ensure the low point is in the foot well. Has the latter
ever been done by anyone?

Either way, I am faced with the challenge of routing the 3/8" tubing around
some serious corners. It has been mentioned elsewhere that it is difficult to
push the fuel line through appropriately sized grommets if the angle deviates
significantly from 90 degrees. Ken and others have also suggested hard
plastic "snap-in" grommets with some proseal to lock the line in place. Are
there any lubricants to help make the grommet-job easier? Does everyone
buy a tube bender to avoid crushing in tight corners or is there an effective
alternative?

Thanks!
Rob
Rebel 786



Reading the archives again last night, I
-------- Forwarded Message ---------
Original: DATE..... 4/20/2010 1:23 PM
Original: FROM..... oifa@irishfield.on.ca

Rob.. my recollection is you asked about drilling thru the uprights/fwrd
door posts.. not the bottom carrythru tubes that he control sticks sit on.
No issue sticking a hole thru the Fus 5's.

Protection on the fuel line tubing is easiest by sliding some light plastic
tubing over the fuel line (if you're lucky it comes on long 3/8th bolts from
time to time to protect the threads). If you don't have that and want to
keep the hole sizes to minimum.. . a few neat wraps of electrical tape will
suffice.

On my airplane, I actually come out of the tank strainer with a 90* fitting
and solid tube from there back into the "flaperon gap filler" and then thru
the Fus-24 and down. Tubing then runs on an angle heading forward and
transitioning to the centre of the fuselage at the same time.... with drains
as you say in the low point. They, the low points, actually work as such
when on floats IN THE WATER as well. I didn't go thru the double rear wing
attach fitting with the fuel line for both integrity and safety. If you are
using the sight tubes.. not much choice though.

My fuel valves are were they are because when I'm sweatin and starin out
that windshield, I don't wanna be reaching around behind me to find some
fuel valves.... before the earth comes up and smacks me in the arse..




----- Original Message -----
From: <schaumr@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 4:05 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Rebel Fuel Plumbing Plan

Hi All,

I am contemplating routing the fuel lines through my still-open floor.
There
appear to be two common approaches out there:

1) route each (left/right) line from the wing down behind the door frame,
and
through the various bulkheads directly under the door, finally exiting
through
the pre-drilled gusset holes in the FUS-5 carrythroughs.

2) (a la Wayne) Each tank line runs down the side (behind the door frame)
directly across towards the center of the aircraft to a low-point drain (1
each). Both lines then run up the center to two valves in the floor just
aft of
the carrythroughs, then join to form a single line which travels through
both
FUS-5 carrythroughs near the center of the aircraft, which then continues
on
to the firewall.

Option #2 "seems" easier, as it has nice 90 degree insertions and straight
runs through all the floor channels, (even though it appears to contradict
some recent responses to a question I had earlier this year on drilling
through
the FUS-5s).

I would propose to "simplify" option #2, by retaining the on/off fuel
valves
near the wing root (as per MAM), then bringing each line to the center
low-
point with a drain and combine them into one. From there, I'd do a
straight
shot all the way to the firewall, under the floor (and through the FUS5s).
In
this way, only one inspection port in the floor would be necessary.

How would you protect the fuel line as it crosses the
carrythroughs....Grommets...tubing? Other
thoughts/recommendations/warnings?

Finally, if I were to go through the pre-drilled gusset holes on the
sides, can
anyone comment on how this is done while minimizing hidden AN
connections/fittings?

Much obliged,

Rob



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Sorry Rob... missed this one after 2 days on the road and minimal sleep when
I checked email last night.

No my drains are not at the angle change in the floor. They are about mid
point between the rear door posts and the angle change.. lines run as you
suspect high to low somewhat.. to make the drain the low spot when sitting
three point as a taildragger. You do have to be cautious, as they are no
longer the low point when sitting on amphibs, when on flat ground.. but they
resume being the low point when the airplane is floating on the water. I'll
try to find some pictures... or will go and take one of the belly to show
where they ended up on mine. I think I have some pictures during the build..
but will have to scan them into the computer... since my floor was closed up
sometime in 1994!

Spit.. is a great lubricant in the grommets! ;O) ... or soapy water.

The lever style tube bender works great.

http://www.carairconditioningsupplies.c ... id=41&js=n

or if into a real tight spot the slide over spring can work okay.

Wayne

----- Original Message -----
From: <schaumr@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 9:34 AM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Rebel Fuel Plumbing Plan


[quote]Thanks Wayne, for the details.

If I'm following your description correctly, your L/R drains are right at
the
exterior angle change in the floor. Looking at photos of completed Rebels
in
their three-point position, this would appear at first glance to no longer
be
the lowest point, as the floor continues to angle downwards towards the
tail
in this configuration. However, I can see how careful attention to the
angle
at which you bring your lines in from the sides towards the center could
correct for this. I assume you must have also angled the lines from high
to
low "within" the floor as well, such that the holes you drill into the
channels
get progressively closer to the bottom floor skin as you get closer to the
center. Is this correct?

My personal mission would be to either 1) replicate your line routing to
the
center of the aircraft then combine/drain and send a single line forward,
or 2)
take each line separately underneath the door sill without any connectors
from the rear window all the way to the foot well, while maintaining an
adequate angle to ensure the low point is in the foot well. Has the
latter
ever been done by anyone?

Either way, I am faced with the challenge of routing the 3/8" tubing
around
some serious corners. It has been mentioned elsewhere that it is
difficult to
push the fuel line through appropriately sized grommets if the angle
deviates
significantly from 90 degrees. Ken and others have also suggested hard
plastic "snap-in" grommets with some proseal to lock the line in place.
Are
there any lubricants to help make the grommet-job easier? Does everyone
buy a tube bender to avoid crushing in tight corners or is there an
effective
alternative?

Thanks!
Rob
Rebel 786



Reading the archives again last night, I
-------- Forwarded Message ---------
Original: DATE..... 4/20/2010 1:23 PM
Original: FROM..... oifa@irishfield.on.ca

Thanks Wayne,

No need for a picture now, your descripion of the drain location is adequate.

Rob

On 4/23/2010 6:14 PM, oifa@irishfield.on.ca wrote to rebel-builders:

-> Sorry Rob... missed this one after 2 days on the road and minimal sleep
when
-> I checked email last night.
->
-> No my drains are not at the angle change in the floor. They are about mid
-> point between the rear door posts and the angle change.. lines run as you
-> suspect high to low somewhat.. to make the drain the low spot when
sitting
-> three point as a taildragger. You do have to be cautious, as they are no
-> longer the low point when sitting on amphibs, when on flat ground.. but
they
-> resume being the low point when the airplane is floating on the water. I'll
-> try to find some pictures... or will go and take one of the belly to show
-> where they ended up on mine. I think I have some pictures during the
build..
-> but will have to scan them into the computer... since my floor was closed
up
-> sometime in 1994!
->
-> Spit.. is a great lubricant in the grommets! ;O) ... or soapy water.
->
-> The lever style tube bender works great.
->
-> http://www.carairconditioningsupplies.c ... roduct.php?
productid=41&js=n
->
-> or if into a real tight spot the slide over spring can work okay.
->
-> Wayne
->
-> ----- Original Message -----
-> From: <schaumr@dcsol.com>
-> To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
-> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 9:34 AM
-> Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Rebel Fuel Plumbing Plan
->
->
-> > Thanks Wayne, for the details.
-> >
-> > If I'm following your description correctly, your L/R drains are right at
-> > the
-> > exterior angle change in the floor. Looking at photos of completed
Rebels
-> > in
-> > their three-point position, this would appear at first glance to no longer
-> > be
-> > the lowest point, as the floor continues to angle downwards towards
the
-> > tail
-> > in this configuration. However, I can see how careful attention to the
-> > angle
-> > at which you bring your lines in from the sides towards the center could
-> > correct for this. I assume you must have also angled the lines from high
-> > to
-> > low "within" the floor as well, such that the holes you drill into the
-> > channels
-> > get progressively closer to the bottom floor skin as you get closer to the
-> > center. Is this correct?
-> >
-> > My personal mission would be to either 1) replicate your line routing to
-> > the
-> > center of the aircraft then combine/drain and send a single line forward,
-> > or 2)
-> > take each line separately underneath the door sill without any
connectors
-> > from the rear window all the way to the foot well, while maintaining an
-> > adequate angle to ensure the low point is in the foot well. Has the
-> > latter
-> > ever been done by anyone?
-> >
-> > Either way, I am faced with the challenge of routing the 3/8" tubing
-> > around
-> > some serious corners. It has been mentioned elsewhere that it is
-> > difficult to
-> > push the fuel line through appropriately sized grommets if the angle
-> > deviates
-> > significantly from 90 degrees. Ken and others have also suggested hard
-> > plastic "snap-in" grommets with some proseal to lock the line in place.
-> > Are
-> > there any lubricants to help make the grommet-job easier? Does
everyone
-> > buy a tube bender to avoid crushing in tight corners or is there an
-> > effective
-> > alternative?
-> >
-> > Thanks!
-> > Rob
-> > Rebel 786
-> >
-> >
-> >
-> > Reading the archives again last night, I
-> > -------- Forwarded Message ---------
-> > Original: DATE..... 4/20/2010 1:23 PM
-> > Original: FROM..... oifa@irishfield.on.ca