The Murphy Builders Site

To all who responded to my post.
What I was talking about is angle of attack.
Wayne of course your correct, 3* over the length of the wing cord
would be rendundant. In my haste I neglected to put a period in front
of the 3, it should have been POINT 3* which gives the R. wing about
3/16" more angle of attack. I had a similar situation with my Meranda
and it wanted to turn left until I fixed it. And as you said farings
cover a lot of mistakes.

I like the idea of the eccentric bushing rather then trim tabs. Drill an
over sized hole get a piece of aluminum rod that size and drill an off
set hole in it. Easy fix right? Getter done!

As long as I have everyones attention I have a question about the
neutral position for the flaperons. Using the sheet of paper with the
various angles, that is supplied in the manual and glued to card
board, it would seem that the 0* line should be neutral position
because the trailing edge of the flaperon is even with the top of the
fuselage. However, I read in a post sometime back
where it was indicated that the front portion of the flap, the flat
portion, should be parallel with the bottom of the wing thus putting
the trailing edge up at a 5* angle. It would seem to me that this would be
better as a cruise position? And also would be hard to make a faring fit.

Thanks to everyone:
Keith Pierson


On 3/30/2010 7:36 AM, kpierson wrote to Rebel builders:

-> This might be a good lesson for new builders.
-> I am the third owner/ builder of a not yet completed Rebel kit, and
-> as such I have found a few things that I felt needed to be corrected
-> one such discrepancy was two of the five bolts that hold the lift
-> strut attachment brackets to the spar, these five bolts were all the
-> same length and the original builder had installed two 1/16" washers
-> on each bolt one under the head, and one under the nut, this was
-> OK for the top three, however, the bottom two must penetrate
-> thicker material so this left no thread exposed beyond the nut. I
-> simply removed the two thick washers and installed one thin one
-> under the nut. Easy fix!
->
-> More recently while trying to adjust the control system I was unable
-> to get the flaperons to opperate correctly, no matter what I did
-> the right one would allways go down too far but would not go up far
-> enough. After much cussing and hair pulling I decided to take some
-> measurements and found the R. wing is angled up 3* more then the
-> left, however, but it matches the profile of the fuselage perfectly.
-> As it turns out the fuselage is the culprit, I can only assume that
-> the original builder did not square it up before riveting it together.
-> Woe is me NOT AN EASY FIX? Trim tabs I guess?
->
-> Keith P. 318R




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To all who responded to my post.
What I was talking about is angle of attack.
Wayne of course your correct, 3* over the length of the wing cord
would be rendundant. In my haste I neglected to put a period in front
of the 3, it should have been POINT 3* which gives the R. wing about
3/16" more angle of attack. I had a similar situation with my Meranda
and it wanted to turn left until I fixed it. And as you said farings
cover a lot of mistakes.

I like the idea of the eccentric bushing rather then trim tabs. Drill an
over sized hole get a piece of aluminum rod that size and drill an off
set hole in it. Easy fix right? Getter done!

As long as I have everyones attention I have a question about the
neutral position for the flaperons. Using the sheet of paper with the
various angles, that is supplied in the manual and glued to card
board, it would seem that the 0* line should be neutral position
because the trailing edge of the flaperon is even with the top of the
fuselage. However, I read in a post sometime back
where it was indicated that the front portion of the flap, the flat
portion, should be parallel with the bottom of the wing thus putting
the trailing edge up at a 5* angle. It would seem to me that this would
be
better as a cruise position? And also would be hard to make a faring fit.

Thanks to everyone:
Keith Pierson


On 3/30/2010 7:36 AM, kpierson wrote to Rebel builders:

-> This might be a good lesson for new builders.
-> I am the third owner/ builder of a not yet completed Rebel kit, and
-> as such I have found a few things that I felt needed to be corrected
-> one such discrepancy was two of the five bolts that hold the lift
-> strut attachment brackets to the spar, these five bolts were all the
-> same length and the original builder had installed two 1/16" washers
-> on each bolt one under the head, and one under the nut, this was
-> OK for the top three, however, the bottom two must penetrate
-> thicker material so this left no thread exposed beyond the nut. I
-> simply removed the two thick washers and installed one thin one
-> under the nut. Easy fix!
->
-> More recently while trying to adjust the control system I was unable
-> to get the flaperons to opperate correctly, no matter what I did
-> the right one would allways go down too far but would not go up far
-> enough. After much cussing and hair pulling I decided to take some
-> measurements and found the R. wing is angled up 3* more then the
-> left, however, but it matches the profile of the fuselage perfectly.
-> As it turns out the fuselage is the culprit, I can only assume that
-> the original builder did not square it up before riveting it together.
-> Woe is me NOT AN EASY FIX? Trim tabs I guess?
->
-> Keith P. 318R




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Thank god for that! Now remember when you put the bolts in thru the
eccentric bushing to use Penny washers on the outside of the carrythru
gusset.. to retain said bushings.


----- Original Message -----
From: <kpierson@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:17 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

To all who responded to my post.
What I was talking about is angle of attack.
Wayne of course your correct, 3* over the length of the wing cord
would be rendundant. In my haste I neglected to put a period in front
of the 3, it should have been POINT 3* which gives the R. wing about
3/16" more angle of attack. I had a similar situation with my Meranda
and it wanted to turn left until I fixed it. And as you said farings
cover a lot of mistakes.

I like the idea of the eccentric bushing rather then trim tabs.
Drill an
over sized hole get a piece of aluminum rod that size and drill an
off
set hole in it. Easy fix right? Getter done!

As long as I have everyones attention I have a question about the
neutral position for the flaperons. Using the sheet of paper with the
various angles, that is supplied in the manual and glued to card
board, it would seem that the 0* line should be neutral position
because the trailing edge of the flaperon is even with the top of the
fuselage. However, I read in a post sometime back
where it was indicated that the front portion of the flap, the flat
portion, should be parallel with the bottom of the wing thus putting
the trailing edge up at a 5* angle. It would seem to me that this
would
be
better as a cruise position? And also would be hard to make a
faring fit.

Thanks to everyone:
Keith Pierson


On 3/30/2010 7:36 AM, kpierson wrote to Rebel builders:

-> This might be a good lesson for new builders.
-> I am the third owner/ builder of a not yet completed Rebel kit,
and
-> as such I have found a few things that I felt needed to be
corrected
-> one such discrepancy was two of the five bolts that hold the lift
-> strut attachment brackets to the spar, these five bolts were
all the
-> same length and the original builder had installed two 1/16"
washers
-> on each bolt one under the head, and one under the nut, this was
-> OK for the top three, however, the bottom two must penetrate
-> thicker material so this left no thread exposed beyond the nut. I
-> simply removed the two thick washers and installed one thin one
-> under the nut. Easy fix!
->
-> More recently while trying to adjust the control system I was
unable
-> to get the flaperons to opperate correctly, no matter what I did
-> the right one would allways go down too far but would not go up
far
-> enough. After much cussing and hair pulling I decided to take some
-> measurements and found the R. wing is angled up 3* more then the
-> left, however, but it matches the profile of the fuselage
perfectly.
-> As it turns out the fuselage is the culprit, I can only assume
that
-> the original builder did not square it up before riveting it
together.
-> Woe is me NOT AN EASY FIX? Trim tabs I guess?
->
-> Keith P. 318R




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-----------------------------------------------------------------

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What prevents the eccentric bushing from turning after the wing is
correctly aligned?
Roger Cole
Murphy Elite #709
rcole927@earthlink.net



On Mar 31, 2010, at 4:41 PM, Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

Thank god for that! Now remember when you put the bolts in thru the
eccentric bushing to use Penny washers on the outside of the carrythru
gusset.. to retain said bushings.


----- Original Message -----
From: <kpierson@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:17 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

To all who responded to my post.
What I was talking about is angle of attack.
Wayne of course your correct, 3* over the length of the wing cord
would be rendundant. In my haste I neglected to put a period in front
of the 3, it should have been POINT 3* which gives the R. wing about
3/16" more angle of attack. I had a similar situation with my Meranda
and it wanted to turn left until I fixed it. And as you said farings
cover a lot of mistakes.

I like the idea of the eccentric bushing rather then trim tabs.
Drill an
over sized hole get a piece of aluminum rod that size and drill an
off
set hole in it. Easy fix right? Getter done!

As long as I have everyones attention I have a question about the
neutral position for the flaperons. Using the sheet of paper with the
various angles, that is supplied in the manual and glued to card
board, it would seem that the 0* line should be neutral position
because the trailing edge of the flaperon is even with the top of the
fuselage. However, I read in a post sometime back
where it was indicated that the front portion of the flap, the flat
portion, should be parallel with the bottom of the wing thus putting
the trailing edge up at a 5* angle. It would seem to me that this
would
be
better as a cruise position? And also would be hard to make a
faring fit.

Thanks to everyone:
Keith Pierson


On 3/30/2010 7:36 AM, kpierson wrote to Rebel builders:

-> This might be a good lesson for new builders.
-> I am the third owner/ builder of a not yet completed Rebel kit,
and
-> as such I have found a few things that I felt needed to be
corrected
-> one such discrepancy was two of the five bolts that hold the lift
-> strut attachment brackets to the spar, these five bolts were
all the
-> same length and the original builder had installed two 1/16"
washers
-> on each bolt one under the head, and one under the nut, this was
-> OK for the top three, however, the bottom two must penetrate
-> thicker material so this left no thread exposed beyond the nut. I
-> simply removed the two thick washers and installed one thin one
-> under the nut. Easy fix!
->
-> More recently while trying to adjust the control system I was
unable
-> to get the flaperons to opperate correctly, no matter what I did
-> the right one would allways go down too far but would not go up
far
-> enough. After much cussing and hair pulling I decided to take some
-> measurements and found the R. wing is angled up 3* more then the
-> left, however, but it matches the profile of the fuselage
perfectly.
-> As it turns out the fuselage is the culprit, I can only assume
that
-> the original builder did not square it up before riveting it
together.
-> Woe is me NOT AN EASY FIX? Trim tabs I guess?
->
-> Keith P. 318R




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-----------------------------------------------------------------

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Good point Roger and I thought of that while typing the message. Haven't
come up with a good thought for it, other than I don't think Cessnas
eccentric bushings are retained by anything other than the tightened
attach
bolt. On a Cessna.. if I'm not mistaken.. you loosen the attach bolt and
turn the eccentric with a wrench to where you want it and retighten the
attach bolt.

Dick... you're the guy with all the Cessna maintenance years.. is that
correct???

Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Cole" <rcole927@earthlink.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:37 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

What prevents the eccentric bushing from turning after the wing is
correctly aligned?
Roger Cole
Murphy Elite #709
rcole927@earthlink.net



On Mar 31, 2010, at 4:41 PM, Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

Thank god for that! Now remember when you put the bolts in thru the
eccentric bushing to use Penny washers on the outside of the carrythru
gusset.. to retain said bushings.


----- Original Message -----
From: <kpierson@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:17 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!




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Just checked a Cessna wing manual.. and the eccentrics are held in place
by
the tight attach bolt. Nothing else. Rigging directions are...loosen the
attach bolt nut.. turn the bushings...tighten the nut.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:54 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

Good point Roger and I thought of that while typing the message. Haven't
come up with a good thought for it, other than I don't think Cessnas
eccentric bushings are retained by anything other than the tightened
attach
bolt. On a Cessna.. if I'm not mistaken.. you loosen the attach bolt and
turn the eccentric with a wrench to where you want it and retighten the
attach bolt.

Dick... you're the guy with all the Cessna maintenance years.. is that
correct???

Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Cole" <rcole927@earthlink.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:37 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

What prevents the eccentric bushing from turning after the wing is
correctly aligned?
Roger Cole
Murphy Elite #709
rcole927@earthlink.net



On Mar 31, 2010, at 4:41 PM, Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:



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are the Cessna eccentric bushings the correct size to use on the Rebel??


----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:36 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

Just checked a Cessna wing manual.. and the eccentrics are held in place
by
the tight attach bolt. Nothing else. Rigging directions are...loosen the
attach bolt nut.. turn the bushings...tighten the nut.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:54 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

Good point Roger and I thought of that while typing the message. Haven't
come up with a good thought for it, other than I don't think Cessnas
eccentric bushings are retained by anything other than the tightened
attach
bolt. On a Cessna.. if I'm not mistaken.. you loosen the attach bolt and
turn the eccentric with a wrench to where you want it and retighten the
attach bolt.

Dick... you're the guy with all the Cessna maintenance years.. is that
correct???

Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Cole" <rcole927@earthlink.net>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:37 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!




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What prevents the eccentric bushing from turning after the wing is
correctly aligned? Roger Cole
Murphy Elite #709
rcole927@earthlink.net



On Mar 31, 2010, at 4:41 PM, Wayne G. O'Shea wrote:

Thank god for that! Now remember when you put the bolts in thru the
eccentric bushing to use Penny washers on the outside of the
carrythru gusset.. to retain said bushings.


----- Original Message -----
From: <kpierson@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:17 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] RE: Woe is me!

To all who responded to my post.
What I was talking about is angle of attack.
Wayne of course your correct, 3* over the length of the wing cord
would be rendundant. In my haste I neglected to put a period in
front of the 3, it should have been POINT 3* which gives the R. wing
about 3/16" more angle of attack. I had a similar situation with my
Meranda and it wanted to turn left until I fixed it. And as you said
farings cover a lot of mistakes.

I like the idea of the eccentric bushing rather then trim tabs.
Drill an over sized hole get a piece of aluminum rod that size and
drill an off
set hole in it. Easy fix right? Getter done!

As long as I have everyones attention I have a question about the
neutral position for the flaperons. Using the sheet of paper with
the various angles, that is supplied in the manual and glued to card
board, it would seem that the 0* line should be neutral position
because the trailing edge of the flaperon is even with the top of
the fuselage. However, I read in a post sometime back where it was
indicated that the front portion of the flap, the flat portion,
should be parallel with the bottom of the wing thus putting the
trailing edge up at a 5* angle. It would seem to me that this would
be
better as a cruise position? And also would be hard to make a
faring fit.

Thanks to everyone:
Keith Pierson


On 3/30/2010 7:36 AM, kpierson wrote to Rebel builders:

-> This might be a good lesson for new builders.
-> I am the third owner/ builder of a not yet completed Rebel kit,
and
-> as such I have found a few things that I felt needed to be
corrected
-> one such discrepancy was two of the five bolts that hold the lift
-> strut attachment brackets to the spar, these five bolts were
all the
-> same length and the original builder had installed two 1/16"
washers
-> on each bolt one under the head, and one under the nut, this was
-> OK for the top three, however, the bottom two must penetrate
-> thicker material so this left no thread exposed beyond the nut. I
-> simply removed the two thick washers and installed one thin one
-> under the nut. Easy fix!
->
-> More recently while trying to adjust the control system I was
unable
-> to get the flaperons to opperate correctly, no matter what I did
-> the right one would allways go down too far but would not go up
far
-> enough. After much cussing and hair pulling I decided to take
-> some measurements and found the R. wing is angled up 3* more then
-> the left, however, but it matches the profile of the fuselage
perfectly.
-> As it turns out the fuselage is the culprit, I can only assume
that
-> the original builder did not square it up before riveting it
together.
-> Woe is me NOT AN EASY FIX? Trim tabs I guess?
->
-> Keith P. 318R




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