The Murphy Builders Site

Welcome to the list Thomas

Sorry I can't help with what you are asking, but I'm sure someone will be
able to.

Nigel
745E
England

-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Thomas
Sent: 03 September 2009 21:23
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] Main Spar Doubler W-603 vs. W-134

Hello list,

first of all a welcome from Germany. Since April, when I purchased a
nearly untouched older rebel kit, I am enjoying the experience sharing
on this list.

I just started building the wings. I have two versions of manuals
available ('94 and '97) and experienced a difference in the main spar
doubler. The older manual shows W-134 (to be made from raw 0.032) the
newer one refers to W-603. W-134 is smaller and uses two rows of rivets
less. I couldn't find a bulletin or manual update which refers to this.
Since the former owner of the kit already sized the raw material to
W-134 I am questioning whether I can use this, or the newer size of
W-603 should be used. Any suggestions or help is appreciated.

BTW: If anybody from Germany is on this list, I'd be happy to get in
contact.

Thomas, 433R



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Hallo Thomas!

I am building 778 and in my manual the spar doubler was named W 134. If you
follow the manual dimensions you will find that there is not enough edge
distance left on the doubler. Somewhere on the old website a document that
was called "quick response notes" ( I think) mentioned to oversize this
doubler in order to avoid this. Sorry don't know the new recommended size,
but I would assume it doesn't really matter as long as you be aware of the
minimum edge distance.
You will find this mentioned already somewhere in the archives.
Don't know about any new builders in Germany. I started 778 a few years ago
in Austria and moved to " Rebel-land" this spring where I hope to complete
her in a few years down there the road.
There is a builder in Italy-- Hi Francesco!!!!!-- he might have the contact
data of at least two other already flying Rebels in Germany. We had a
get-together at the Aero in EDNY a few years ago - big time fun -
Where about are you in Germany?

happy deburring


Dieter Oberbichler
Wellsley, Ontario

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas" <rebel@tbreitbach.de>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 4:22 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Main Spar Doubler W-603 vs. W-134

Hello list,

first of all a welcome from Germany. Since April, when I purchased a
nearly untouched older rebel kit, I am enjoying the experience sharing
on this list.

I just started building the wings. I have two versions of manuals
available ('94 and '97) and experienced a difference in the main spar
doubler. The older manual shows W-134 (to be made from raw 0.032) the
newer one refers to W-603. W-134 is smaller and uses two rows of rivets
less. I couldn't find a bulletin or manual update which refers to this.
Since the former owner of the kit already sized the raw material to
W-134 I am questioning whether I can use this, or the newer size of
W-603 should be used. Any suggestions or help is appreciated.

BTW: If anybody from Germany is on this list, I'd be happy to get in
contact.

Thomas, 433R

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas" <rebel@tbreitbach.de>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 4:22 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Main Spar Doubler W-603 vs. W-134

Hello list,

first of all a welcome from Germany. Since April, when I purchased a
nearly untouched older rebel kit, I am enjoying the experience sharing
on this list.

I just started building the wings. I have two versions of manuals
available ('94 and '97) and experienced a difference in the main spar
doubler. The older manual shows W-134 (to be made from raw 0.032) the
newer one refers to W-603. W-134 is smaller and uses two rows of rivets
less. I couldn't find a bulletin or manual update which refers to this.
Since the former owner of the kit already sized the raw material to
W-134 I am questioning whether I can use this, or the newer size of
W-603 should be used. Any suggestions or help is appreciated.

BTW: If anybody from Germany is on this list, I'd be happy to get in
contact.

Thomas, 433R



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First I've heard about that change Thomas. I believe I have all the
bulletins but there was never mention of this and it was not part of the
original 1650 lb upgrade. So if you did not look at a newer manual you
would not know about this and MAM suggested that I not look at a newer
manual as it would just cause some confusion. I suspect that some of
these types of changes were likely made for parts commonality after the
Elite was marketed and they are not necessary for a Rebel. That is just
a guess but there are lots of Rebels with the W-134 and I've never heard
of a problem in that area. Anybody??
Ken

Thomas wrote:

Hello list,

first of all a welcome from Germany. Since April, when I purchased a
nearly untouched older rebel kit, I am enjoying the experience sharing
on this list.

I just started building the wings. I have two versions of manuals
available ('94 and '97) and experienced a difference in the main spar
doubler. The older manual shows W-134 (to be made from raw 0.032) the
newer one refers to W-603. W-134 is smaller and uses two rows of rivets
less. I couldn't find a bulletin or manual update which refers to this.
Since the former owner of the kit already sized the raw material to
W-134 I am questioning whether I can use this, or the newer size of
W-603 should be used. Any suggestions or help is appreciated.

BTW: If anybody from Germany is on this list, I'd be happy to get in
contact.

Thomas, 433R

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Glad to hear these confirmations coming in as mine is W-134 (single rivet
rows). I believe I missed worrying about this when I built mine, even though I
had the same two manuals you mention Thomas. I found myself mostly using
the 94 manual for the wings,with checks to the 98 manual and posted
bulletins.
http://mae.ucdavis.edu/ransom/Murphy/E% ... ose%20last%
20pics/PB170053.JPG
-Ben



On 9/3/2009 1:55 PM, klehman@albedo.net wrote to rebel-builders:

First I've heard about that change Thomas. I believe I have all the
bulletins but there was never mention of this and it was not part of the
original 1650 lb upgrade. So if you did not look at a newer manual you
would not know about this and MAM suggested that I not look at a newer
manual as it would just cause some confusion. I suspect that some of
these types of changes were likely made for parts commonality after the
Elite was marketed and they are not necessary for a Rebel. That is just
a guess but there are lots of Rebels with the W-134 and I've never heard
of a problem in that area. Anybody??
Ken

Thomas wrote:

Hello list,

first of all a welcome from Germany. Since April, when I purchased a
nearly untouched older rebel kit, I am enjoying the experience sharing
on this list.

I just started building the wings. I have two versions of manuals
available ('94 and '97) and experienced a difference in the main spar
doubler. The older manual shows W-134 (to be made from raw 0.032) the
newer one refers to W-603. W-134 is smaller and uses two rows of rivets
less. I couldn't find a bulletin or manual update which refers to this.
Since the former owner of the kit already sized the raw material to
W-134 I am questioning whether I can use this, or the newer size of
W-603 should be used. Any suggestions or help is appreciated.

BTW: If anybody from Germany is on this list, I'd be happy to get in
contact.

Thomas, 433R

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Welcome to the list!

That's funny about MAM; they suggested I buy the latest manual because it
would cover everything that had changed since my manual was printed (1992).
Now, I generally go back and forth between #207's original and the newer one
dated 2001 ($400). On the bright side, it also included a CD ROM version
which is usually clearer, cleaner, and is in color.

Regarding #603, my old manual listed #134 too and Jeff at MAM was nice
enough to send me the CAD drawing for #603 which I used to make mine. I'd
reccomend the newer manual based on what I've gotten out of mine.

Almost through with the gear on #207. She'll be on wheels within two weeks!
Craig




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SORRY - I messed up
my reply related to W-133 which is the aileron hinge backing plate on the
REAR spar.

My main spar doublers are indeed named W 603 and bigger than the one showed
in Bens picture. In the newer kits it comes as a predrilled part.

Sorry again for adding to the confusion.

Dieter
778 R
Wellesley,ONT






----- Original Message -----
From: "Dieter Oberbichler" <d.oberbichler@rogers.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:48 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] Main Spar Doubler W-603 vs. W-134

Hallo Thomas!

I am building 778 and in my manual the spar doubler was named W 134. If
you
follow the manual dimensions you will find that there is not enough edge
distance left on the doubler. Somewhere on the old website a document that
was called "quick response notes" ( I think) mentioned to oversize this
doubler in order to avoid this. Sorry don't know the new recommended size,
but I would assume it doesn't really matter as long as you be aware of the
minimum edge distance.
You will find this mentioned already somewhere in the archives.
Don't know about any new builders in Germany. I started 778 a few years
ago
in Austria and moved to " Rebel-land" this spring where I hope to complete
her in a few years down there the road.
There is a builder in Italy-- Hi Francesco!!!!!-- he might have the
contact
data of at least two other already flying Rebels in Germany. We had a
get-together at the Aero in EDNY a few years ago - big time fun -
Where about are you in Germany?

happy deburring


Dieter Oberbichler
Wellsley, Ontario

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas" <rebel@tbreitbach.de>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 4:22 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Main Spar Doubler W-603 vs. W-134

Hello list,

first of all a welcome from Germany. Since April, when I purchased a
nearly untouched older rebel kit, I am enjoying the experience sharing
on this list.

I just started building the wings. I have two versions of manuals
available ('94 and '97) and experienced a difference in the main spar
doubler. The older manual shows W-134 (to be made from raw 0.032) the
newer one refers to W-603. W-134 is smaller and uses two rows of rivets
less. I couldn't find a bulletin or manual update which refers to this.
Since the former owner of the kit already sized the raw material to
W-134 I am questioning whether I can use this, or the newer size of
W-603 should be used. Any suggestions or help is appreciated.

BTW: If anybody from Germany is on this list, I'd be happy to get in
contact.

Thomas, 433R

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas" <rebel@tbreitbach.de>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 4:22 PM
Subject: [rebel-builders] Main Spar Doubler W-603 vs. W-134

Hello list,

first of all a welcome from Germany. Since April, when I purchased a
nearly untouched older rebel kit, I am enjoying the experience sharing
on this list.

I just started building the wings. I have two versions of manuals
available ('94 and '97) and experienced a difference in the main spar
doubler. The older manual shows W-134 (to be made from raw 0.032) the
newer one refers to W-603. W-134 is smaller and uses two rows of rivets
less. I couldn't find a bulletin or manual update which refers to this.
Since the former owner of the kit already sized the raw material to
W-134 I am questioning whether I can use this, or the newer size of
W-603 should be used. Any suggestions or help is appreciated.

BTW: If anybody from Germany is on this list, I'd be happy to get in
contact.

Thomas, 433R



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