[rebel-builders] MDRA Inspection 295R

[steve whitenect]

Hi John
On number two: ask for his supporting documentation or where this is in CARS or any other other manuel. They are allowing the importing of certified aircraft with no outside door activation available. How about the Cessna 206 with the rear door problems. Can't open it with the flaps down. Great when on floats. How stupid. Some of the inspectors go to a course and a topic that makes a little sence comes up and they run with it as if it was gospel and thousands of lives will be saved. Placard the window "rip off in case of emergency" which can be done from any upper corner. Can u tell that this a "pet peeve" of mine!!!

Steve W.
_________________________________________________________________
Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon!
http://puzzles.sympatico.msn.ca/chickti ... id=htmlsig



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[Jim Cole]

Hi John - again with number 2, we put a little bend in the top of the door
hinge pin and then put a small sign that says "In Case of Emergency pull
pin". Some guys then put the tab inside (between the door post and the door)
after the inspection so that someone at the local airport doesn't decide to
pull the pin in order to borrow your GPS or anything else of value!

Cheers
Jim 333R


On 12/20/2007 1:41 PM, "John Peterson" <johnspeterson@rogers.com> wrote:

Hello everyone
Well we had an inspection from MDRA and interestingly enough there were a
few questions that we could not answer.

1. What are the flight control travel positions for the a/c on amphibs??
Apparently ours are different than the Murphy manual - not sure what either of
those travel positions are - Any help here is appreciated.

2. Is an exterior control required on the doors, with instructions on the
opening?
We have the split door with the top folding down. There is no external
opening device and I believe that I have seen others like that. The concern
expressed was how would a person get into the a/c from the outside if a pilot
was inside and not able to open the door/window.

3.Where and how many drain holes are required for the fuselage, wings and
flight controls??
We picked up that the a/c does not have drain holes in the rear fuselage,
could be important being on floats/amphibs. Not sure about the wing and flight
control drains but does anyone know how we could accomplish this.

It was requested if we could provide some kind of supporting documentation
for these issues, ideally directly from murphy.

Appreciate assistance on this.
John Peterson 295R





John Peterson


John Peterson



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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

Ditto to what Jim said. I had mine all labelled up For "rescue" pull pin....
instead of Emergency... and was asked to change it because someone may not
undertand what rescue meant! $*(#$@(&&$$##
I'd go with Steve's suggestion... for emergency extraction rip door off !

If you follow the manual there isn't (or at least wasn't) any mention of
drain holes... but it is in Chapter 549. Good idea on the uphill side of
each bulkhead. Also should be some on the rear lower skin of the wings/stab
and anywhere else that you can't claim it will drain itself.

What control travel are you referring to?

#4 sure glad we imported Bob's Elite with TC instead of MDRA ! ;O)



----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Cole" <jcole@rangroup.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2007 5:30 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] MDRA Inspection 295R

Hi John - again with number 2, we put a little bend in the top of the door
hinge pin and then put a small sign that says "In Case of Emergency pull
pin". Some guys then put the tab inside (between the door post and the
door)
after the inspection so that someone at the local airport doesn't decide
to
pull the pin in order to borrow your GPS or anything else of value!

Cheers
Jim 333R


On 12/20/2007 1:41 PM, "John Peterson" <johnspeterson@rogers.com> wrote:

Hello everyone
Well we had an inspection from MDRA and interestingly enough there were
a
few questions that we could not answer.

1. What are the flight control travel positions for the a/c on
amphibs??
Apparently ours are different than the Murphy manual - not sure what
either of
those travel positions are - Any help here is appreciated.

2. Is an exterior control required on the doors, with instructions on
the
opening?
We have the split door with the top folding down. There is no external
opening device and I believe that I have seen others like that. The
concern
expressed was how would a person get into the a/c from the outside if a
pilot
was inside and not able to open the door/window.

3.Where and how many drain holes are required for the fuselage, wings
and
flight controls??
We picked up that the a/c does not have drain holes in the rear
fuselage,
could be important being on floats/amphibs. Not sure about the wing and
flight
control drains but does anyone know how we could accomplish this.

It was requested if we could provide some kind of supporting
documentation
for these issues, ideally directly from murphy.

Appreciate assistance on this.
John Peterson 295R





John Peterson


John Peterson



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[John Peterson]

Thanks Wayne,Jim, Steve
What the inspector said was that if that is how the door is built, he wanted something from Murphy saying that it is acceptable and I agree that the "rip door of" or "pull pin" will probably do the trick.

With regard to the controls, he was looking at the generic manual - whatever that is and said that the aileron travel should be 15 degrees up and 20 degrees down. According to his measurements, ours was 9 degrees up and 9 degrees down.
With the elevator, he thinks it is to be 25 degrees up and 25 degrees down and ours is 13 down and 33 up.
If ours is correct he is okay with that but needs some paperwork to confirm that to be correct.

Also on the drain holes, should they be put in the flapersons?? Apparently it can be done with a pencil soldering iron and not affect the skin.


"Wayne G. O'Shea" <oifa@irishfield.on.ca> wrote:
Ditto to what Jim said. I had mine all labelled up For "rescue" pull pin....
instead of Emergency... and was asked to change it because someone may not
undertand what rescue meant! $*(#$@(&&$$##
I'd go with Steve's suggestion... for emergency extraction rip door off !

If you follow the manual there isn't (or at least wasn't) any mention of
drain holes... but it is in Chapter 549. Good idea on the uphill side of
each bulkhead. Also should be some on the rear lower skin of the wings/stab
and anywhere else that you can't claim it will drain itself.

What control travel are you referring to?

#4 sure glad we imported Bob's Elite with TC instead of MDRA ! ;O)



----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Cole"
To:
Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2007 5:30 PM
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] MDRA Inspection 295R

Hi John - again with number 2, we put a little bend in the top of the door
hinge pin and then put a small sign that says "In Case of Emergency pull
pin". Some guys then put the tab inside (between the door post and the
door)
after the inspection so that someone at the local airport doesn't decide
to
pull the pin in order to borrow your GPS or anything else of value!

Cheers
Jim 333R


On 12/20/2007 1:41 PM, "John Peterson" wrote:

Hello everyone
Well we had an inspection from MDRA and interestingly enough there were
a
few questions that we could not answer.

1. What are the flight control travel positions for the a/c on
amphibs??
Apparently ours are different than the Murphy manual - not sure what
either of
those travel positions are - Any help here is appreciated.

2. Is an exterior control required on the doors, with instructions on
the
opening?
We have the split door with the top folding down. There is no external
opening device and I believe that I have seen others like that. The
concern
expressed was how would a person get into the a/c from the outside if a
pilot
was inside and not able to open the door/window.

3.Where and how many drain holes are required for the fuselage, wings
and
flight controls??
We picked up that the a/c does not have drain holes in the rear
fuselage,
could be important being on floats/amphibs. Not sure about the wing and
flight
control drains but does anyone know how we could accomplish this.

It was requested if we could provide some kind of supporting
documentation
for these issues, ideally directly from murphy.

Appreciate assistance on this.
John Peterson 295R





John Peterson


John Peterson



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John Peterson



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[Ken]

FWIW my MDRA inspector was very competent and:

1. He didn't care what the numbers were, he just had to fill in the
blanks with something on the inspection form. He asked for the actual
numbers if I knew them NOT what the manual might or might not recommend.
He did comment that it was unusual to see no differential aileron
movement and I mentioned that it is actually opposite to differential
movement (if anything) due to flaperons. ie more downward deflection
than upward deflection. No problem. OTOH I'm sure he would have
questioned further if he had reason to suspect insufficient movement. As
Bob said there is more than one design for each of the 3 bellcranks and
also for the rudder horns, and for the control sticks on Rebels and I
have samples or specs to prove that.

2. I had a knob on both sides to unlock the top window and no labeling
and no removable door pin and it was no problem. I was prepared to flip
out the door pin though as others have described in case the inspector
wanted something like that. The little clip thing that holds the window
open is the opening handle as far as I'm concerned ;) I searched but
found no written requirements for this issue. In practice I do use the
"knob" that I have on the inside top of the window and would never be
able to close the window in flight without something substantial to grab
as that takes a fair pull.

3. I put fuselage drain holes in. I put one seaplane drain on the
inboard end of each flaperon section and one plain hole on the outboard
end. I didn't want any other holes as everything else looked like it
would drain adequately.

Ken

John Peterson wrote:

Hello everyone
Well we had an inspection from MDRA and interestingly enough there were a few questions that we could not answer.

1. What are the flight control travel positions for the a/c on amphibs?? Apparently ours are different than the Murphy manual - not sure what either of those travel positions are - Any help here is appreciated.

2. Is an exterior control required on the doors, with instructions on the opening?
We have the split door with the top folding down. There is no external opening device and I believe that I have seen others like that. The concern expressed was how would a person get into the a/c from the outside if a pilot was inside and not able to open the door/window.

3.Where and how many drain holes are required for the fuselage, wings and flight controls??
We picked up that the a/c does not have drain holes in the rear fuselage, could be important being on floats/amphibs. Not sure about the wing and flight control drains but does anyone know how we could accomplish this.

It was requested if we could provide some kind of supporting documentation for these issues, ideally directly from murphy.

Appreciate assistance on this.
John Peterson 295R

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