O-235 horsepower

[bransom]

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the 0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight
difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R



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[Flying Norwegian]

Hi Ben

I'm not Rick but Hjalmar Rebel 308 ul with a 912 Rotax in it. You must have
clicked on the wrong button

Regards

Hjalmar Bardslokken
Quebec City, Quebec
Canada
----- Original Message -----
From: <bransom@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 12:19 AM
Subject: O-235 horsepower

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I

think I

saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the

0320

isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight
difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R



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[bransom]

Hi Ben
I'm not Rick but Hjalmar Rebel 308

Trying again here ...I mean this to go to Rick Harper on private mode --
forgot to hit private, but still don't know how it ended up going to
Hjalmar. BTW Rick, part of what got me going on this was that I contacted
the person (Gary) you mentioned in Sidney that had just put a WRX 2.0 turbo
in a Mustang. He said his final dry weight was 387. Good grief. Thus my
return to thinking about Lycomings. :)
-Ben

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the 0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight
difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R




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[Wayne G. O'Shea]

It didn't just go to Hjalmar...it went to everyone Ben.

Hjalmar obviously missed his coffee this morning... while working on getting
his Rebel on some skis !! ) Have you got that sorted out yet "flying
Norwegian" ?? )

Wayne


----- Original Message -----
From: <bransom@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 11:55 AM
Subject: O-235 horsepower

Hi Ben
I'm not Rick but Hjalmar Rebel 308

Trying again here ...I mean this to go to Rick Harper on private mode --
forgot to hit private, but still don't know how it ended up going to
Hjalmar. BTW Rick, part of what got me going on this was that I contacted
the person (Gary) you mentioned in Sidney that had just put a WRX 2.0

turbo

in a Mustang. He said his final dry weight was 387. Good grief. Thus my
return to thinking about Lycomings. :)
-Ben

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I

think I

saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the

0320

isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight
difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R




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[Rick Harper]

G'day Ben !

Our 0-235 has/had 9.7:1 compression ratio, and electronic LSE
ignition ... ( we finally figured it was making 130 to 140 HP )

The centre main bearing delaminated at 208 hrs :o( ....

We now have an IO-320 in our Rebel .... with the LSE ignition in it
(should be making 170 - 180 HP now ) ...... going good so far

The 0-320 is only supposed to be 28 Lbs heavier than an 0-235 ..... but
ours has a B & C lightweight starter & lightweight alternator that is
REAR driven off the vacuume pad ... plus a wooden prop ... all this
saves LOTS of weight

Hope this helps !

Rick
----- Original Message -----
From: bransom@dcsol.com
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 4:19 PM
Subject: O-235 horsepower


Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I
think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and
are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the
0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight

difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R



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[Rick Harper]

G'day Ben ...

Sorry for the delay (been out last night at our Sport Aircraft
meeting ) ...

I sent you a reply "direct" .. which you should now have

Yes .... I too wanted to fit something OTHER than a LYCOSAURUS ....
but at the end of the day, when you do the HP vs WEIGHT vs INITIAL
INSTALLATION COST .... the Lycosaurus is nearly impossible to beat :o(

Rick

PS The Rebel is probably a "nicer / sweeter" plane with a good 0-235 in
it ..... but the IO-320 gives
it extra OOOmpfff for those short strips & heavy payloads !

Our Rebel now weighs 1,000 Lbs & will LIFT 1,000 Lbs .... a VERY nice
thing to be able to do (and it's now called a "Rebel PLUS" by the way)

I can carry two large people, ALL their gear & we have enough fuel to
get right across Australia (the same distance as coast to coast in the
US of A) , in less than 2 tankfuls !
----- Original Message -----
From: bransom@dcsol.com
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 3:55 AM
Subject: O-235 horsepower

Hi Ben
I'm not Rick but Hjalmar Rebel 308

Trying again here ...I mean this to go to Rick Harper on private mode
--
forgot to hit private, but still don't know how it ended up going to
Hjalmar. BTW Rick, part of what got me going on this was that I
contacted
the person (Gary) you mentioned in Sidney that had just put a WRX 2.0
turbo
in a Mustang. He said his final dry weight was 387. Good grief.
Thus my
return to thinking about Lycomings. :)
-Ben

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I
think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and
are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the
0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight

difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R




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[Jean Poirier]

Hello Ben

I am not an expert in aircraft engine but I have owned 2 different aircraft
in the last 5 years an d I am building a Rebel too. Earlier this week at
our local RAA chapter meething, we had the visit of Guy-Paul Mongrain of
Aero-Atelier C.M. (engine shop) There is an approuved kit from Lycoming to
make a 0-235 up to 125 hps. But it have to be a O-235 L2C, not a O-235 C or
C1 or C1B. Just to let you know, the parts for the C1B are much more
expensive than L2C (piston ring set are 4 times more expensive!) because no
jobber parts for C1B! I am really not sure yet if I will use a O-235,
O-320 or something else (brand new 125 hps Franklin for $9000.00 usd....
depend if I will stay on wheel/skis as I plan or if I decide to change my
mind for floats. In my area it is easier to find a good O-235 than O-320
(higher TBO) and student crashs 152...!

Jean
Rebel 747R
From: "Rick Harper" <rjwh@optusnet.com.au>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 3:11 PM
Subject: Re: O-235 horsepower

G'day Ben !

Our 0-235 has/had 9.7:1 compression ratio, and electronic LSE
ignition ... ( we finally figured it was making 130 to 140 HP )

The centre main bearing delaminated at 208 hrs :o( ....

We now have an IO-320 in our Rebel .... with the LSE ignition in it
(should be making 170 - 180 HP now ) ...... going good so far

The 0-320 is only supposed to be 28 Lbs heavier than an 0-235 ..... but
ours has a B & C lightweight starter & lightweight alternator that is
REAR driven off the vacuume pad ... plus a wooden prop ... all this
saves LOTS of weight

Hope this helps !

Rick
----- Original Message -----
From: bransom@dcsol.com
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 4:19 PM
Subject: O-235 horsepower


Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I
think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and
are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the
0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight

difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R



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[bransom]

Howdy Rick,
Thanks for the info. I've wondered what electronic ignition does for a Lyc.
LSE is Light Speed Engineering, right? I once checked his web page and he
seems to be pretty conservative in what he claims for improvement. Of course
that is aside from the power you are also getting from higher compression.
Regarding weight, the lighter starter and alternator would also be good in
the O235, keeping the weight diff about the same. But yeah, I'll want the
oomph, somehow. Lately it seems there is just lots of lousy news from Subaru
builders and Lyc has my attention.
Thanks again,
PS: coast to coast on two tanks???!! Holy cow, what is/was your tank
capacity?
-Ben

On 11/17/2004 11:31 AM, RJWH@OPTUSNET.COM.AU wrote to REBEL-BUILDERS:

G'day Ben ...

Sorry for the delay (been out last night at our Sport Aircraft
meeting ) ...

I sent you a reply "direct" .. which you should now have

Yes .... I too wanted to fit something OTHER than a LYCOSAURUS ....
but at the end of the day, when you do the HP vs WEIGHT vs INITIAL
INSTALLATION COST .... the Lycosaurus is nearly impossible to beat :o(

Rick

PS The Rebel is probably a "nicer / sweeter" plane with a good 0-235 in
it ..... but the IO-320 gives
it extra OOOmpfff for those short strips & heavy payloads !

Our Rebel now weighs 1,000 Lbs & will LIFT 1,000 Lbs .... a VERY nice
thing to be able to do (and it's now called a "Rebel PLUS" by the way)

I can carry two large people, ALL their gear & we have enough fuel to
get right across Australia (the same distance as coast to coast in the
US of A) , in less than 2 tankfuls !
----- Original Message -----
From: bransom@dcsol.com
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 3:55 AM
Subject: O-235 horsepower

Hi Ben
I'm not Rick but Hjalmar Rebel 308

Trying again here ...I mean this to go to Rick Harper on private mode
--
forgot to hit private, but still don't know how it ended up going to
Hjalmar. BTW Rick, part of what got me going on this was that I
contacted
the person (Gary) you mentioned in Sidney that had just put a WRX 2.0
turbo
in a Mustang. He said his final dry weight was 387. Good grief.
Thus my
return to thinking about Lycomings. :)
-Ben

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines. I
think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235 and
are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it? I'm
wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say the
0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the weight

difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R




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[Rick Harper]

G'day Ben !
Subject: Re: O-235 horsepower


Howdy Rick,
Thanks for the info. I've wondered what electronic ignition does for
a Lyc.
LSE is Light Speed Engineering, right?

Yep ! .... Jon Johanson (the Aussie who's now flown around the world 3
& 1/2 times in his RV 4) has an engine dyno (and he is the OZ agent for
LSE) .... he says the FIRST LSE unit gives a 15% boost to the HP output
.... and the second gives about 1 (one) more percent !

When you fit an LSE unit , ... it is SO powerful , that when you do
your mag drop tests .... nothing happens when you turn the magneto off !

(Be warned - there is SOME talk of the added "pulse" from the bigger
bang causing metal props to fail !!!!! .................... thats
ANOTHER reason why I run a wooden prop ... wood has hysteresis - "self
dampening properties !

I am now intending to replace the remaining magneto with one of those
"self powering"
E-mags .... gives a BIG capacitor discharge spark - but is totally
seperate from ANY batery / wiring needs within the plane. That way ,
there will be two BIG sparks happening - independant of each other.

My 2 cents worth .... stick to the 0-235 L2c or L1A - both are 8.5:1
compression ratio and give 118 HP .... THEN fit the LSE .... you should
be getting around 130 HP ... (when you use the 9.7:1 pistons - you'll
get 140 HP ... but maybe also get a failed centre main bearing as well !
:o(

I once checked his web page and he
seems to be pretty conservative in what he claims for improvement. Of
course
that is aside from the power you are also getting from higher
compression.
Regarding weight, the lighter starter and alternator would also be
good in
the O235, keeping the weight diff about the same. But yeah, I'll want
the
oomph, somehow. Lately it seems there is just lots of lousy news from
Subaru
builders and Lyc has my attention.
Thanks again,
PS: coast to coast on two tanks???!! Holy cow, what is/was your tank

capacity?

230 litres

At 80 knots - consumption is about 14 lts / hr : a tank full = 1300
plus miles ( and a DEAD ASS !!!)
at 90- 95 knots - consumption is around 18 to 20 lts / hr
at 105 knots - consumption is 35 lts / hr
at 120 KNOTS - consumption is around 50 lts / hr !!! : a tank full =
550 miles :o(

So .................. "Speed COSTS - so how fast do you want to SPEND
!"

Rick

-Ben

On 11/17/2004 11:31 AM, RJWH@OPTUSNET.COM.AU wrote to REBEL-BUILDERS:

G'day Ben ...

Sorry for the delay (been out last night at our Sport Aircraft
meeting ) ...

I sent you a reply "direct" .. which you should now have

Yes .... I too wanted to fit something OTHER than a LYCOSAURUS

....

but at the end of the day, when you do the HP vs WEIGHT vs INITIAL
INSTALLATION COST .... the Lycosaurus is nearly impossible to beat

:o(

Rick

PS The Rebel is probably a "nicer / sweeter" plane with a good 0-235

in

it ..... but the IO-320 gives
it extra OOOmpfff for those short strips & heavy payloads !

Our Rebel now weighs 1,000 Lbs & will LIFT 1,000 Lbs .... a VERY

nice

thing to be able to do (and it's now called a "Rebel PLUS" by the

way)

I can carry two large people, ALL their gear & we have enough fuel

to

get right across Australia (the same distance as coast to coast in

the

US of A) , in less than 2 tankfuls !
----- Original Message -----
From: bransom@dcsol.com
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 3:55 AM
Subject: O-235 horsepower

Hi Ben
I'm not Rick but Hjalmar Rebel 308

Trying again here ...I mean this to go to Rick Harper on private

mode

--
forgot to hit private, but still don't know how it ended up going

to

Hjalmar. BTW Rick, part of what got me going on this was that I
contacted
the person (Gary) you mentioned in Sidney that had just put a WRX

2.0

turbo
in a Mustang. He said his final dry weight was 387. Good grief.

Thus my
return to thinking about Lycomings. :)
-Ben

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines.

I

think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235

and

are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it?

I'm

wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say

the

0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the

weight

difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R




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[Mike Davis]

----- Original Message -----
From: <bransom@dcsol.com>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 9:01 AM
Subject: Re: O-235 horsepower

Rick,
Just wanted to thank you again for the engine info ...the specifics on
fuel
burn rates is good to see too! LSE/Klaus Savier is in California (me too)
and I've seen him and his varieze at fly-ins from time to time. It gives
new
meaning to the term 'experimental' as it truely looks like a flying test
platform for all the stuff he experiments with.
-Ben

G'day Ben !
Subject: Re: O-235 horsepower


Howdy Rick,
Thanks for the info. I've wondered what electronic ignition does for
a Lyc.
LSE is Light Speed Engineering, right?

Yep ! .... Jon Johanson (the Aussie who's now flown around the world 3
& 1/2 times in his RV 4) has an engine dyno (and he is the OZ agent for
LSE) .... he says the FIRST LSE unit gives a 15% boost to the HP output
.... and the second gives about 1 (one) more percent !

When you fit an LSE unit , ... it is SO powerful , that when you do
your mag drop tests .... nothing happens when you turn the magneto off !

(Be warned - there is SOME talk of the added "pulse" from the bigger
bang causing metal props to fail !!!!! .................... thats
ANOTHER reason why I run a wooden prop ... wood has hysteresis - "self
dampening properties !

I am now intending to replace the remaining magneto with one of those
"self powering"
E-mags .... gives a BIG capacitor discharge spark - but is totally
seperate from ANY batery / wiring needs within the plane. That way ,
there will be two BIG sparks happening - independant of each other.

My 2 cents worth .... stick to the 0-235 L2c or L1A - both are 8.5:1
compression ratio and give 118 HP .... THEN fit the LSE .... you should
be getting around 130 HP ... (when you use the 9.7:1 pistons - you'll
get 140 HP ... but maybe also get a failed centre main bearing as well !
:o(

I once checked his web page and he
seems to be pretty conservative in what he claims for improvement. Of
course
that is aside from the power you are also getting from higher
compression.
Regarding weight, the lighter starter and alternator would also be
good in
the O235, keeping the weight diff about the same. But yeah, I'll want
the
oomph, somehow. Lately it seems there is just lots of lousy news from
Subaru
builders and Lyc has my attention.
Thanks again,
PS: coast to coast on two tanks???!! Holy cow, what is/was your tank

capacity?

230 litres

At 80 knots - consumption is about 14 lts / hr : a tank full = 1300
plus miles ( and a DEAD ASS !!!)
at 90- 95 knots - consumption is around 18 to 20 lts / hr
at 105 knots - consumption is 35 lts / hr
at 120 KNOTS - consumption is around 50 lts / hr !!! : a tank full =
550 miles :o(

So .................. "Speed COSTS - so how fast do you want to SPEND
!"

Rick

-Ben

On 11/17/2004 11:31 AM, RJWH@OPTUSNET.COM.AU wrote to REBEL-BUILDERS:

G'day Ben ...

Sorry for the delay (been out last night at our Sport Aircraft
meeting ) ...

I sent you a reply "direct" .. which you should now have

Yes .... I too wanted to fit something OTHER than a LYCOSAURUS

....

but at the end of the day, when you do the HP vs WEIGHT vs INITIAL
INSTALLATION COST .... the Lycosaurus is nearly impossible to beat

:o(

Rick

PS The Rebel is probably a "nicer / sweeter" plane with a good 0-235

in

it ..... but the IO-320 gives
it extra OOOmpfff for those short strips & heavy payloads !

Our Rebel now weighs 1,000 Lbs & will LIFT 1,000 Lbs .... a VERY

nice

thing to be able to do (and it's now called a "Rebel PLUS" by the

way)

I can carry two large people, ALL their gear & we have enough fuel

to

get right across Australia (the same distance as coast to coast in

the

US of A) , in less than 2 tankfuls !
----- Original Message -----
From: bransom@dcsol.com
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 3:55 AM
Subject: O-235 horsepower

Trying again here ...I mean this to go to Rick Harper on private

mode

--
forgot to hit private, but still don't know how it ended up going

to

Hjalmar. BTW Rick, part of what got me going on this was that I
contacted
the person (Gary) you mentioned in Sidney that had just put a WRX

2.0

turbo
in a Mustang. He said his final dry weight was 387. Good grief.

Thus my
return to thinking about Lycomings. :)
-Ben

Hi Rick,
I'm somehow in another one of my rounds of thinking about engines.

I

think I
saw -- maybe on the Murphy Builders list -- that you have an O235

and

are
getting about 130hp out of it. That's more than stock isn't it?

I'm

wondering what you've done to get that bigger HP. Also, people say

the

0320
isn't much more weight. Do you know more specifically what the

weight

difference is between those two engines?
Thanks in advance,
-Ben Ransom/ 496R

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